Daystate Regal Hard Cocking Options

[jking]

If you're like me the cocking efforts on the Regal has always been a little bit of concern, not life and death but an issue. In the past I have broke the rifle down, deburred, polished and lubed all the motion parts just enough to improve my gun's cocking probably 30%. After the Revere came out I started asking questions about the magazine and magazine actuation system. It turns out that the Revere doesn't use a mechanical actuator within the action to cycle the magazine as it is "self indexing" magazine.... hmm? Today I took my Regal down and removed the sliding actuator, pin and spring and re-assemble it. 

I reasembled the gun and as they say "OMG" that improved it even yet more, but theres a catch, well two. One, you'll have to get either get the new Daystate branded self indexing mags or possibly go with a aftermarket self indexing like these, (no affiliation at all) https://www.carm-magazines.com/magazine-for-daystate-air-rifles.aspx. Thats issue number one. The second is the slot in the brass slider in the left photo above limits the throw of the bolt and with it fully removed the bolt handle can travel past 90 degrees so that will have to be dealt with. Not an issue though, as there are a couple of options. Just thought I'd share what I found out today. 

Jking

 

[hitech]

This is interesting because my Regal is also hard to cock, but I'm used to it. Not sure why other brands with a cocking lever are so much easier. If you get the self indexing magazine, keep us posted on how well it works, or doesn't work. Thanks for the research.

 

[Guest]

Excellent write up 

 

[Lemensd]

What would concern me more is the rust and corrosion in your pictures, unless it's grease, if so sorry.

Don

 

[SilentSquirrel]

If you're like me the cocking efforts on the Regal has always been a little bit of concern, not life and death but an issue. In the past I have broke the rifle down, deburred, polished and lubed all the motion parts just enough to improve my gun's cocking probably 30%. After the Revere came out I started asking questions about the magazine and magazine actuation system. It turns out that the Revere doesn't use a mechanical actuator within the action to cycle the magazine as it is "self indexing" magazine.... hmm? Today I took my Regal down and removed the sliding actuator, pin and spring and re-assemble it. 



I reasembled the gun and as they say "OMG" that improved it even yet more, but theres a catch, well two. One, you'll have to get either get the new Daystate branded self indexing mags or possibly go with a aftermarket self indexing like these, (no affiliation at all) https://www.carm-magazines.com/magazine-for-daystate-air-rifles.aspx. Thats issue number one. The second is the slot in the brass slider in the left photo above limits the throw of the bolt and with it fully removed the bolt handle can travel past 90 degrees so that will have to be dealt with. Not an issue though, as there are a couple of options. Just thought I'd share what I found out today. 

Jking

Good morning Jking

That's a great discovery you have made

What options have you for keeping the bolt handle from traveling over 90 degrees?

And what issues arise when firing the rifle if one does not correct the situation?

Thanks

Ed

 

[jking]

What would concern me more is the rust and corrosion in your pictures, unless it's grease, if so sorry.

Don

Yeah, it's just some red trigger grease. Thanks for the concern though.. 

jk

 

[jking]

If you're like me the cocking efforts on the Regal has always been a little bit of concern, not life and death but an issue. In the past I have broke the rifle down, deburred, polished and lubed all the motion parts just enough to improve my gun's cocking probably 30%. After the Revere came out I started asking questions about the magazine and magazine actuation system. It turns out that the Revere doesn't use a mechanical actuator within the action to cycle the magazine as it is "self indexing" magazine.... hmm? Today I took my Regal down and removed the sliding actuator, pin and spring and re-assemble it. 



I reasembled the gun and as they say "OMG" that improved it even yet more, but theres a catch, well two. One, you'll have to get either get the new Daystate branded self indexing mags or possibly go with a aftermarket self indexing like these, (no affiliation at all) https://www.carm-magazines.com/magazine-for-daystate-air-rifles.aspx. Thats issue number one. The second is the slot in the brass slider in the left photo above limits the throw of the bolt and with it fully removed the bolt handle can travel past 90 degrees so that will have to be dealt with. Not an issue though, as there are a couple of options. Just thought I'd share what I found out today. 

Jking

Good morning Jking

That's a great discovery you have made

What options have you for keeping the bolt handle from traveling over 90 degrees?

And what issues arise when firing the rifle if one does not correct the situation?

Thanks

Ed

One option if so desired would be to fabricate your own piece less the loop on the end so that the end that slides under the magazine and the side remains that limits the bolt throw. Or if you knew for sure you wanted to keep it that way and had the new mags just trim off that same end of the original piece. I think I'd fabricate my own and keep the original intact for future use if needed. 

Another idea might be to drill and tap a small hole in the precise location and use a allen head screw the proper length to limit the bolt throw. I'd have to look at that a little closer to see if it would even be possible. Just thinking. 

Ed, hopefully the shooter would notice the bolt handle sticking straight up but if not it wouldn't be any different than accidentally pulling the trigger with the bolt in the nornal unlatched position. It's happened to me once or twice and it definately gets your attention. You could could definately just remove the actuator but I'd prefer a stop of some sort. 

For me I'm still on the fence about buying additional self actuating style mags and basically giving up the use of the factory mag because I really do have my gun cocking about as good as it can get I think which is very nice..

Jking

 

[SilentSquirrel]

For me I'm still on the fence about buying additional self actuating style mags and basically giving up the use of the factory mag because I really do have my gun cocking about as good as it can get I think which is very nice..

Jking

Thanks Jking

I have a pair of CARM mags for both the 22 & 25

For me they have been very reliable & smooth in operation

No added burden to cocking or inserting the bolt.

The feature I like most is that CARM makes it impossible to fire when the mag has been emptied

You lose a shot; but IMO that's a small price to pay for a great feature

Ed

 

[jking]

Thanks for the feedback and the positive review of the Carm magazines. I think I'll go for it. 

Jking

 

[Malsonb]

Thanks for the info. What a great resource you are. I have the new daystate mags for my huntsman. This is great news and hope to give this a try. Is it hard to remove them and do you have to have all the air discharged? I have used pcp's since the 90's but other than changing fill port and hammer springs; I have not worked on to many pcp's. Thanks for all your info on the Daystate"s

Brian

 

[SilentSquirrel]

Thanks for the feedback and the positive review of the Carm magazines. I think I'll go for it. 

Jking

Jking

Give my regards to Darko when you order

I use his mags & SS trays in a few different guns

He knows me as Edward Cucurello (Hard C's & pronounce those LLs; It's Italian)

If for any reason you don't like his mags when they arrive, PM me.

I will most likely take them off your hands (purchase)

Ed



PS

I have no affiliation with CARM

Simply a very satisfied customer

 

[jking]

Brian,

It's very easy to remove them. You can leave the action mounted in stock and air in the tube also. Remove your scope, remove or fully loosen three allen screw on the barrel clamp at the fill port and slide it forward off the air tube, remove the two sets of allen screws on the top of the reciever, which might be different sizes (two of them might actually be standard and not metric) and the two screws down in the magazine slot. Carefully lift off the barrel and receiver as one part being aware that the trasfer port will be exposed and it'll either be stuck in the upper have (more than likely) as in the top photo or it could be in the valve exhaust port hole. All you need to then is lift out the brass acuator piece, the spring loaded pin and the spring. 

Let us know what you think and keep in mind I had already done a little clean up on the hammer housing, and sliding parts. 



Ed,

I did order a couple of mags a few days ago from Darko, very easy to deal with and quick response to email. Looking forward to giving it all a try. 

PS, I picked up a fish scale at Walmart also, cheap but I can use it get some real numbers on the mod. According to the scale it took 25lbs to cock the Regals last 1/2" of bolt pull. I kept the scales hook as close center as possible. 25lbs sounds like a lot but it is very smooth. I will check it again when I get the mags and remove the indexing actuator. 

Jking

 

[jking]

Just an update on what I decided to do. First I thought re-manufacturing a different slider would be the best but it turned out to be hassle and the end product was less than desirable. I was wanting to go this route so there would be a stop to prevent the bolt handle from going past the unlatched position all the way over to the left handed bolt closed position. It still works though as it's always stationary. 

The simplest modification was just to remove the actuating slider with the spring and pin all together since the new style mags and Carm aftermarker mags don't need the acuation slider. 

So now in order to prevent the bolt from being able to over rotate I fashioned a piece of delrin to act as a stop for the cocking lug and lightly glued into position. 

Totally removing the actuator pieces lowered by pull by about 4 addition pounds. As mention before I had previously gave all the moving and sliding parts some extra attention of smoothing and polishing which reduced the cocking effort and this modification improved it a little more. Right now I'm just shooting with the single shot tray but my new self actuating should be here shortly. 

Jking

 

[SilentSquirrel]

Jking

Thanks for an excellent solution

If I've read back through the the post properly, you have reduced cocking effort from over 25, to 21 lbs.

That's pretty significant

Certainly worth a try next time the 22 is apart, as it cocks more stiffly than the 25 for some reason.

Which glue did you use to secure the Delrin to the metal?

Very curious to see how this works out with the Carm mags.

Ed

 

[jking]

Ed, I used a dab of epoxy after cleaning the hole and piece with degreaser. I tried it the first time without glue thinking it was snug enough to stay put but after a few shots it worked it's way out of the hole and fell down in front of the hammer. Glad thats all it was not letting it fire for a while. 

jking

 

[rjw]

Hm, I have tried all of that including putting in a new magazine actuator but it still persists on regularly jamming the bolt and preventing its full rearward movement before it fully cocks. I have a feeling that the problem might just be associated with the trigger. Anyone else had this problem?

 

[Ydunn.223]

I like what I see here and yes Charm mag is a big improvement