Having use these since they came out almost 25 years ago.For Air rifles thee only way to go. I helped a buddy the other day get his scope centered up . As we do in !K matches we center the crosshair in the glass then start the shimming to get point of aim at whatever yardage. With the Signature rings you can cant a -20 to the left and a +20 on the rear to the right to bring that scope into center with the bore of the gun.Same for up and down. Once you can get to within An inch or two ...then you can click into center where your last bullet hole went. Now you have A ton of adjustment to say 25 yds and click out to one hundred yards. Air guns are some of the worst i've seen ....these are the rings to use. hope that helps some of you guys...AND you'll never put any ring scatches on the 1$1,000 dollar tube !
Burris Signature Rings the only way to go.....
- Thread starter Longbow53
- Start date
Yep. I have been using them for a while now too. I like them a lot for those benefits stated above. The one design change that Burris do is redesign the base with one solid clamp side. This will allow it to locate on the side of the rail perfectly every time (when removing for gun maintenance and re-installing). The way that they are now both sides of the clamps float and if taking them off and putting them back on the horizontal location is not very precise and resighting that plane is required.
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Its over kill, but there XTR rings have a solid base on one side with a floating clamp coming back to same position. Either way they still are the best way to center that scope and protect it from scratches. You can always go one revolution extra on turret when centering scope for more elevation from 25 yds to 100 yds. You can use the Hawke rings? that you could adjust right/left front/rear. I tried them in about 2015. Dont know if there still made,maybe someone will step in on this.They worked good and as long as you lap the rings then put a fine piece of scotch tape inside each ring half you can protect your scope from any slight scratching. You still have to look at up/ down elevation to center scope.
The picatinny bases with .05, .010, .017 moa helps also on the FWB 300s with its 10 meter velocity.I built a special mount and was hitting 22 silhouette Rams at 100 meters on my Silo range just to prove that slow velocity could lob A 10 grain pellet that far and SLOWLY drop a ram ! LOL The scope was really angled to the barrel to get the trajectory !
The picatinny bases with .05, .010, .017 moa helps also on the FWB 300s with its 10 meter velocity.I built a special mount and was hitting 22 silhouette Rams at 100 meters on my Silo range just to prove that slow velocity could lob A 10 grain pellet that far and SLOWLY drop a ram ! LOL The scope was really angled to the barrel to get the trajectory !
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I like the fact that both sides clamp. It gets the mount centered on the dovetail.
The "11mm" dovetails are not uniform. A clamp that moves on only one side is always offset from the center of the rifle a little. Sometimes a lot. The Burris z clamp solves that.
It honestly makes little difference if the scope is offset a little. But that bothers me a lot. I like those centering dovetail clamps. I can't say I've ever tried to remove and reinstall one without the expectation of having to re- zero. They may wander a bit I suppose. But they are rock solid mounts and have worked well for me.
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I kept thinking what that ring setup I had almost ten years ago. So here it is. The FX adjustable rings,for elevation only. So if your not off to much left to right these could work. another point, A 1/4" click scope may work better over an 1/8". For 1/4" at 25 yds is 4 clicks ... opposed to 1 click for 1/4" at 100 yds. thats why you run out at 25 yds if your over 6" lets say . I'm just bringing this up for guys that are having problems and here may be your cure all.
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I'm starting to like them too.
How do you guys position those inserts?
I start out with the "0" inserts in the rear ring and put different inserts in the front ring to see if I can zero.
But do these inserts put undue pressure on the scope tube. Versus a Sportmatch adjustable that's a one piece.
How do you guys position those inserts?
I start out with the "0" inserts in the rear ring and put different inserts in the front ring to see if I can zero.
But do these inserts put undue pressure on the scope tube. Versus a Sportmatch adjustable that's a one piece.
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When first choosing which inserts to start with, I look to whether the manufacturer has machined the rail to have an offset MOA to the barrel. Then choose a ring insert offset that is appropriate for that based on the distances normally shot with that rifle, what use of elevation is in the turrets, and how close it is to optical center of the scope.
When changing out either front or back of the ring inserts, loosening both ring caps is required to remove the scope and change inserts. This will not put stress on the tube, and everything gets torqued down evenly too.
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A good way is first shoot "0" rings top and bottom...lets just say your pretty much straight with bore and scope...but 6" low and to the left 4". Try A -20 in front and A +20 in rear...these are on bottom of ring.Just put "0" ring shims on top. In an air rifle you can normally hold the scope down enough to get a shot off,try three shots. This just canted the scope downward towards your bullet hole on target. Now if your 8" low ...2" below the first shots at "o" rings, Put a -10 in front ring on bottom ,"o" on top and shot again. Almost dead on lets say but to the left 4" still, so cant the front ring up the left side of ring maybe 1/8" and rear ring cant up right side 1/8" snap in the "0 rings, you just canted the scope a little to the left , hold scope and pop a shot( this is an air rifle) Hopefully you now swung the scope to the left enough to cut the distance down to maybe two " or less.
Anyway that is how you move your scope to match the bullet hole. I ended up buying the gunsmith box of Signature ring inserts years ago. I think 10 of each. -5,+5,-10,+10,-20,+20. To do Daves gun the other day we played with combo's till we got it within an inch or so to the bullet hole. Since the scope is centered with cross hair( lets say turret travel 4 full turns to bottom out...go back two full turns, crosshair in center in glass,both elavation and horizontal) I also use very fine teflon tape and will build up under an insert to get it dead nut on...mostly for the 1K guns. This works best on the wider XTR scope ring set. You might be didling along for a good hour or more but you will slowly get it as close as you can with the different shims provided. Hope I didnt bore you, and hopefully got you where you need to go. AND no scratches on yout scope tube !!! LOL Pete in Montana
Anyway that is how you move your scope to match the bullet hole. I ended up buying the gunsmith box of Signature ring inserts years ago. I think 10 of each. -5,+5,-10,+10,-20,+20. To do Daves gun the other day we played with combo's till we got it within an inch or so to the bullet hole. Since the scope is centered with cross hair( lets say turret travel 4 full turns to bottom out...go back two full turns, crosshair in center in glass,both elavation and horizontal) I also use very fine teflon tape and will build up under an insert to get it dead nut on...mostly for the 1K guns. This works best on the wider XTR scope ring set. You might be didling along for a good hour or more but you will slowly get it as close as you can with the different shims provided. Hope I didnt bore you, and hopefully got you where you need to go. AND no scratches on yout scope tube !!! LOL Pete in Montana
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Since I moved to Burris Signature rings all my problems with my Diana 54 disappeared . I have them on all 4 springers now.
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If you use them to adjust vertically nothing bad can happen with any combination of inserts.
If you use the to adjust horizontal then I’d make sure I put an equal + size opposite the - size.
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I've been using them for years and they work great. Several different scope set ups on my 97K and now gone 77K. Only one that didn't need them was the prosport.
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Some nice guns,noticed how your rear ring was canted to bring scope right/left. Have used the laminated wood and Italian laminates in my business,very stable. A pic of the Italian Laminate in my Kaleidoscope line......and very few of these gun stocks are out there....
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@Longbow53
I have gone over this a number of times just to make certain I understand
If I read it correctly a -20 is a thicker shim than a +20.
So that the combination of -20 in the front bottom & +20 in the back bottom gives the result of lowering the back.
Which results in lowering the poi
Is that correct?
Edward
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This is impressive to me as opposed to the guy that does the same target with 91.437 FPE and 40 grain slug .
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The -20 is a thinner shim put it up front on lower ring,put a +20 on rear ring lower You just canted the scope downward. So if your first shot went low with "0" rings you are now pointing scope down towards you bullet hole,which is what you want to do.
If you reversed and went +20 front and -20 rear you just pointed scope upward. If "0" shim shot went high this is the route to take.
You can buy packs of one of each ...6 shims from Burris. Best to buy two packs. then your covered ! With a back operation,not much to do but play ,so these posts are keeping me busy !
Also notice Bustachips last pic. His shims are canted up 1/4" in rear ring. He is moving the scope either right or left also. Once you start using these rings you'll see how you can move that scope around.
If you reversed and went +20 front and -20 rear you just pointed scope upward. If "0" shim shot went high this is the route to take.
You can buy packs of one of each ...6 shims from Burris. Best to buy two packs. then your covered ! With a back operation,not much to do but play ,so these posts are keeping me busy !
Also notice Bustachips last pic. His shims are canted up 1/4" in rear ring. He is moving the scope either right or left also. Once you start using these rings you'll see how you can move that scope around.
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Remember though you must have matching opposite inserts in each ring, ie the +/- must add to 0. If you run the +20 on the bottom, you must run the -20 on top.
Incidentally the ring set doesn't come with four 0 inserts. So if you want no additional cant you have to get creative. I run +/-20 in both the front and back (-20 on the bottom halves)
Incidentally the ring set doesn't come with four 0 inserts. So if you want no additional cant you have to get creative. I run +/-20 in both the front and back (-20 on the bottom halves)
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Yes and no...you can get away with using "0" on the top for the 5 and 10's as long as there is a gap once tightened down you'll be OK. Been playing with these a long time
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No insult implied or intended.
But I think you inadvertently put -20 on the front and a +20 on the back in your original post.
However, thank you.
Now I understand
Edward
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Thank you all for this post. I am currently working on getting a 70 year old pb ( Martini International )on target . This sure helped. Thanks again.
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