100 yard shooting - .177 vs .20 cal vs .22

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Kragman1

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Aug 31, 2021
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New England, United States
Hi all,

I'm seriously considering a new HW97k in .20 primarily for 100 yard, benched shooting. No competition, just smaller and smaller hard targets (think KYL/spinners) and the occasion fun session of slowly turning leftover clay pigeons into little specks. 👍

I do some of that now, as time permits. I find that I prefer .22 over .177 in the same powerplants (typically HW95/R9's or D34's) but I have to think that .20 cal would be some improvement over both.

Of course, I could be romanticizing that!
You all know that there are differing opinions of .20 caliber. I'm expecting much better wind drift than .177, and a small improvement in drift and drop vs .22.
That's with an estimated .20 cal energy level that is very similar to known .22 levels. I don't have a good read on what to expect from .20, other than to slot it right in the middle of .177 & .22....

Anyway, for those of you that have been down the .20 cal road, please chime in.
To me, its really .20 vs .22, but I'd like to hear all sides...

One thing to mention - I'm not worried about the limited pellet selection/availability/cost issue at all.

Thanks all!
 
Kragman1 said:
Hi all,

I'm seriously considering a new HW97k in .20 primarily for 100 yard, benched shooting. No competition, just smaller and smaller hard targets (think KYL/spinners) and the occasion fun session of slowly turning leftover clay pigeons into little specks. 👍

I do some of that now, as time permits. I find that I prefer .22 over .177 in the same powerplants (typically HW95/R9's or D34's) but I have to think that .20 cal would be some improvement over both.

Of course, I could be romanticizing that!
You all know that there are differing opinions of .20 caliber. I'm expecting much better wind drift than .177, and a small improvement in drift and drop vs .22.
That's with an estimated .20 cal energy level that is very similar to known .22 levels. I don't have a good read on what to expect from .20, other than to slot it right in the middle of .177 & .22....

Anyway, for those of you that have been down the .20 cal road, please chime in.
To me, its really .20 vs .22, but I'd like to hear all sides...

One thing to mention - I'm not worried about the limited pellet selection/availability/cost issue at all.

Thanks all!
Click to expand...
Well I shot these this morning with my crown in 25 cal8ber. With budget snowpeak pellets. 7$ a tin. They are 5 shot groups at 100 yards.

20240923_074408.jpg


20240923_074358.jpg


20240923_074350.jpg
 
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Exactly guys - not for competition, simply for the challenge. And it is a FUN challenge to me. I have been having a ball with a couple of other rifles, but I keep thinking an R1 in 20.... but I always return to a fixed barrel rifle for that, which takes me to the 97.
It doesn't hurt that I have a brand new 97k in .177 with a gorgeous walnut stock, and I think I'd like to "turn it into" a .20....

I'm not going to hunt or really do anything else with it. Basically, it will be a "Bench Queen".
 
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Motorhead said:
In that Order WORST to BEST at 100

.177
.20
.22

Now said ... in the lower weight class of .22 of 15.9 grains, IMO the .20 cal 15.9 Can and generally does out perform the .22 for many when looked at in these specific terms outlined.
Click to expand...

I agree.

For apples to apples (similar weights) the .20 is the best of the three for long range at typical PCP speeds. Ive shot lots and lots and lots of them at prairie dogs and killed lots and lots of prairie dogs.

Though I don't think your HW97 hopes and aspirations are gonna get even the .20/13.73 into the 800fps range where they're so good.
 
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Franklink said:
Though I don't think your HW97 hopes and aspirations are gonna get even the .20/13.73 into the 800fps range where they're so good.
Click to expand...
It is not to say that if a pellet shoots good at 800fps from one rifle, that it is the preferred speed for all rifles. Each rifle will shoot pellets good at it's own preferred speed or even different speeds, whether it is 500 or a 1000 fps. It is all about the relation between dwell time and barrel vibrations and some other factors as well. It is like that for springers, PCPs and PB rifles.
 
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Caliber 22 said:
It is not to say that if a pellet shoots good at 800fps from one rifle, that it is the preferred speed for all rifles. Each rifle will shoot pellets good at it's own preferred speed or even different speeds, whether it is 500 or a 1000 fps. It is all about the relation between dwell time and barrel vibrations and some other factors as well. It is like that for springers, PCPs and PB rifles.
Click to expand...

I agree.
I should have been more clear that I KNOW the .20/13.73 is amazing for long range at 800fps. But I don't have any personal knowledge to how good they are at slower than that, regardless of the power plant.

Ie. i don't think an HW97 is going to get them to the same speed where I personally know they're a great long range option. They could certainly be good at slower speeds too, I just can't offer opinions there since I haven't shot them at slower speeds.
 
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What kind of grouping do you want to get at 100yds with your HW97 or you going to see how good you can judge the distance and flight trajectory to become good at holdover?I can see how that would be fun,the thing is your scope will be adjusted crazy and how you going to bench rest it then? I can learn something about this 100 yd challenge with a springer .Guys that do it please tell me the best way to go about it.I think this would help poster also,as I do not mean to hijack post.
 
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Boscoe, I've been shooting steel at 100 with mid-powered springers. Mostly at 6" steel which is far too easy. Hitting small bits etc on the berm is fun, and you can see exactly where your misses land. 👍

I find .22 to be superior to .177 at 100, and I've started to assemble a few target just for this. Spinners, a rimfire KYL, and I'll pick up some of the hard rubber WalMart type rodent spinners, etc. The clay pigeon diminishing target is always fun too.

As for scopes, I find that I need anywhere from 20-22 to 26-28 inches of incremented reticle if I want to keep my zero between 25 & 50 yards. Plenty of mil dot scopes can do that (the more dots the better, and you have to reduce your correct subtension magnification level by roughly 10%), definitely a scope with a good MOA ladder or tree.
Last time I shot I was using an AirMax 4-12, and I was into the boxes but still precise enough for the target at hand.

A friend has some spinners strategically located in the woods in his back yard. Semi-unknown ranges, etc. Long ranges. Very hard to see. GREAT fun to shoot at!

Honestly, everyone should try some long range spinner shooting. It's truly a blast...
 
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A few years back I tried my .177 HW97K at a 100y match. Got a 3.18" group (5 shots @ 105 yards lasered) using 4.52 FTT's. I knew my holdover and the air was relatively still, only shot the one group so I wasn't cherry picking. I bet others could do better and possibly myself if I spent more time shooting. Truthfully, I'm happy with anything under 3.5" @ 100y using springers. The general consensus is .20cal is more accurate, which I don't/won't disagree with. Springers might not be the most accurate at distance but they sure are fun.
 
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Yes they are.
I could say that I'd be happy keeping pellets in a group the size of a pellet tin, etc.
But I'm really just exploring what can be done. I don't have a standard I'm trying to meet or anything like that.
Sure, I'll be shooting some paper groups too. But mostly I like the challenge of long range springer shooting. It's probably the closest I'll come to golfing.
 
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