Diana AirKing Accuracy

[Michigander]

I had a RWS-54 in the late 80s. Back then there were only Beeman and RSW pellets. The RWS grouped the best then for longer distances (about 1.5" at 65 yards). Although the last time I shot RWS pellets about 12 years ago, they were absolutely lousy in comparison with JSBs, so the Air-King certainly can do well. It has double-recoil (shooter feels no recoil) so will kill any scope that was not built for it. Need a scope stop too. Do not dry-fire...it can break the spring. It's a unique and very ingenuous rifle design.

The D 54 is now rated for far lower energy than the D 48, 19.2 ft-lb versus 23.6 ft-lb in .22, which makes me wonder if some of the stories of harsh behavior in the 54 are outdated, or assuming 54 behavior to be the same as that of the 48/52. So far my Nikon scope seems to be holding up.

 

[Michigander]

I had a D52 in .22, nearly all of the pellets that I tried (JSB, H&N) would fall out of the barrel, which made it real challenging to load and cock. I contacted Umerex and they said to only use RWS pellets, my reply was I have no use for any rifle that I can only use one brand of pellet, they were nice enough to allow me to exchange it with a D52 in .177 and it shoots great.

I was asked about that for my rifle. I have only tried the JSB 15.9 and 18.1 pellets in 5.52, but both fed smoothly into the breach until contacting the rifling and did not fall out with the rifle vertical. So maybe the problem has been addressed.

 

[Hateful McNasty]

When your shooting off and he sticks are you sitting on a bucket , chair , standing? I mean that last sticks you posyed id take all day outdoor around here... Then i dont ask for much...lol

 

[Michigander]

I use a turkey chair in spite of the fact it is a little hard to get in and out of. Sometimes just a cushion. I like to be low. For a standard springer I position the sticks just in front of the balance point and rest my left elbow behind my left knee, which creates an upright position with very little shoulder pressure. The AirKing I am shooting more like a rimfire, with the sticks at the beartrap latch and leaning forward more with my left elbow in front of my left knee. As always it is whatever works for you.

 

[Hateful McNasty]

That's kool,. I like a more solid firm seat.
Cuts back on unintentional movment and posture.. i dont shoot sticks , but always see that bucket and sticks,bucket and sticks. ..lol.

Well anyway you last posted shots are looking better then the first ..

Keep up the good work.

 

[Str8tshooter]

I use a 3.5 gal bucket with padded lid and bog pod bipod.

 

[Hateful McNasty]

I use a 3.5 gal bucket with padded lid and bog pod bipod

Lol.. there ya go....

I said at first about checking thing loose, so yesterday i was shooting the R9 and not getting tight as normal. I checked stock and all but one thing . So scratch ching my head and wasting pellets wondering whats up now i just reached and turned the globes insert nut and sure enugh it was loose . Now theres not much room for the insert to move but that fraction of a mm it could made a difference. Ya, movment , a fraction of a mm can be a lot down range.. that globe been about like a scope keeping it from sliding on the dovetail.
Anyway dont take much.

 

[Nitrocrushr]

I took one of my 54's out yesterday and shot a couple groups at 30 yards. I had just installed a new transfer port, spring and guide in this rifle so things are still settling in. Energy level was right at 20fpe. A touch over 1.1MOA and I will strive to improve upon that. The groups are nice and uniform as you can see in the group that contained 9 shots.


Steve

 

[Michigander]

That's about as good as it gets! You seem to have tuning the D 54 down to a science. I especially like that you were able to get these results at full power. How much do you attribute to the caliber? A good FT package for sure.

 

[Nitrocrushr]

That's about as good as it gets! You seem to have tuning the D 54 down to a science. I especially like that you were able to get these results at full power. How much do you attribute to the caliber? A good FT package for sure.

Yeah I’m pleased seeing this consistency at 20+ fpe. Not sure about the caliber’s impact on the results. I have a couple D56’s in .177, and now testing this .20. I have no experience with the .22’s for comparison.

Steve

 

[fe7565]

The D 54 is now rated for far lower energy than the D 48, 19.2 ft-lb versus 23.6 ft-lb in .22, which makes me wonder if some of the stories of harsh behavior in the 54 are outdated, or assuming 54 behavior to be the same as that of the 48/52. So far my Nikon scope seems to be holding up.

The 48 and 52 models are not recoilless. They have a recoil in one direction. The 54 is, but it's recoilless because the entire action floats and moves back AND forth. So it is a double-recoil which the shooter does not feel, but the scope does. I had a Made in Japan Tasco that held up to it without any issues for years,.

 

[fe7565]

I took one of my 54's out yesterday and shot a couple groups at 30 yards. I had just installed a new transfer port, spring and guide in this rifle so things are still settling in. Energy level was right at 20fpe. A touch over 1.1MOA and I will strive to improve upon that. The groups are nice and uniform as you can see in the group that contained 9 shots.


Steve

Very nice groups. Wish I had JSBs back in the late 80s!

 

[Michigander]

The 48 and 52 models are not recoilless. They have a recoil in one direction. The 54 is, but it's recoilless because the entire action floats and moves back AND forth. So it is a double-recoil which the shooter does not feel, but the scope does. I had a Made in Japan Tasco that held up to it without any issues for years,.

I don't want to make a big deal out of this, but the motions of 48 and 54 will be the same, what may be different would be the recoiling mass involved. The lower the recoiling mass, the more abrupt the motions. I am not sure what the difference in recoiling mass actually is since the 54 has that extra stuff attached to its receiver, even though the stock is isolated.

In any case, what I was really wondering was whether the 54 used to produce the same power as the 48 and that was where the reputation for being a scope killer came from. Most recent owners are reporting that their scopes seem to be holding up.

 

[1BadDart]

I've never owned a 54, but have shot my buddies in .177, it's a beast. I did have a 48 in .22, it was a certified scope killer. I grinned like a mule eating saw briars when the new owner walked off with it.

 

[fe7565]

I don't want to make a big deal out of this, but the motions of 48 and 54 will be the same, what may be different would be the recoiling mass involved. The lower the recoiling mass, the more abrupt the motions. I am not sure what the difference in recoiling mass actually is since the 54 has that extra stuff attached to its receiver, even though the stock is isolated.

In any case, what I was really wondering was whether the 54 used to produce the same power as the 48 and that was where the reputation for being a scope killer came from. Most recent owners are reporting that their scopes seem to be holding up.

Sorry, but, the 48 and the 54 do not have the same "motions". The 54 has a sled on which the entire action slides, thus the double-recoil...thus the scope-killer. The 48 (and 52) has none of that, both are traditional side-levers cocking non-moving action. https://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2011/05/rws-diana-model-54-recoilless-rifle-part-1/

 

[Hateful McNasty]

Sorry, but, the 48 and the 54 do not have the same "motions". The 54 has a sled on which the entire action slides, thus the double-recoil...thus the scope-killer. The 48 (and 52) has none of that, both are traditional side-levers cocking non-moving action. https://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2011/05/rws-diana-model-54-recoilless-rifle-part-1/

Hmmm.. i thought the recoil reduction "sled" action was to prevent vs soild mounted receivers.. so should save a scope . Then i guess it could botyom out and slam in each direction as well.

Figured hector would have a thing on it like a mod or adjustment to better "tune" it..

 

[fe7565]

Hmmm.. i thought the recoil reduction "sled" action was to prevent vs soild mounted receivers.. so should save a scope . Then i guess it could botyom out and slam in each direction as well.

Figured hector would have a thing on it like a mod or adjustment to better "tune" it..

Agree, Hector would be the best person to consult with.

 

[Hateful McNasty]

I guess he doesn't do much here like at G+@?

 

[Michigander]

Recoil action obeys conservation of momentum. As the piston and spring jump forward, the rest of the rifle moves back with a velocity that is lower by the ratio of the two masses. As the piston and spring slow down (deaccelerate) the rest of the rifle also slows down, and both come to rest at the same time (ignoring the effect of pellet momentum). If the piston bounces back, then the rest of the rifle must jump forward, producing the surge effect. In other words, you can visualize what the rifle is doing during recoil by knowing what the piston and spring are doing, the same motion, but in the opposite direction and with lower magnitude.

What I call the rest of the rifle above is everything minus the piston and spring in the 48, and the sled mounted mass minus the piston and spring in the 54 since the stock is isolated.

What is hard on the scope are the accelerations and deaccelerations during firing. When the piston is suddenly accelerated forward, the rest of the rifle is suddenly accelerated back, when the piston comes to an abrupt stop, the rest of the rifle also comes to a sudden stop. You can see this in videos of sled motion. It is this bidirectional acceleration/deacceleration that is hard on scopes and different from what happens in firearms where the recoil is one direction only. The surge motion, if it is present, is not needed to produce the two direction loading of scope elements.

Finally, a thought experiment. Take a rifle like the D 54, fire it and observe the motion. Now lock its sled, mount the stock on a sled of its own and fire it again. Do you expect the types of motions to be different, or just lower in magnitude because of the added mass?

 

[Hateful McNasty]

I was thinking travel and i guess spring load of the sled..

Is it too soft and long can that action be tuned? Seems you should need the minimum amount of travel and resistance to dampen or cushion the recoil force.. i just dont know seeing i aint got one to play with.. my hatsan 25 pistol uses that sled action but never mounted a optic on it. Heck it may shake it apart just as fast as one with out ..? I figured i could google the 54 and find stuff on tuning the sled of one or a mod but not much .