Most successful FT guns

JEFROX said:

You don't care about the people? The "winning" is done by the people, just so you know. These rifles don't shoot on its own. Someone has to actually hold the rifle, look through the scope, and pull the trigger.

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If someone is able to compile the data, we'll find that a very skilled shooter winning with a crap rifle is going to be a rare occurrence.

Or, put in another way, most of the wins in field target have been (and will continue to be done) with a high-end rifle, typically with a quality barrel from a name we will all recognize as high-end.

Much more credit needs given to the guns than most are willing to admit to. I've lent my USFT to three different first-time field target shooters, and all three finished near the top of the heap that day (Larry F, Steve Q, and Will M. in case any of them are reading this). Steve Q was only down one shot from a perfect score if I remember correctly. Let me say that again, Steve shows up to a match, has NEVER shot a ft match before. I lend him my rifle for the weekend. He practices and figures out his own dope during Friday afternoon. He shoots a 47/48 the next morning. The other two guys were something like 55/60 and 49/56 if memory serves. Still quite respectable scores for first-time competitors in a game where supposedly most of the credit needs to go to the shooter and not the gear. Not to take everything away from those three, they're all great shots, but they were each green as can be in field target and the greenness wasn't an issues, providing they had a high-performance rifle in their hands.

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JEFROX said:

Did you read the original post? I don't think you understood it correctly. The OP wanted a list of "Most successful FT guns." What you want to know, and please correct me if I'm wrong, is what gun is best designed, or most accurate, or best overall gun for FT. The two are not the same.

Also, you don't need to compile a list to figure out if a gun is crap. You'll know right away that it's crap by the multiple complaints from the reviews. And a skilled shooter, winning with a crap rifle, proves my point.

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I did read the original post, which I took as the OP simply wondering what guns have track records of winning FT matches.

I was wondering why you were trying to make it about the people a couple of posts ago, which prompted me to reply how I did about the trigger puller (the "people") not mattering as much as the gun.

Franklink,
Don't really want to step on this thread some more but I can't help saying:

You make a good point about it being more "the gun" and not always so much "the person"
Take me, for instance, at my second ever FT match and you were gracious enough to let me use your Mac-1 to shoot the (July 2021 Luna, NM) FT match because I had not purchased a suitable gun for FT yet.
Folks, I'm a newbie, not a seasoned airgun veteran. Was just a part time plinker and then my buddies talked me into trying FT in 2021. Now I'm hooked!
My first ever FT match in June 2021 at Luna, NM (another borrowed gun) Rex let me shoot with him and his RAW TM rifle.
Here's what I shot from that 2nd ever FT match for me (cut and pasted from the July 2021 match report). I shot a 51 out of 60 targets that day.

Thanks for concrete details Larry.

Memory was a bit fuzzy. So it was your second match and my memory wasn't perfect on the score either, although 51/60 is nothing to sniff at, for a second match. And we don't set easy courses over there in Luna!

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JEFROX said:

Not trying to make it about the people at all. It's just that you can't ignore the people since it's the people that make these guns successful. Just because you have the best, most expensive, most exotic, ultra custom gun, doesn't mean you'll become successful. That's just not the case.

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Agreed.

I've seen some people with top of the line stuff that repeatedly don't finish at the top. Since you want to discuss the human impact on scores I'm just stating the fact that a skilled shooter can't shoot any better than his gun is capable of. Or, in other words, if the gun ain't capable, doesn't matter how good the shooter is, he still won't win. Which makes the argument that the gun should get more credit than it does mutually inclusive to that reality.

Cole,
Sorry everyone for getting so off subject, but.....
From the match report:
We didn't figure up a Troyer but this seemed like one of the more difficult ones to me. I think it was a pdog and on lane 2 or 3. Must have been about 3/4 inch kz out there quite a ways. Memory a bit fuzzy on distance but I'm thinking it was north of 40 yards.


So, how does a newbie hit stuff like this and hang with some of the best shooters in the Southwest?
I know it isn't my god given natural abilities LOL, so it must have been.............the gun?

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@SAZ, I looked up Steve Q's results from his first ever match, using my USFT. He shot a 38/40 (in July of 2018), so memory was fuzzy there too. The next match he shot at (near as I can tell from match reports) was in June of 2019 where he used his Marauder and scored a 36/48. Pretty good example of comparing two different guns from the same shooter

JEFROX said:

I get your point, Frank. But what you're looking for, and what the OP is looking for, are two different things.

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lol, YOU made it about the people when you said, "You don't care about the people? The "winning" is done by the people, just so you know. These rifles don't shoot on their own. Someone has to actually hold the rifle, look through the scope, and pull the trigger." Post # 40 in this discussion.

I'm fully aware that cavedweller was originally interested in simply seeing a list of the most successful field target guns. I'm also interested in the same thing as cavedweller, since I give more weight to the gun's impact on a final score than the shooter's influence has.

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Rapid Air Weapons "RAW" TM-1000 "Custom", Barrel by Weihrauch in .20 cal, Highly modified by Motorheads AG, Optics MTC/Optisan
8) HFT State Championship titles
2) Nationals HFT titles
2) National HFT Gran Prix titles

Rifle is a phenomenal shooter stated by those who have spent a bit of trigger time behind it.
Tho said the rifle generally shoots where pointed & IF NOT pointed to the correct place ... it does little good

Rifle AND Shooter need to have there act together to play at a consistently high level !!
* Maintenance of the equipment is just as important as a healthy operator ..... Every time all the time best one can.

So there's one rifle with credentials ... tho as mentioned previous, Factory stock guns or modified is a personal choice one can make freely.

JEFROX said:

Define success, Frank.

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I feel a bit like General Ackbar in responding but I'll start by quoting the OP.

"I wonder if anyone has compiled the stats to determine the most successful FT rifles and pistols?
For example how often does an FX M3 win an FT match, or a Steyr or a walther?"

So, @cavedweller was thinking we could look at how often certain guns win FT matches as helpful "to help determine the most successful FT rifles and pistols."

So, determining which guns are shot for winning scores seems a reasonable proxy for "success" when we're looking at field target.

Having been around the FT game for enough years & mentally noting those rifles shot by top scoring shooters ... here whats coming off the top of the old noggin ... Older to new as remembered. and in no way a complete or all inclusive list
PCP's
Daystate CR97 & CRX
USFT both Big tube & Hunter versions
STEYR Lg 100 & 110
Air arms EV2 & Evolution
Theoben Rapids / MFR
RAW
Benjamin Marauders
Thomas
Daystate Air/Red wolf
Some others too ...

Spring Piston

HW 77 / 97 / 95 / 98
Air Arms TX200 & HC
Air Arms Pro Sport

These are some the top guns we generally see ... Some are OBSOLETE, some Not .... Great guns die hard !! and will get used well past there manufacture deaths ... Got parts ? Many of these legions of old keep on shootin !

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JEFROX said:

How would you know about the winner's rifle without looking up who won first?



Okay, so we base success by the number of wins.

Let's pretend that the MAC1 USFT has the very best design of all the available FT rifles out there. What do you think are the chances of this FT rifle to be the most successful?

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From this time forward ... nearly NONE !!
The USFT had it's time where it was the king of the hill, sadly those times have passed with more modern designs getting purchased and shot by some of this sports most elite shooters ... enter the THOMAS.

Thats not saying a USFT can't hang with the best out there to this day because they CAN !!
Just not as many being shot these days so the odds are really low .... IMO

Now to PLAY YOUR PRETEND ..... If the rifle had it all and there were more of them being shot at high profile shoots .... Yea odds would be stacked in its favor ... Now read preceding paragraph and get real about it.

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JEFROX said:

Exactly my point - thank you!

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Not sure WHAT that point is/was ?

If in support of an idea the USFT is the Cats Meow of FT hardware ... Great rifles, but IMO nope.

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