ELR Coyote , How Far Would You Go ?

Shooting Targets · Oct 27, 2023

ELR Coyote , How Far Would You Go ?

Extreme Long Ranger Shooters I have a question for you about what you would consider the longest shot you could ethically take on a coyote ?
I am curious with follow up questions.
1. What Caliber ?
2. What Rifle ?
3. Heavily Modded ?
4. Max Distance ?
5. Ammo and BC ?
6. Curious on how accurately you feel you need to judge range , You need to be +1,-1 one yard ....

You guys do some fine long range shooting, I just kind of want to hear from the more discipline long range shooters of what could be possible.

Jaydog.

Ezana4CE · Oct 27, 2023

If you’re able to posses a firearm, get one paired with varmint rounds to pick off coyotes at long distances.

Shooting Targets · Oct 27, 2023

Yep, I have a .223, I am just curious since most of the ELR guys are crack shots what they think is the max range?

Vetmx · Oct 27, 2023

The words Ethics and coyotes usually don’t go in the same sentence. I shoot them every year with whatever weapon I have. Including my truck. With an airgun and long range, I would use my .25 slug gun shooting a 32gr at 1,045fps out to 250 yards. All shots would be for the boiler room. Bigger kill zone and bigger guarantee of a dead coyote. I never go for the head because they are so elusive that when an opportunity arises, I want them dead. Even if they run off. They are not a game animal.

Ezana4CE · Oct 27, 2023

@Shooting Targets I’m no crack shot, but getting close is the name of the game. With our gun’s, ballistics and ethics become more of a concern with longer distances for me. I also think that folks in areas with a lot of open space would be the ones to maybe respond. I’ve read many coyote hunting posts on AGN and I don’t recall reading any very long shots on coyotes. Maybe @davidsng had one of the longer shots and he didn’t recover the dog. It ran off from what I recall.

Edit: and that fast you got two differing opinions.

Vetmx · Oct 28, 2023

I don’t want to come across as being too harsh but when you see them running around with baby deer in their mouths that momma just dropped, I show them the same mercy. An airgun is definitely not my number one choice for them. My coyote gun is a 6mm.

Ezana4CE · Oct 28, 2023

Vetmx said:
I don’t want to come across as being too harsh but when you see them running around with baby deer in their mouths that momma just dropped, I show them the same mercy. An airgun is definitely not my number one choice for them. My coyote gun is a 6mm.

@Vetmx I don’t want to be responsible for a wounded predator lurking. I certainly don’t want to be stalking through the brush and happen upon a yote I’ve (or someone else) recently wounded. In my area rabies and brucellosis are also concerning so I have to be mindful not to headshot certain animals, but to still be sure they’re down if I take the shot(s). In addition, I too am a predator, but I have been taught certain things. I try not to ascribe many human traits to animals. In their world I don’t know what the equivalent of ethics are. It very well may just be like us walking into a buffet to eat when wild predators take advantage of prey animals.

Anyhow, I’m just saying I realize we have different ways of thinking about this. In the event that an animal I’m personally responsible for was harmed or killed by a predator then it’s a different story. Prey animals are here for a reason as far as I’m concerned. Being eaten alive or killed and eaten isn’t pretty no matter how you slice it in my eyes. I think my mind has been conditioned to view certain methods as preferable over others.

200+ yards is nothing to scoff at. After giving it more thought, I think @jwrabbit123 had the longest shot behind yours (with an Evol) that I recall. I’m not sure how long @wyshadow has taken his shots from. I’d like to hear their input in response to some of the original questions.

MysticalDragon · Oct 28, 2023

Vetmx said:
I don’t want to come across as being too harsh but when you see them running around with baby deer in their mouths that momma just dropped, I show them the same mercy. An airgun is definitely not my number one choice for them. My coyote gun is a 6mm.

Why should that matter? They are doing what nature intended them to do, to keep a balance. Nature can be cruel and brutal at times. We have softened to that in this day and age.

No animal should suffer, whether game animal, pest, predator or even bugs. They act according to design and instinct as nature intended. We should be responsible to ensure as little suffering as possible with clean kills and limit wounding/maiming any animal as much as possible.

markhooper · Oct 28, 2023

MysticalDragon said:
Why should that matter? They are doing what nature intended them to do, to keep a balance. Nature can be cruel and brutal at times. We have softened to that in this day and age.

No animal should suffer, whether game animal, pest, predator or even bugs. They act according to design and instinct as nature intended. We should be responsible to ensure as little suffering as possible with clean kills and limit wounding/maiming any animal as much as possible.

your thinking is good.. myself I've been personally responsible for my herd of 80+ cows and the neighbors 100 cow calf pairs.. I don't like killing anything, well except for ground squirrels and rattlesnake.. ,id probably take a shot with my air rifle up to 160 yards.. jsb redesigned heavy..after that it's a guess where it hits.. and past that i still would probably take the end off the shroud and aim clear and just fire a warning shot..
now powder guns, shot a coyote at 150-200 with my 17 golden boy and he took off like a rocket.. hit right behind the front shoulder and thought I missed.. found him the next day around 50 yards away and it looked like a 22 hit him and a 357 out the other side.. huge hole..
another time a friend was with me and there was my neighbor cow fighting off 3 coyotes and not being such.. they were close and I told grabbed the 357 lever action since they were close but I got the 22 golden boy.. shot one dead.. the other one disappeared into the brush and lost sight of him.. but the last one ran down the fence along our driveway and I couldn't shoot because he was in line with the neighbors house roof, so he got to the street and went along that fence and when he got to a dip in the land and no traffic since he was along the road, I set my sights as hi as they would click and then compensated extra and pulled about 30 ft leed and fired.. just a couple feet low.. second shot was just in front of him and third shot in the front shoulder and he just dropped.. just lowly 22 high velocity..
I honestly don't know how far I shot.. but it had to be over a 1/4 mile because he was farther away from the driveway and the driveway was 1)4 mile
now I wish I could translate that with my air rifle.. just for target shooting..my air rifle looses it at 170.. need to try slugs but I currently don't have enough range yet.. wondering what slug, regulator pressure and hammer adjustment it would tat, if possible on a avenger X..
so is it possible to set up a rifle to shoot that far..
to be clear, I moved since then and don't have cows to watch... just wanted long range shooting.. I don't use a scope like that.. can't see the target because of the compensation.. just plain open sights.
Mark

Vetmx · Oct 28, 2023

MysticalDragon said:
Why should that matter? They are doing what nature intended them to do, to keep a balance. Nature can be cruel and brutal at times. We have softened to that in this day and age.

No animal should suffer, whether game animal, pest, predator or even bugs. They act according to design and instinct as nature intended. We should be responsible to ensure as little suffering as possible with clean kills and limit wounding/maiming any animal as much as possible.

The deer in the one state I hunt and where I’m currently typing this from never dealt with a coyote until 2003. The coyotes were introduced here by man. I’m with you on the we this and the we that concerning all animals except coyotes. I’m doing what nature has intended me to do. And I’m not alone. They are bad news and no amount of hunters ethical or unethical can eradicate them. They are too smart. But I’m not giving one a free pass because my shot isn’t perfect. But I do my best to place my shot where it will no longer be roaming earth.

Vetmx · Oct 28, 2023

Ezana4CE said:
@Vetmx I don’t want to be responsible for a wounded predator lurking. I certainly don’t want to be stalking through the brush and happen upon a yote I’ve (or someone else) recently wounded. In my area rabies and brucellosis are also concerning so I have to be mindful not to headshot certain animals, but to still be sure they’re down if I take the shot(s). In addition, I too am a predator, but I have been taught certain things. I try not to ascribe many human traits to animals. In their world I don’t know what the equivalent of ethics are. It very well may just be like us walking into a buffet to eat when wild predators take advantage of prey animals.

Anyhow, I’m just saying I realize we have different ways of thinking about this. In the event that an animal I’m personally responsible for was harmed or killed by a predator then it’s a different story. Prey animals are here for a reason as far as I’m concerned. Being eaten alive or killed and eaten isn’t pretty no matter how you slice it in my eyes. I think my mind has been conditioned to view certain methods as preferable over others.

200+ yards is nothing to scoff at. After giving it more thought, I think @jwrabbit123 had the longest shot behind yours (with an Evol) that I recall. I’m not sure how long @wyshadow has taken his shots from. I’d like to hear their input in response to some of the original questions.

If you don’t want to wound a coyote, use a firearm. A wounded coyote does not somehow become a man eater. They are not lions. Once sick, they retreat to places we can’t get to them until they expire. And they might get a little help from their fellow coyotes.

MysticalDragon · Oct 28, 2023

Vetmx said:
The deer in the one state I hunt and where I’m currently typing this from never dealt with a coyote until 2003. The coyotes were introduced here by man. I’m with you on the we this and the we that concerning all animals except coyotes. I’m doing what nature has intended me to do. And I’m not alone. They are bad news and no amount of hunters ethical or unethical can eradicate them. They are too smart. But I’m not giving one a free pass because my shot isn’t perfect. But I do my best to place my shot where it will no longer be roaming earth.

Regardless of where and how they were introduced, its not right to take poor shots, regardless of the animal. Would you want someone shooting you to leave you wounded or maimed because they felt you shouldnt be there?

I'm not saying its wrong to eradicate pests or animals causing harm, but that we should be doing it as humanely as possible. Just because we don't like a creature doesnt mean that we shouldnt be humane about dealing with them.

Smitty911 · Oct 28, 2023

Vetmx said:
I don’t want to come across as being too harsh but when you see them running around with baby deer in their mouths that momma just dropped, I show them the same mercy. An airgun is definitely not my number one choice for them. My coyote gun is a 6mm.

So you're mad because the Yote didn't let it grow up for you to shoot and eat? Hmmmmmm

(I do like venison myself)

I have them in a field at the end of my street, they don't come on my land after my dogs/wife/etc. they can do what God intended.

Smitty

Ezana4CE · Oct 28, 2023

Vetmx said:
If you don’t want to wound a coyote, use a firearm. A wounded coyote does not somehow become a man eater. They are not lions. Once sick, they retreat to places we can’t get to them until they expire. And they might get a little help from their fellow coyotes.

@Vetmx These are not my words, nor did insinuate these ideas. When I mentioned being eaten alive, perhaps I wasn’t clear. I was referring to predators eating prey animals (i.e. some kill first then eat, other catch prey and begin eating while the animal is still alive. Some do both). I go places that people I know who live around me do not. As a result, I see and encounter things that people that I know in my area do not. I’ve encountered various animals in different places and I’m not enthusiastic about being bitten or scratched by a scared and injured animal that has the ability to transmit something I can live without. I spoke about what I’m concerned about. As far as I know, you and I live in different areas and we obviously have different views. I don’t have an issue with that. Furthermore, I don’t have a reason to shoot at coyotes long range. Your suggestion me reads like my suggestion to the OP in post #2.

drsquall · Oct 28, 2023

Every animal deserves respect and to lob bullets out long distance hoping you hit it is wrong no matter the caliber. I personally wouldn't shoot past 100 to 125 yards on a coyote. Shooting targets and steel is two different things and taking your time while you're doing it is another thing. When you call coyotes it can happen really fast when they come in giving the opportunity you have to take it quickly. Being a good long range shot on steel don't mean squat when it comes to hunting and people need to realize that. I get sick and tired of people saying I'm a great long range shot, yeah when you got the time to range it and dial off your bench. Keep your expertise on the target range and don't wound animals. Use the correct tool for the job and an Air Rifle doing maybe 200/300 foot pounds of energy at the muzzle should not be shot at a coyote at long-distance. and if you're one of those guys that set up for long-distance on purpose to see what you can do to a live animal that's not hunting in my opinion it's shooting and don't come hunting with me because you're not welcome.

wyshadow · Oct 28, 2023

I grow up farming and ranching. My dad and uncles would lose calves almost every year to coyotes and wild dogs. They factor in losing thousands of dollars every year to coyotes. So I understand why my dad and uncles hate coyotes with a passion. They would shoot at a coyote with anything on hand and at any distance. If they got a hit, that was good enough.

Knowing this, I try not to judge what other shooters do for pest animals. For me personally, if I had a good rest and know my yardages around me, I wouldn't hesitate to take a 75 yard shot with a pcp. My caliber of choice is a .25 cal. Lucky most of my kills were mostly under 50 yards using my thermals.

Vetmx · Oct 28, 2023

Smitty911 said:
So you're mad because the Yote didn't let it grow up for you to shoot and eat? Hmmmmmm (I do like venison myself)

I have them in a field at the end of my street, they don't come on my land after my dogs/wife/etc. they can do what God intended.

Smitty

Actually I don’t shoot doe very often. I do if there is an abundance of them but that hasn’t happened at my place since the fawn survival rate has been drastically reduced by the coyote. The coyotes have taken the need for hunters/sportsmen almost out of the equation. Right now if I allowed the hunters that hunt my place to go on a normal tag filling killing spree, we would be in trouble. I’ve noticed the bigger age gaps amongst the doe population affecting other things. All of the doe where I live now drop their fawns in our neighborhood. There is no predadation there. It’s cool to see moms with their babies hanging around but now we are over browsed and have ticks. They have changed things and definitely not for the better. As a hunter, anything less than a clean kill on anything is a failure and cause for evaluation. Same goes for a coyote but I just don’t beat myself up or put as much thought into it if things don’t go perfectly.

wyshadow · Oct 28, 2023

About 4 years ago, I remember telling my dad they were trying to pass a law to make competition coyote hunting illegal. If they past this law, it gives them the chance to make all of coyote hunting illegal. My dad thought that was the dumbest idea and said these people sound like they never once stepped outside.
He told me of a coyote incident that happened about ten years ago. My dad had a missing cow they couldn't find. He called several of his cousins if they have seen this cow and he got a tip a cow was seen walking along rocky boulders. My dad and my older brother found the cow trying to get out of dead end. When they walked up the cow, the cow charged them. What had happened was the cow's face was torn to shreds by coyotes. A pack of coyotes chewed off it's nose, its ears, and both eyes. Part of its intestines were dragging on the ground. My dad had to shot the cow on the spot. They had to call the game warden to report cattle attack by coyotes. When the game warden came and saw what happened, he couldn't keep from crying at what this cow had to endure. The game warden reported a coyote problem in the area, and the state hired a professional hunter to reduce the coyote population.
My dad took this cow's death the hardest because he bottle raised this cow and had given him two calves before it was killed. Stories like this are very common with ranchers.

Ezana4CE · Oct 28, 2023

I think the replies here make for great discourse. Expecially since this won’t be the last time the question will be asked. @drsquall made an excellent point about targe my shooting vs shooting live animals. I used to think differently about shooting coyotes until I had a chance to hunt them observe them on camera. I recall being called to a ranch to get after some coyotes. Come to find out all they did was show up, they weren’t bothering the livestock. I got to observe the livestock day and night while hunting yotes on that place. I learned that the mother cows didn’t seem afraid of the yotes and at least one of the horses would run them down and attempt to stomp them. I did see evidence that they ate deer and small animals. On the the place where I was working nuisance beavers I’d catch them on camera doing similar things I’d seen on the ranch.

I have yet to see one killing livestock. I have seen and killed feral dogs that killed livestock and poultry. My reaction was to shoot with what ever is on-hand. I recall seeing what I thought was a coyote in my chicken coop as I exited the garage. I reached in and grabbed one of the first things I found that was suitable to defend my hens - an ax. I ran over and jumped into the coop to find a dog eating one of my laying hens. I burred them both. So I do understand the sentiment of wanting defend against predation. I’ve just learned that taking long distance airgun shots isn’t necessary for me especially considering the way parcels of land are laid out and considering the animal behavior I’ve been able to witness I recall conversing with some members here about large groups of coyotes. I have yet to see a large group. I’ve seen solitary yotes and pairs mostly around me. I hear what sounds like a pack from time to time, but I’ve never seen one in person where I live. I’ve spoken with a rancher a couple hours north and he had what sounded like a serious issue with yotes hunting his calves. He had a nice swath of pastureland too, so I could see 200 yards shots being necessary there considering the problem and lay of the land.

I don’t practice shooting at long distances with my airguns much. I don’t know why there seems to be a recent fascination on AGN with shooting animals at long distances with airguns (I think I understand the prairie dog thing), but if there is no need to or there are better tools, why not use what’s most effective and at your disposal?

Reading @wyshadow’s post helped me decide to submit this post.

drsquall · Oct 28, 2023

Ezana4CE said:
I think the replies here make for great discourse. Expecially since this won’t be the last time the question will be asked. @drsquall made an excellent point about targe my shooting vs shooting live animals. I used to think differently about shooting coyotes until I had a chance to hunt them observe them on camera. I recall being called to a ranch to get after some coyotes. Come to find out all they did was show up, they weren’t bothering the livestock. I got to observe the livestock day and night while hunting yotes on that place. I learned that the mother cows didn’t seem afraid of the yotes and at least one of the horses would run them down and attempt to stomp them. I did see evidence that they ate deer and small animals. On the the place where I was working nuisance beavers I’d catch them on camera doing similar things I’d seen on the ranch.

I have yet to see one killing livestock. I have seen and killed feral dogs that killed livestock and poultry. My reaction was to shoot with what ever is on-hand. I recall seeing what I thought was a coyote in my chicken coop as I exited the garage. I reached in and grabbed one of the first things I found that was suitable to defend my hens - an ax. I ran over and jumped into the coop to find a dog eating one of my laying hens. I burred them both. So I do understand the sentiment of wanting defend against predation. I’ve just learned that taking long distance airgun shots isn’t necessary for me especially considering the way parcels of land are laid out and considering the animal behavior I’ve been able to witness I recall conversing with some members here about large groups of coyotes. I have yet to see a large group. I’ve seen solitary yotes and pairs mostly around me. I hear what sounds like a pack from time to time, but I’ve never seen one in person where I live. I’ve spoken with a rancher a couple hours north and he had what sounded like a serious issue with yotes hunting his calves. He had a nice swath of pastureland too, so I could see 200 yards shots being necessary there considering the problem and lay of the land.

I don’t practice shooting at long distances with my airguns much. I don’t know why there seems to be a recent fascination on AGN with shooting animals at long distances with airguns (I think I understand the prairie dog thing), but if there is no need to or there are better tools, why not use what’s most effective and at your disposal?

Reading @wyshadow’s post helped me decide to submit this post.

I don't understand it either. People brag about getting so many foot of energy with their Air Rifle shooting slugs. They still pale in comparison to centerfire round. I don't care if you have 500fpe, a 9mm has 350, a 223 which some people thinks it's to weak for coyotes is 1200fpe at the muzzle. Don't say well I got a bigger slug

Use the right weapon for its intended purpose

ELR Coyote , How Far Would You Go ?

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