Hello fellow shooters, My question is : I am trying to build a dope card and I was wondering if this should be done off a bench or as I would be shooting the match, Hunter class, bucket and sticks style.
Building a dope card for FT
- Thread starter DJinAZ98
- Start date
I highly recommend creating your dope card by shooting from the position you'll be using during a match.
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I second what Franklink said. In my case, there is a significant difference in the POI between when I'm shooting from a bench then sit down on my bucket and shoot from sticks.
Art "Podna" Womack
Art "Podna" Womack
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I'll side on the bench setup. While I agree that the ZERO reference should be from your intended FT position, the holdovers or clicks should be the same from either and the bench makes for a more consistent result (for me, at least).
There was a time for me when certain rifles seemed to be better from my FT position than I could do from a bench... that's pretty well gone through
Bob
There was a time for me when certain rifles seemed to be better from my FT position than I could do from a bench... that's pretty well gone through
Bob
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Another to agree with whats been said ...
Getting gun zeroed is only a starting point !!! 100% of your setting up a range card 10-55 needs to be done while outfitted EXACTLY how you are going to shoot said gun in competition. This includes any & all practice sessions thereafter as well.
Getting gun zeroed is only a starting point !!! 100% of your setting up a range card 10-55 needs to be done while outfitted EXACTLY how you are going to shoot said gun in competition. This includes any & all practice sessions thereafter as well.
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So, If I find my holdovers on a bench, that will not accurately translate to FT shooting? I understand why I should practice as I will play, but in my mind, I eliminate variables by steadying the rifle for initial settings. Is that incorrect?
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D
Deleted member 38071
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The recoil action differs enough between bench and bucket your poi may change, alot. Your holdover points will change accordingly with poi change. So long as you're happy re-zeroing between the bench and bucket it's no big deal. I'm leaving out temp, mirage, wind and errant insects to keep things simple.
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Thanks MRA, fortunately, I have very little recoil, so I suppose that's a bonus. I am headed out now to see what I can accomplish. Have my 30 - 60 targets setup. Tonight, off the bench, tomorrow off my bucket.
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Definitely on bench if the gun is shooting correct and your yardages are correct then if you miss its on you not the gun
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Here's how I do it....shoot in the position that you intend to shoot the match. Zero your rifle Iat whatever yardage you want ...say it's 30 yds. From there I check my 10-20 yard holdovers shooting 5 shot groups for every yard. Yes this takes some time but it's worth it! Then from 20-55 I check every 5 yards to see where I hit in 5 shot groups. Yes again this takes some time but if done right you have a dope sheet you can trust and feel confident you can hit whatever you are aiming at from 10-55yds.
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Keith, that's old scool... love it!
I used to do the same thing. Now I use an app that does eveything for you. Just put in your zero, 10 and 55 yard numbers and it does the rest. Then I go out and shoot my course and if the targets are falling, I call it good. Mike N. turned my on to it, and at first I was skeptical, but it really does work. I believe the app is called Charigun Pro.
Chas
I used to do the same thing. Now I use an app that does eveything for you. Just put in your zero, 10 and 55 yard numbers and it does the rest. Then I go out and shoot my course and if the targets are falling, I call it good. Mike N. turned my on to it, and at first I was skeptical, but it really does work. I believe the app is called Charigun Pro.
Chas
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Chas I also use Chairgun and it is very accurate... I'll make a dope sheet off of Chairgun then go out and recheck it making sure it is good. The day before a shoot is when I typically go OLE SKOL and check my dope the long way. When you have confidence in your dope sheet and your equipment you typically do much better. No worse feeling on a FT course when things go array and you can't trust your dope.
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I'm with Bobby C. I like to start on the bench and get my 30 yard zero and windage set right.... on a calm day.
Then, I like to shoot 5 shot groups at all my marked yardages in the position I will compete from. I use the center of the groups for my marks. This will account for the way you break your shots on average. The more shots in the group the better your data. The computer programs are a good check, but unless you know for sure your exact BC and scope height, then it's only a starting point.
For me this was very important in WFTF class where less support is allowed, because I tend to pull my shots up and right a little when shooting without a bipod.. That's why I'm doing better in Hunter class now. You can kind of compensate or incorporate your shooting style into your dope sheet.
As far a "dope sheet" goes. I don't like to put my data on a card that I might lose or forget to bring. Also, it takes longer to look at the card, than just putting the data on the sidewheel. If you use a dope sheet, then at least tape it to your gun or scope, so it's always with the gun.
Wayne
Then, I like to shoot 5 shot groups at all my marked yardages in the position I will compete from. I use the center of the groups for my marks. This will account for the way you break your shots on average. The more shots in the group the better your data. The computer programs are a good check, but unless you know for sure your exact BC and scope height, then it's only a starting point.
For me this was very important in WFTF class where less support is allowed, because I tend to pull my shots up and right a little when shooting without a bipod.. That's why I'm doing better in Hunter class now. You can kind of compensate or incorporate your shooting style into your dope sheet.
As far a "dope sheet" goes. I don't like to put my data on a card that I might lose or forget to bring. Also, it takes longer to look at the card, than just putting the data on the sidewheel. If you use a dope sheet, then at least tape it to your gun or scope, so it's always with the gun.
Wayne
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Been shooting FT for 23 years but I almost got thrown off last Saturday in this manor.
I put a scope back on my Thomas FT rifle and it was windy all week with some days gusting 60 mph so i couldn't get a zero outside. On Friday I went over to my friends place and sighted in off his bench at 13Y in his shop. 30Y is my normal zero-0 but 13Y is 1.5 mils of elevation according to my dope so that is where I set my turret at, and also adjusted the windage turret to dead nuts.
Went down to the Phoenix/match location to check dope and sight in before the match and at 30Y the elevation was perfect but was hitting .6 mil left and it seemed like there was only 1 mph wind??? So I decided to check at 10Y(at 10Y a 20 fpe pellet is hardly affected in low wind) and sure enough I was hitting right on the money so I kept the windage on from the night before. Fast forward I went on to shoot the high score in the match. The lesson I learned was to trust my zero from a "no wind" sight in done from indoors. Or in the past done in calm situations outdoors.
My opinion is that basically the place where we shoot in Phoenix has nothing to block wind because its a flat area and doesn't have vegetation to slow the wind down so compared to other places I'm used to shooting at those pellets were affected much more than usual to me. If I hadn't checked at 10Y I'd a had a miserable day because I would have adjusted my windage turret to what "I thought" was correct (would have put .4 mil windage on) which would have been a wrong assumption on my part and would have resulted in a bunch of targets not falling.
I put a scope back on my Thomas FT rifle and it was windy all week with some days gusting 60 mph so i couldn't get a zero outside. On Friday I went over to my friends place and sighted in off his bench at 13Y in his shop. 30Y is my normal zero-0 but 13Y is 1.5 mils of elevation according to my dope so that is where I set my turret at, and also adjusted the windage turret to dead nuts.
Went down to the Phoenix/match location to check dope and sight in before the match and at 30Y the elevation was perfect but was hitting .6 mil left and it seemed like there was only 1 mph wind??? So I decided to check at 10Y(at 10Y a 20 fpe pellet is hardly affected in low wind) and sure enough I was hitting right on the money so I kept the windage on from the night before. Fast forward I went on to shoot the high score in the match. The lesson I learned was to trust my zero from a "no wind" sight in done from indoors. Or in the past done in calm situations outdoors.
My opinion is that basically the place where we shoot in Phoenix has nothing to block wind because its a flat area and doesn't have vegetation to slow the wind down so compared to other places I'm used to shooting at those pellets were affected much more than usual to me. If I hadn't checked at 10Y I'd a had a miserable day because I would have adjusted my windage turret to what "I thought" was correct (would have put .4 mil windage on) which would have been a wrong assumption on my part and would have resulted in a bunch of targets not falling.
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One of the best way to see your dope verified is by using this holdover target we have posted on our website. There are two types, Mil and Moa grids. Each will help you visualize your clicks or holdover based off the pellet drop for ea distance. Hope this helps.
Garrett
https://www.phoenixairgun.net/targets
Garrett
https://www.phoenixairgun.net/targets
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