Oh, I've messed with a few carbs in my life, generally not to the betterment of the outcome.OK, guess I just dated myself eh.
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Do Regulators need constant adjustment or maintenance?
- Thread starter Mr.Gadgets
- Start date
Autos…May they bring back mechanical turn-key ignitions and analog gauges, not the simulated dash boards and other useless blinking features for failure. Speaking of feature for failure, did I mention the spinning wheels found on some Airgun websites?
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I didnt just turn screws. I had drill bits, and all kinds of different sized jets, power valves, and some parts that I don't even have names for.
And I had pretty good luck with my tinkering. Probably better than what I have someties with my regulated PCPs.
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I had the horrible mistake of messing with Carter, well A Carter 4bbl on my Corsair Monza 140, darn thing would only do 130, which for the rallies I drove it in was enough.I didnt just turn screws. I had drill bits, and all kinds of different sized jets, power valves, and some parts that I don't even have names for.
And I had pretty good luck with my tinkering. Probably better than what I have someties with my regulated PCPs.
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Back when Carbs were the thing? I rebuilt them by the HUNDREDS!
Blue Printed them and all that. Made REAL good money doing that for the Drag and Street Racers.
Carter's, Hollies, Quadrajets. Didn't matter.
Blue Printed them and all that. Made REAL good money doing that for the Drag and Street Racers.
Carter's, Hollies, Quadrajets. Didn't matter.
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I have 4 regulated PCPs, all inexpensive, and have done exactly zero maintenance on their regulators. I have changed their setting in 3 of the 4 but the most accurate one is still set where I got it. With my unregulated PCP I spent a lot of time trying different hammer spring settings at different fill pressures and different transfer port size to find a tune with good accuracy, power, and reasonable shot count. Took lots of shots because you pretty much need to get a whole shot string. Takes time and pellets. With my regulated PCPs I have mainly changed the regulator setting to achieve the best accuracy I can get from that gun. At each regulator setting I have to vary hammer spring force to see what works best. But it requires much less shots since I know velocity will be consistent, I just want to know what the accuracy looks like. A few 5 shots groups give me a pretty good idea.
My P35s have the regulator inside the airtube and it takes me less than 30 minutes to change the setting. I have to depressurize the gun, remove the nut on the gauge end of the airtube, then loosen a 12mm lock nut on the regulator and turn the slotted screw head on the regulator. Tighter means lower regulator pressure, looser increases it. Then tighten the lock nut and put the nut back on the end of the airtube and fill it with air. With the O-rings it came with I had to change them every time I took the big nut off but with the "Mr. O-ring" rings I've had the nut out of my 177 now three times without changing them. But it's a really good idea to have some on-hand. I don't take the action out of the stock or the scope off the gun or anything like that. No need.
I prefer regulated guns because I get much less velocity variation and more shots per fill. I don't see any difference in the maintenance required. O-rings are what goes bad and need replaced. There are O-rings on the outside of the regulators but I've never had to change those. If you change the regulator setting the way I described above you are not disturbing the O-rings on the regulator. It's always been the O-ring sealing the big nut on the end of the air tube or the little O-ring that makes the one-way fill valve that have needed replaced.
My P35s have the regulator inside the airtube and it takes me less than 30 minutes to change the setting. I have to depressurize the gun, remove the nut on the gauge end of the airtube, then loosen a 12mm lock nut on the regulator and turn the slotted screw head on the regulator. Tighter means lower regulator pressure, looser increases it. Then tighten the lock nut and put the nut back on the end of the airtube and fill it with air. With the O-rings it came with I had to change them every time I took the big nut off but with the "Mr. O-ring" rings I've had the nut out of my 177 now three times without changing them. But it's a really good idea to have some on-hand. I don't take the action out of the stock or the scope off the gun or anything like that. No need.
I prefer regulated guns because I get much less velocity variation and more shots per fill. I don't see any difference in the maintenance required. O-rings are what goes bad and need replaced. There are O-rings on the outside of the regulators but I've never had to change those. If you change the regulator setting the way I described above you are not disturbing the O-rings on the regulator. It's always been the O-ring sealing the big nut on the end of the air tube or the little O-ring that makes the one-way fill valve that have needed replaced.
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I also prefer fuel injection on cars. I've rebuilt carberators on car and boat motors and need to do one on a chain saw now. But I've never had to do anything on my fuel injected cars other than replace an injector. And that is very rare. I also have a gas powered generator that doesn't work right now and I am pretty sure it is the carberator. It's not that they are so difficult to maintain. It's that they need attention too often IMHO. Fuel injected cars (and boat motors) start easier, run better, and take less maintenance. But this is off-topic.
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Interesting Topic
As said an interesting topic, even for myself an Old School retired mechanic (carb vintage era) no offense
My understanding on a unregulated pcp, after a pellet, and desired pressure selection is made, a launched pellet tends to reach a certain flat level on the power curve (or arc) that one tries to capture, then document and attempt to replicate this flat level find to the regulator
In doing so, have a few questions,:
After regulator install the gauge will read plenum pressure and not fill pressure,
so ones fill unit pump gauge will be the only indicator on it's full pressure,
then after a few dry shots to seat the regulator there's no telling how much pressure is left, unless topping it off again ?
At what pressure should the gauge show after a 3000psi fill if the regulator has a 120 bar setting (1740psi) ?
Feel the guessing game is where the pressure was when it reached this ideal level of performance ?
Dealing to replicate this desired level of performance w/o a chronograph can become quite a challenge.
So in closing,
Anything added or corrected will be appreciated
Bill
One more thing on the carburetor,
Understanding the modern technology that we have in our vehicles that spoil us today,
Brings back the simplicity of an old puddle Jumper I owned back in the 60's
Ya, this thing would get better then 40 plus mpg, Air Cooled and had a carburetor
Was very simple to work on and fun to drive. Well if you haven't guessed it,
Ya! Was 1961 VW beetle something of the past that would never pass inspections today
Hard to believe how far we've come with computer technology, noticing now installing a board in PCP rifles
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If you add a regulator to a gun that did not have one, it depends on where the pressure gauge gets air which pressure it will read. But normally I would think it still would tell you the main air supply pressure. My P35s came regulated but only have one gauge on the air tube. You have to shoot over a chronograph and note the pressure on the air tube gauge when the velocity falls. That is your regulator setting.
Chronographs are a basic tuning item for airguns IMHO. I use little inexpensive chinese made ones that work better than the shooting chrony I used to use. They cost about $20. Amazon and Aliexpress are sources I have used.
Most of my regulator changes have not changed accuracy much if at all. But I put a "power plenum" on my P35-25 and tuned it up from about 32 fpe to almost 50 fpe and it shoots a LOT better now. I did not really expect it, I thought I would have to change the barrel to get it to shoot well. Sometimes you get lucky and find a setup the gun really likes. Or you have to know more than I do so it isn't so much a shot in the dark.
I wouldn't want to go back to carberators but my modern cars annoy me sometimes. I lost an alternator on my BMW and it started honking the horn, activating the windshield wipers on its own and all kinds of goofy activity. I knew the battery needed replaced or something but thought I could drive to walmart and get one. Not in my BMW. It did it's nonsense and then shut down and had to be towed. Old cars would run until the battery voltage got so low it couldn't support the spark plugs making a spark. Not the case for the new ones.
Chronographs are a basic tuning item for airguns IMHO. I use little inexpensive chinese made ones that work better than the shooting chrony I used to use. They cost about $20. Amazon and Aliexpress are sources I have used.
Most of my regulator changes have not changed accuracy much if at all. But I put a "power plenum" on my P35-25 and tuned it up from about 32 fpe to almost 50 fpe and it shoots a LOT better now. I did not really expect it, I thought I would have to change the barrel to get it to shoot well. Sometimes you get lucky and find a setup the gun really likes. Or you have to know more than I do so it isn't so much a shot in the dark.
I wouldn't want to go back to carberators but my modern cars annoy me sometimes. I lost an alternator on my BMW and it started honking the horn, activating the windshield wipers on its own and all kinds of goofy activity. I knew the battery needed replaced or something but thought I could drive to walmart and get one. Not in my BMW. It did it's nonsense and then shut down and had to be towed. Old cars would run until the battery voltage got so low it couldn't support the spark plugs making a spark. Not the case for the new ones.
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Hey Jim
Appreciate your input,
as for the gauged tube pressure,
it's my understanding when a regulator is installed, it will change and only read plenum pressure.
My question was adjustment changes to the regulator should it change bar gauge readings ?
Building a better mouse trap may not always turn out as expected,
Advanced technology in our vehicles may have excellent features, until they start to turn into a cost factor for repairs
going a little further back in time, vehicles had a magneto ignition, where once started never needed a battery to run,
may still find them on older farm tractors
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