HW/Weihrauch Artillery Hold v Free Recoil

[sjs]

Got my first springer a few weeks ago. Learning how to shoot it and despite 60 plus years of shooting various firearms and some airguns, and being not too bad of a marksman, I am taking some time to master the artillery hold. It is coming though and I do find the challenge of a springer very enjoyable. Heck, I like everything about my HW35 and I have an HW97 coming today.

Still, I know in firearm benchrest, both rimfire and centerfire, the most effective technique is usually free recoil, and if I understand it correctly, it removes the human factor from the process even more. For that reason, despite its efficacy I did not use it much as it was not as much fun as being more involved in the process myself. I wonder though, for those wanting the ultimate accuracy from their springer from the bench why do they not just go all the way to free recoil? Perhaps some of you do and I just have not read of it.

I am also wondering why I am finding this whole air rifle thing so much more enjoyable than my firearm shooting, but that should probably be a separate thread.

 

[Star7]

Some do use free recoil from the bench. It involves a bit of bag and the surface of the bag development. It isn't unusual to see people applying baby powder to the bags to optimize the way the rifle moves.

 

[PEP3]

Got my first springer a few weeks ago. Learning how to shoot it and despite 60 plus years of shooting various firearms and some airguns, and being not too bad of a marksman, I am taking some time to master the artillery hold. It is coming though and I do find the challenge of a springer very enjoyable. Heck, I like everything about my HW35 and I have an HW97 coming today.

Still, I know in firearm benchrest, both rimfire and centerfire, the most effective technique is usually free recoil, and if I understand it correctly, it removes the human factor from the process even more. For that reason, despite its efficacy I did not use it much as it was not as much fun as being more involved in the process myself. I wonder though, for those wanting the ultimate accuracy from their springer from the bench why do they not just go all the way to free recoil? Perhaps some of you do and I just have not read of it.

I am also wondering why I am finding this whole air rifle thing so much more enjoyable than my firearm shooting, but that should probably be a separate thread.

Very nice rifles to start out with, you will be very happy with those. I don't worry about hold technique that much, I just let it sit on the rest and don't hold tight against my shoulder. I use the same technique for standing.

 

[Mycapt65]

Free recoil and artillery hold are synonymous.

 

[maxtrouble]

Protektor bags and soft cotton handkerchiefs are how I shoot. The handkerchiefs are easy to clean and very soft, perfect for free recoil. Any soft cloth works.

Original Leather Sandbag Shooting Rests & Accessories Made in USA 100%

The original source of leather sandbag rifle and pistol rests made in USA since 1938. Offering top grain leather shooting bags and rests for hunting, benchrest competition and long range shooting. Also manufacturing aluminum shooting rests, leather accessories, trap/skeet bags and rifle slings.

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[PEP3]

Protektor bags and soft cotton handkerchiefs are how I shoot. The handkerchiefs are easy to clean and very soft, perfect for free recoil. Any soft cloth works.

Original Leather Sandbag Shooting Rests & Accessories Made in USA 100%

The original source of leather sandbag rifle and pistol rests made in USA since 1938. Offering top grain leather shooting bags and rests for hunting, benchrest competition and long range shooting. Also manufacturing aluminum shooting rests, leather accessories, trap/skeet bags and rifle slings.

protektormodel.com

I use the rag that comes with my Hawke scopes.

 

[Septicdeath]

Free recoil and artillery hold are synonymous.

Absolutely from bags, rest or offhand. The less the hold the better. Lite on the shoulder, loose hold on grip and lay it in your palm. Keep your hold for a split second when you fire. Let the gun do the work.

 

[sjs]

Got my hw97k yesterday and this is no longer an issue. Artillery hold came easy, shooting it is sweet and accuracy was outstanding from the first pellet. The hw35 is a wonderful classic and will never be sold but this 97 seems to be the ultimate refinement of the piston spring rifle concept. Just top drawer in every regard.

 

[beerthief]

Protektor bags and soft cotton handkerchiefs are how I shoot. The handkerchiefs are easy to clean and very soft, perfect for free recoil. Any soft cloth works.

Original Leather Sandbag Shooting Rests & Accessories Made in USA 100%

The original source of leather sandbag rifle and pistol rests made in USA since 1938. Offering top grain leather shooting bags and rests for hunting, benchrest competition and long range shooting. Also manufacturing aluminum shooting rests, leather accessories, trap/skeet bags and rifle slings.

protektormodel.com

Protektor has what he terms as Slippery cloth , i have on my front rest , yes it is slippery excellent for springers you can buy on several of his products. great for my Anschutz .22 PB also

 

[abslayer]

Some do use free recoil from the bench. It involves a bit of bag and the surface of the bag development. It isn't unusual to see people applying baby powder to the bags to optimize the way the rifle moves.

I just use a piece of silk on shooting bag and let springer free recoil Best I found

 

[drpietrzak]

I use free recoil in the PB world with rimfire. But as I see it there are limits to it, and with the artillery hold, which is essentially the same thing. Some of it has to do with rifle weight and trigger pull weight. A very light rifle, particularly relative to the trigger pull weight, makes "free recoil" less effective. It relies on a trigger pull being pretty light. If the rifle is too light relative to the trigger pull weight it requires some "grip" on the rifle that is not "free recoil".

Also, the spring air rifles often have a bit of a "twisting" motion when the spring releases. It is subtle in some, but present for most springers. I deal with this with using a grip that is a bit beyond what I would call a true "free recoil." At least as I would understand "free recoil" in rimfire. I think of it as a process of learning the rifle and how it shoots. I am a "springer at 50-yards and beyond" type of guy. I previously made a video of how I set my rig up to shoot. It is not pure artillery or free recoil. It is a hybrid.

 

[beerthief]

I use free recoil in the PB world with rimfire. But as I see it there are limits to it, and with the artillery hold, which is essentially the same thing. Some of it has to do with rifle weight and trigger pull weight. A very light rifle, particularly relative to the trigger pull weight, makes "free recoil" less effective. It relies on a trigger pull being pretty light. If the rifle is too light relative to the trigger pull weight it requires some "grip" on the rifle that is not "free recoil".

Also, the spring air rifles often have a bit of a "twisting" motion when the spring releases. It is subtle in some, but present for most springers. I deal with this with using a grip that is a bit beyond what I would call a true "free recoil." At least as I would understand "free recoil" in rimfire. I think of it as a process of learning the rifle and how it shoots. I am a "springer at 50-yards and beyond" type of guy. I previously made a video of how I set my rig up to shoot. It is not pure artillery or free recoil.

I notice you trust the bear trap and do not hold the barrel when loading a pellet ?

 

[drpietrzak]

I notice you trust the bear trap and do not hold the barrel when loading a pellet ?

I assume you mean hold the cocking lever. I bounce around with it. I have had that rifle apart too many times and have developed an unrealistic trust in the system I guess.

 

[beerthief]

I assume you mean hold the cocking lever. I bounce around with it. I have had that rifle apart too many times and have developed an unrealistic trust in the system I guess.

yes cocking lever , but on this rifle you can lose a finger tip , much worse than a bent barrel or head with a break barrel .
YES i can see trust level with the bear trap as i have 4 rifles with that feature .

 

[drpietrzak]

yes cocking lever , but on this rifle you can lose a finger tip , much worse than a bent barrel or head with a break barrel .
YES i can see trust level with the bear trap as i have 4 rifles with that feature .

I am not saying it is best practice, I am saying it is lazy practice after 20K rounds!

 

[Simplemann]

I use free recoil in the PB world with rimfire. But as I see it there are limits to it, and with the artillery hold, which is essentially the same thing. Some of it has to do with rifle weight and trigger pull weight. A very light rifle, particularly relative to the trigger pull weight, makes "free recoil" less effective. It relies on a trigger pull being pretty light. If the rifle is too light relative to the trigger pull weight it requires some "grip" on the rifle that is not "free recoil".

Also, the spring air rifles often have a bit of a "twisting" motion when the spring releases. It is subtle in some, but present for most springers. I deal with this with using a grip that is a bit beyond what I would call a true "free recoil." At least as I would understand "free recoil" in rimfire. I think of it as a process of learning the rifle and how it shoots. I am a "springer at 50-yards and beyond" type of guy. I previously made a video of how I set my rig up to shoot. It is not pure artillery or free recoil. It is a hybrid.

Awesome video thanks for sharing and thats some very good shooting

 

[Motorhead]

Hold shoulder pressure with FORE STOCK HAND, not using the pistol grip / trigger hand.
Your trigger hand and lowest 3 fingers around grip needs to be loose with the effort to break trigger happening between your THUMB and TRIGGER FINGER only !
Also .... DO NOT rest your face / cheek on the stocks comb if present as it will impart CW rotation as gun recoils rearward if a RH shooter, or CCW if a lefty.
You can feel the comb just there at cheek, but no more pressure than that. One needs to get accustomed to finding the eye box of the optics w/o relying on the comb area of stock for head position. * ESPECIALLY with a Piston gun !!!

 

[Mycapt65]

I use a light hold on my springers and most of powder burners. It's my go to. Muscle memory got the best of me when my 6lb Tikka 7-08 scoped my eye brow. I developed a flinch that took almost two years to shake. So be careful when switching over to PBs because even mild cartridges like my 7-08 can jump at you fast. Especially in a light rifle.

 

[Jim-in-UK]

Just to illustrate the effect of one aspect of hold, shoulder contact, on springer recoil, here's the recoil displacement of my 85mm stroke TX200 with the rifle free to slide, and with my shoulder touching the recoil pad. You can see that the muscle of my shoulder coverts recoil energy to elastic energy, which it returns as kinetic energy to add to the surge as the piston compression stroke turns to piston bounce.

 

[drpietrzak]

Just to illustrate the effect of one aspect of hold, shoulder contact, on springer recoil, here's the recoil displacement of my 85mm stroke TX200 with the rifle free to slide, and with my shoulder touching the recoil pad. You can see that the muscle of my shoulder coverts recoil energy to elastic energy, which it returns as kinetic energy to add to the surge as the piston compression stroke turns to piston bounce.

View attachment 388870

Cool. I too have found no should contact more effective with my stock Tx200.