Correcting the only Major Flaw of the FX M3....The Trigger

[Ca_Varminter]

It was a shame that such a nice PCP with great Potential... Would have such a bad Trigger action!
Out of the box, the trigger was at least 8lbs..If I remember correctly.
After getting new springs. Trimming them down.
You could get a light trigger pull, but it had a hitch in the movement.
If got to the end of the 1st stage take-up, then if I decided not to fire..
If you backed off, the trigger would not return... You would have manually return it!

So I honed both the trigger sear roll and hammer sear arm..using diamond hones

This helped, but not enough.. So I closely examined the trigger sear roll piece.
I decided it could benefit from a 3° undercut.
So I setup my mill......1/4" carbide endmill and 3°angle block....

I setup the trigger sear roll in a jewelers vice. Made sure the sear roll surfaces were square.
Then I set the undercut angle with my angle block.
I blacken the sear surface to make sure I only kiss the edge. I didn't want to move the sear'edge position!
I took very light passes until all the black surface was gone!!
Finally I remove the Trigger Sear roll from the vice and honed the surface. To make sure the surface was smooth!

Well I am Glad to report it Worked Perfectly.
The 1st stage take up is around 12 ozs.

Now if I back off, it will return(reset) by itself!!
The 2nd stage break is about 1.5lbs. Crisp..breaks like glass!!

I love when a Plan comes together as you Planned!
This what make airgunning Fun!!
Stuart

 

[airgunner1042]

If you adjust the first and second stage in conjunction with each other, you can get the same if not better results.I have the Mk2. When the gun was new, the trigger would reset but after a half tin of pellets, it stopped. I adjusted and adjusted and finally came up with an adjustment that suits me just fine. First stage is about 8-10 ozs. When I hit the second stage the trigger actually sets. The next pressure breaks the second stage clean and crisp just at 1lb. If you adjust the second stage lighter, you do not get the set, and the trigger pulls thru the second stage and fires. I can't tell you how many times it took me to get where I wanted to be. I can get the trigger to reset but at that point, it pulls thru the second stage. As good as the Crowns are, the trigger is the one flaw. If you want a great trigger, get a RAW or FWB. Nothing out there to beat them. I learned also, you can adjust the Crown trigger without taking it out of the stock, but it takes a lot of patience and a good set of allen wrenches. There is a good you tube video on adjusting the Crown trigger. Great that you have the tools you have at your disposal and the expertise to use them.

 

[Ca_Varminter]

I have tuned many type of trigger for awhile now.
Everything from colt1911 to Rem700 [email protected] ozs.
On airguns.. I have tune Steyrs, Anschutz and even a Custom Rapid trigger(same as the RAW)

this is a 6ozs trigger.. it has 4 ceramic ball-bearing supporting the pins......
So I feel triggers are an integral part of the equation for a accurate Gun!

Stuart

 

[MikeAllen]

My M3 trigger - out of the box - with very minor adjustments, is at 11-12 oz. Guess I got lucky!

 

[Seeker]

Make sure that your safety works fine now.

Apart from that - M3 has more flaws than your perception can notice. E.g. https://www.airgunnation.com/thread...-reg-creep-quasi-scientific-analysis.1175929/

 

[Ca_Varminter]

My M3 trigger - out of the box - with very minor adjustments, is at 11-12 oz. Guess I got lucky!

Boy FX must have at least changed their trigger spring....
There is No Way my trigger would be reduce from 8 lbs+.... 12 ozs...
I have to look for the original spring in my spare box.....
Nice Find!!

Stuart

 

[Ca_Varminter]

Make sure that your safety works fine now.

Apart from that - M3 has more flaws than your perception can notice. E.g. https://www.airgunnation.com/thread...-reg-creep-quasi-scientific-analysis.1175929/

I made sure I didn't touch the sear engagement position. To keep insure the safety would function.
I adjusted the geometry after the sear breaks!! To ensure a clean break!
But any time you stone or hone your sears of your trigger, you always do a full Safety Check!!

Stuart

 

[Seeker]

I made sure I didn't touch the sear engagement position.

Could you elaborate more on that? Maybe you can mark it in the picture?

 

[Ca_Varminter]

Could you elaborate more on that? Maybe you can mark it in the picture?

Here you go...Here is a diagram of how I approached this.
The trigger sear roll is rotated downward by 3 degrees.
Using a black Sharpie marker, I blacken the lower surface.
So Now I position the endmil and slowly lowered until I dusted the blacken surface.
Now I slowly moved the endmill to the left until I was satisfied with the position.
The machining direction is back and forth towards you, in the diagram.....
Then I drop the end mill by .001" and ran it across the trigger sear roll.
Noting how much more I dusted off...So I watch the blacken area slowly the narrow towards the sear edge.
Making sure I didn't overshoot it!!

HTH,
Stuart

 

[Motorhead]

I have tuned many type of trigger for awhile now.
Everything from colt1911 to Rem700 [email protected] ozs.
On airguns.. I have tune Steyrs, Anschutz and even a Custom Rapid trigger(same as the RAW)

this is a 6ozs trigger.. it has 4 ceramic ball-bearing supporting the pins......
So I feel triggers are an integral part of the equation for a accurate Gun!

Stuart

That trigger block shown is Very similar to the current THOMAS. Tho in a THOMAS there are 6 bearing having the hammers holding top sear also on bearings. Such designs having free motion, yet so mechanically precise can be set to grams of sear break pressure.

Theoben designed it best i know, Dawson made a version, Benjamin Marauders copied it, RAW uses and refined it some more. ALL operate as a true two stage unless adjusted otherwise. Thomas used the same @ architecture tho with changes in how adjusted is a 1 stage ( critical sear position adjustable ) with just a flat do nothing 1st stage take up travel unless adjusted out. Set as a no travel single stage .. sublime !!!

 

[Ca_Varminter]

My version the Race version of the Dawson Trigger..
Designed by Chip and Gordy

Stuart

 

[qball]

Nice work!

I tuned my all my fx triggers to be single stage at about 1.1lbs. I still don’t like 2 stage trigger because I don’t have the mental capacity to focus on taking up the first stage while shooting, I want to used what little left of my brain to focus on the target and the wind…..not the first stage. My idea of the first stage is feeling the trigger blade with my finger tip. Speaking of which I need to figure out how to get rid of the fist stage on my Thomas.

 

[elh0102]

FX triggers are indeed strange things. They can be adjusted and polished to a satisfactory condition, but the weird trigger roll and sear design will not produce the same results as a true, multiple lever match grade trigger. The Boss match trigger adds a lever to produce a geometry that allows for a light let off, but the actual sear contact remains the same, acting against the trigger roll. In the standard Royale/Boss trigger, the "first stage" is actually just the trigger roll moving against the sear to the adjusted stopping point. The Boss match trigger merely allows the trigger roll to be advanced and set at that stopping point, and the first stage is nothing but free play in the trigger against a light spring. It looks like the M3 trigger is a slight variation of the same trigger. In a real two-stage trigger, the second stage sear is not at that fine engagement point until the first stage is advanced to its stop, allowing a safe trigger that can be adjusted to a light let off. The FX design is cheap to make and quick and easy to assemble, which feeds profitability. But, as expensive as the rifles have become, it would be nice to see some design work focused on a real, match quality trigger. But, obviously I'm the contrarian, and most folks apparently like the thing, so I'll continue using my favorites, as will everyone else, and the market will decide the winners and losers.

 

[elh0102]

Nice work!

I tuned my all my fx triggers to be single stage at about 1.1lbs. I still don’t like 2 stage trigger because I don’t have the mental capacity to focus on taking up the first stage while shooting, I want to used what little left of my brain to focus on the target and the wind…..not the first stage. My idea of the first stage is feeling the trigger blade with my finger tip. Speaking of which I need to figure out how to get rid of the fist stage on my Thomas.

At 1.1 lbs, you're probably fine, but it's not a trigger that really safely accommodates adjusting out the first stage. In doing so, you have to advance the trigger roll to a very fine point of engagement, and at light settings it can be unsafe, as the engagement becomes too small for a safety margin. But I agree, I also prefer single stage for most purposes.

 

[qball]

At 1.1 lbs, you're probably fine, but it's not a trigger that really safely accommodates adjusting out the first stage. In doing so, you have to advance the trigger roll to a very fine point of engagement, and at light settings it can be unsafe, as the engagement becomes too small for a safety margin. But I agree, I also prefer single stage for most purposes.

You are right about that! It is very fine adjust to “fully” take out the first stage and still have the trigger to be safe. The margin of error is very thin, no more than 1/10th of a turn makes a difference. Definitely agree that it’s not the best target trigger out there but FX is still mostly a hunting gun that we use for target work. Maybe one day they will have a new trigger but I have settled with heavier single stage trigger which is my preference anyways.

I can understand why trigger snobs puke all over the FX triggers but it’s good enough for me, I even find the Thomas trigger a touch too light especially in difficult terrains where positions are not comfortable like on a bench. I have accidentally pulled the trigger and wasted shots because of difficult position, light trigger and fatigue combo…..more than once. I simply don’t have the mental capacity left to take up the first stage while look at the target, guesstimate the wind, control my breathing, time my heart beat in unnatural/contorted position while getting buffed by the wind. Just too many things going on for my poor little brain to handle.


IMHO hair triggers are great for ideal condition and bench mostly, I find it very hard to deal with in more challenging and dynamic situations like hunting and FT matches. Everything is a compromise and I can learn to live with a reliable heavier trigger vs a hair trigger under stress. On the bench a heavier trigger is not an issues for me at all because the way I manage my recoil the gun is very stable and I have all the time in the world.



So………FX triggers are “lemons”, and the juice ain’t worth the squeezing.

 

[Ca_Varminter]

Every trigger as it place our shooting hobby..
A light single stage Sub 1lbs is great for bench and long range shooting(in controlled conditions)
But a working safety and a habit of engaging it, if you are not "on target" is a must.
My rem700 22-250 AI has a single stage single set trigger....1.75lbs break, but when set 1.2 ozs break
With this you don't breath on it or take off the safety unless you are on TARGET!!

After i got into high end PCP's and Semi-auto PB.. a Nice 2-stage is a must.
The advantages of having a Fully engaged Sear surpasses any disadvantages.
My long range .20Tact AR15 has a Geissele Match 2-stage..10ozs 1st stage then 2nd stage breaks at 1.5 lbs
So the safety margins with them are High.....especially with unintentional misfires.......

Stuart

 

[Ca_Varminter]

So………FX triggers are “lemons”, and the juice ain’t worth the squeezing.

It's Apple or Oranges to some......
Yes you can live with it... or Even it may eventually "Break-In"
But, I have a my small shop, and the means to correct most problems.....
Also the training to tune triggers....
So Why Not setup the Trigger how I like it...

Stuart

 

[qball]

It's Apple or Oranges to some......
Yes you can live with it... or Even it may eventually "Break-In"
But, I have a my small shop, and the means to correct most problems.....
Also the training to tune triggers....
So Why Not setup the Trigger how I like it...

Stuart

If you can improve it and have the machine shop to do it then definitely go for it. I barely have space for the guns and the single stage 1lb trigger being my preference anyways so i’ll “live” with the stock FX trigger. It’s the beauty of the sport, everyone gets to enjoy it differently. if you decide one day it’s not how you like it then buy another trigger and start your tuning all over differently. Compare to hookers and blows this chit be cheap……..I was told.