Mag-fed springers - good idea when shooting PBA?

Hi,

I am looking into getting my first .22 air rifle, after my Daisy 880 is showing a lack of power against the critters that destroy our garden - clearly need something in the range of 15 to 20 fpe. However, due to intending to use it for pest control purposes + backyard target shooting and having neighbors, it also shouldn't be too loud, so some kind of noise suppression is necessary and for this reason .177 won't do, as I'd have to go supersonic there.

And when I look around for things that fit my budget, it turns out that there are some really cheap break barrel options (e.g. Hatsan AirTact, Gamo Wildcat Whisper), and the next group appears to be mag-fed break barrels or underlevers.

So I am wondering, are these even an option for me? One issue is that I want to minimize the amount of lead in my garden, and thus would prefer shooting mostly PBA at targets.

Now I am aware that some pellets in the lead-free area have rather odd shapes and sizes - e.g. the Crosman PowerShot Gold Flight is extremely long and barely fits in my Daisy 880 breech, and the Gamo Luxor Cu is just crazy (BTW: not recommending, it behaves aerodynamically just the way it looks), I would assume that I will get problems with the magazines rather early than late. But as one example, with Gamo I can't get the Maxxim or Fusion noise suppression and the recoil reducing rail without also getting the magazine.

So I wonder, can some or all of these also be fed without using the mag, if necessary because either my mag broke or the pellets are simply too big? Or is that impossible or dangerous? Does this differ between manufacturers, or if it's a breakbarrel, I can just use it with the mag removed and insert pellets into the breech by hand or pellet pen? If this does not work conveniently, I can at least already strike out anything with a mag from my list (and might then go with the Hatsan AIrTact, as it also has open sights so the scope isn't a single point of failure, and if it breaks, it wasn't expensive anyway).
 
The best non lead pellets for target and small game hunting use are the predator GTOs. I have hunted with them often and they are very accurate. The .177s are 6.8gr and the .22 are 11.8gr.

Unless your list of garden pests includes raccoons, 10-12fpe is plenty of power if your shot is accurate.

Noise suppression on Gamos is a gimmick. The noise with springers is mechanical, not muzzle blast, and typically varies with power level and whether or not the gun has been tuned.

For the use you describe, I think you’ll be happier over the long run with something like an hw50s or hw95 in either .117 or .22.

If you really need quiet, an entry level PCP may be the better option.

Good luck choosing.
R
 
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I was actually wondering if what I really want is an entry level PCP, but it worries me how much pumping it takes (which I would certainly want to do by hand/foot so I can recharge anywhere). OTOH, if I can stay in prone for a whole group, it would definitively make target shooting more fun, even when not using a repeater as long as the breech is not horribly inconvenient to reach (and I assume it won't get worse than the Daisy 880 there with its nasty BB feeding hole in there).

As for how many fpe I need - well, for quite a while the Daisy 880 was sufficient, it reliably downed chipmunks, squirrels and rabbits from 5 to 10 meters - but when I had to euthanize a weasel stuck in a snap trap in the basement, I was shocked to have needed multiple point blank hits till it was really dead. Poor weasel (although my empathy is limited as this was right after a weasel killed four of my chickens, possibly the same weasel). So I would like to go into the range of "advertised 900 to 1000 fps with .22 alloy pellets", which probably means real 800 to 900 fps and is well below the sound barrier.

As for sound level I want - my other air rifle - which I started with - is a Red Ryder, which sounds rather loud especially when cocking it (and feels louder to me than the Powerline 880, but that might be just me). OTOH about 2 miles away is a gun range and thus everyone around here knows what a powderburner sounds like (is still very audible from that far away) - as long as my airgun can't be confused with one, I guess it isn't too loud yet :)
 
Have to agree with EMeider, an HW50 either in .177 or .22 (if shooting under 30 yds) will do the job. If it’s squirrels or chipmunks even an HW30 in .177 will do just fine. Stay away from Gamos if you don’t want an over powered spray and pray rifle.

PS. You may get lucky with a Hatsan, some are great others are lemons.

-Marty
 
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Yeah, with the cheap Gamos what scares me most is the lack of open sights. So if (or once) there is a problem with the scope or the rail, that's basically it.

Accuracy wise I am right now happy with the Daisy 880 - I still need to improve my hold, but I do shoot as accurately as I can hold it right now (according to how the target moves below the crosshair) so the rifle is not the limiting factor, at least not yet.

HW30 seems to be the same power level so that does not seem convincing. So I guess right now it is - either roll the dice with the Hatsan AirTact QE, or entry level PCP it is.

If only I could know the sound level in advance... ;)
 
I had actually considered that one but discarded it from my list as it only does 800fps - like my current one. Multi-pump is nice for my use case as for target practice I can keep the power down (also conserves the pellet trap) and remember holdovers for different distances and pump counts.

However how much does it actually achieve - like has anyone measured it? For my Daisy I found no pellet where it exceeds 700fps. But it also has the F in pentagon sign on it that should assert it is limited to 7.5J, but I do get above that up to 11J with some pellets :)

I mean - if it can actually get close to 800fps when needed, it's probably just fine for me.
 

Hm... so they got 18 fpe out of it. And the magazine part seems optional, so if a pellet doesn't work with it, I can feed it manually. That indeed sounds like what I really want. Pumping 15 times might be a bit slow when hunting small game, but from the measurements there 10 times packs quite a punch already. Do need to break it in - also good to know.

Thanks, this actually sounds like a good recommendation - so I guess it is this vs entry level PCPs now. About those... AFAIK I can't keep a PCP in the cabinet fully charged, so I would need to charge it before every use, not after - that sounds a bit inconvenient when it is 11pm and I just got an alert from my wifi camera that a rabbit is munching around in my garden.
 
Seneca Dragonfly2 in .22 is what you seek. Mag-fed or single shot, multi-pump, quiet, and powerful. Barrel has a threaded adapter that a moderator spins right on. My neighbors dont even hear me shooting. Watch some Youtube videos.
I agree totally with this , anything over 650 FPS and .177 should dispatch the critters you describe it you read about it 4 or 5 pumps and your ready for Squirrels at your distances .
 
Sounds good - one thing though, is more of a wishlist thing than anything else - any chance one can mount a scope on the so one can stll use the open sights? Seems like there is such a thing as see through high scope rings.

Thinking of something like https://www.amazon.com/Monstrum-Dovetail-Profile-See-Through-Diameter/dp/B09KMD51Z8 - is that 1 inch height of the see through area enough to use the sights despite the magazine requiring a higher rear sight?

Because that way I can use sights at short distance against critters, and scope at long distance against targets or far critters, and don't need to sight in again when switching (this is annoying me with my Powerline 880 as I can't see anything through the scope below 5m). I am aware that holdovers tend to get larger when the scope is farther from the barrel but that is something one can get used to. Also the extra height would benefit me in prone.
 
If PCP is an option for you the .22 M-Rod is very quiet and single hole accurate within 25-30 yards. My first PCP. Another option would be a Pistol PCP with a carbine stock added. The P-rod and the Diana Bandit (others as well) are both in the 12 fpe range and good for 25 yards easy. The reservoirs are also small enough for pretty fast hand pumping. Here's my Diana with the Buck Rail AR conversion stock.
IMG_0012.JPG
 
Also, what do people think about red dots? Are they good enough for mean distances of like 0.6 mil (i.e. 5-group size around 1.5 to 2 cm at 10 meters)?

Like, I shudder at all the extra stuff I need for the Seneca Dragonfly Mk2 just so I can have a scope for >10m and still use open sights for short distance, and I am not even convinced that these see through rings with high offset aren't gonna ruin the scope adjustment all the time, when it appears like this much smaller device can solve all my problems at a way lower price. An obvious problem of red dots is that there will be a parallax problem as the dot won't be projected to the same distance as my target is at, but that issue should be smaller the closer I keep the dot in the center.
 
Looks good so far. The issues with scope attachment still worry me, so I am waiting for my red dot first. If that works for my eyes, we have a winner - the Dragonfly. Multi pump means I can keep my pellet trap, which is nice.

Can anyone convince me off the Crosman Diamondback SBD NP Elite? Pyramidair says it is one of the most silent ones, and the specs meet my needs - but as I am gonna shoot PBA, will it get too close to the sound barrier to be silent? Also, the only reviewer who chrony'd it found it way underpowered, actually below the Dragonfly... sus...

And of course there is the Hatsan lottery. I now understand that if I want to play that, I may as well get a refurb - less money lost if it is a lemon :)

One other thing also makes me tend towards the multi pump - I may at some point want a powder burner, and I heard that springers encourage some things that would be bad habits with powder (the artillery hold).
 
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