First Time PCP Buyer Help // Pesting // Lead Free

[whatsapcp]

The Hatsan Jet will require a moderator to meet the OP's requirements, it's ear ringing loud. I get 14 consistant shots out of my 22 cal Jet 1. Hand pumping the Jet to 3600 psi is not pleasant for those who do not have sufficient body mass. At 150 lbs, anything over 3700 psi (tested on a Leshiy 2) is not possible in my book without a weight vest. After a couple of weeks of pumping I caved and bought a bottle just for the Jet as it's not worth firing up the Yong Heng contraption to fill a 40cc reservoir.

Caveats mentioned above aside, the Jet's surperb little package and dirt cheap. I think every serious airgun enthusiast should own one. It's perfect for starlings, rats, pigeons & squirrels at backyard ranges. There's a thread on it here and also one on GTA for further reading.

Last thought, beware of scopecreep. The perfect number of airguns is n+1....

Lol, missed the second page before the last post. Prods are very hand pump friendly, 33 fairly easy strokes for 21 shots. Perfect for slighter builds. I think the Jet's the next evolution of the Prod concept provided you have the umph for the air.

Apparently AGN no longer allows embeding links to outside image hosting. :-( I pay for storage so the photos I have posted online to help others won't disappear. Here's a link to a photo of my Prod and one of my Jet. Both have slings to be used Rhodesian style when pesting.

Scopecreep - thanks for all of the indepth considerations. I would definitely have trouble hand pumping the Jet! I will slot that into a "AGN has hyped this, so I should probably own one at some point" category. Your Prod and Jet look awesome. I love how versatile the Prod platform is!

another not too expensive one i use for similar uses is my stoeger xm1 in .177 combined with the bigger transferport i get around 26 joules with h&n barracuda greens, and up to almost 100 yards great accuracy. small tank so easy to pump etc only downside id say is the no half unf threads, but any decent gunsmith should be able to do that for you for less than 50 bucks, you just lose the "useless" shroud and open sights. ive had this done and its a tack driver, also with the nsa 12.5 grains slugs

I was looking into the XM1 and the XM1 Bullshark yesterday. Sounds like they are the USA SPA clones, which I have been eyeing a lot lately. I keep almost taking the plunge on an SPA offering, but then have read enough horror stories to stop the purchase. (At this point, I think I've read every thread on AGN and GTA with the mention of "p12/p15/p35"). Thanks for the review of your gun.

@whatsapcp One of the cool things about the Prod illustrated here is that it has awesome aftermarket support. You can modify the Prod over time to become what you want it to be, or leave it stock. @scopecreep... has gone with making the Prod a super short, lightweight gun. Here are my two Prods and I went a different direction.

Edit: The option for embedding a picture is greyed out at the moment, so here's a link to where I posted it elsewhere.

https://www.airgunnation.com/attachments/pxl_20230115_054206522-2-jpg.323253/

Thanks for sharing pics! I have been browsing all the different Prod build threads on AGN. Love the versatility.

Just got into PCP's myself and went with an Avenger in .22. Have a Four Uncles pump and that works fine but I don't shoot all day. I added a Yong Heng in my shop and just started filling with that. At 180cc it's quite fast. Hand pumping is not terrible. Tank is next on my list so I can top off in the house.

Good luck.

The Avenger is a really good looking gun.

Just pick up a NOTOS and you will be ready to go, right out of the box. Buy a PROD and spend another $200 turning it into a carbine or pay $265 and it is a done deal. IMHO the NOTOS is a much better pistol/carbine than the PROD. It obsoletes the PROD.

Umarex Notos | PCP Carbine Air Rifle | Pyramyd AIR

The Umarex Notos is a lightweight pcp carbine air rifle that gets 700 fps/13 fpe and can be used for small game hunting.

www.pyramydair.com

The Notos is definitely holding my interest. I like that I can spend around $300 and get a full setup (gun, ironsights, pump) that will get me plinking and thinking about what I really want next. Tempting.

My research led me across the NP03 that everyone picked up for $250 a few months back. I wish I hadn't missed that! Looked like a sweet package.

 

[outdooorgb]

The Avenger is a tad loud but easily tamed with a Buck Rail moderator...$24

I may try a higher end moderator just for giggles.

 

[MJS]

Another vote for the P-rod. I bought one and figured it would just be a good plinker. It turned out to be much more capable than that. With a red dot or a cheap scope it is very accurate to 40 yards. Also very reliable...mine hasn't leaked since I bought it in '19. No need for a regulator with the P-rod as shot strings are very consistent. I get 30 decent shots per fill. It's quiet and easy to hand pump. Mine is stone stock in carbine form.

 

[usawood]

Are you wanting a Traditional "Long gun" or "Bullpup"?

The Avenger is a Great starter PCP.
You have the ability to Easily tune the gun since it's regulated
They are very accurate guns.
I consider them backyard friendly out of the box, but you can always add a moderator with an adapter if needed.
Side lever cocking
Good shot count
Cheap mags if you want to add more to the pile, and you will.. Lol

no parts! try to order a seal kit from Air venturi or a new regulator.

 

[124nut]

Scopecreep - thanks for all of the indepth considerations. I would definitely have trouble hand pumping the Jet! I will slot that into a "AGN has hyped this, so I should probably own one at some point" category. Your Prod and Jet look awesome. I love how versatile the Prod platform is!



I was looking into the XM1 and the XM1 Bullshark yesterday. Sounds like they are the USA SPA clones, which I have been eyeing a lot lately. I keep almost taking the plunge on an SPA offering, but then have read enough horror stories to stop the purchase. (At this point, I think I've read every thread on AGN and GTA with the mention of "p12/p15/p35"). Thanks for the review of your gun.



Thanks for sharing pics! I have been browsing all the different Prod build threads on AGN. Love the versatility.



The Avenger is a really good looking gun.



The Notos is definitely holding my interest. I like that I can spend around $300 and get a full setup (gun, ironsights, pump) that will get me plinking and thinking about what I really want next. Tempting.

My research led me across the NP03 that everyone picked up for $250 a few months back. I wish I hadn't missed that! Looked like a sweet package.

I ordered a Notos but will have to wait a few weeks for them to be back in stock. Wish I would have got my order in earlier. From what I've read they are good shooters.

 

[JimD]

My first PCP was a Marauder pistol in 2020 after I retired. If it was my only PCP I would probably still be hand pumping it. It only stores 60cc (or is it 66cc?) of air which makes it easy to pump but limits your number of full power shots. Maximum fill is 3000 and with a stock tune you probably will not want to fill it that far. It is my only PCP I haven't messed with the trigger on or modified to get it more quiet. I did modify it for a little more power. I can get 20 fpe out of mine but only for less than one magazine. So I have it set to about 18 fpe and I get almost three mags near this power level. With the stock tune you can probably get 4. Mine is accurate and short and it is my lightest PCP at 5 lbs with it's Hawke Vantage 2-7 scope. As has been stated, it's around 1 pump stroke per shot to refill it. Easily less than 50 pump strokes. You have to do it fairly often if you are plinking or target shooting but at least it's easy.

Next I got an Avenger in 25 caliber. Whole new experience. I think I only hand pumped it to 300 bar once. Hundreds of pump strokes are required, even for a fill to around 3000 psi. That encouraged me to get a Yong Heng and then a used SCBA tank. My Avenger is tuned to over 40 fpe which is a power level the 25 reaches easily. A 22 should get there. But you don't really need 40 plus fpe to get a decent trajectory or smack squirrels or target shoot/plink. With hevy 25 grain pellets you do have to get up there a bit, however to drive them over 800 fps. But in a 22, low to mid 30s is plenty.

My favorite PCPs are my three P35s. All worked fine out of the box. I got the first one in October of 2021 (another 25 caliber) and got the others in June of 2022. The 22 is the most accurate. I think the parts are really sized for a 22. I have twice put three Baracuda Match in the same exact hole at 25 yards with it. It is not pellet fussy and the regulator will hold a 16ES over 30 shots, the most I've tested. SD was under 4 if I remember right. My other P35s and my Avenger are worse than this but still very usable. I have adjusted the triggers and polished the crowns with JBs paste on a brass screw. I've had to change a few O-rings in the 25 due to my error and my change of the regulator (to slow it down with FTTs) but they've been essentially trouble free guns. It seems to me that the most negative comments on these guns come from people that purchased them several years ago. I see significant differences between my 25 and my other two that were made less than a year apart. I think SPA has improved.

A P35 is a P15 with side (instead of rear) cocking. The P15 stock is beech, however, and the P35 is plastic. The P15 is less than 4.5 lbs where the P35 is a bit over 5 lbs. I shoot left handed so it was no contest, I wanted the P35. But the top cocking rod of the P35 pushes the scope up quite high so you will shoot under your target until about 20 yards. That is common to bullpups but a bit worse on a P35. The Stoeger Bullshark is heavier still at 6 lbs, has a different plastic stock, a 19.25 inch barrel (instead of 450mm or about 18 inches) and less space in the shroud. But the bullshark comes with a 1/2 UNF fitting on the shroud for a moderator (the P15 and P35 don't but DonnyFL sells them). The P15 and P35 can be easily quieted with either a hair curler mod or an in shroud printed moderator. I've done both. Because of the limited space getting a bullshark to the same level of noise means either a moderator sticking out of the shroud or the shroud slide forward about 3 inches (versus 1.5 inches for a P15 or P35). A major advantage of the bullshark is you can buy it from a U. S. distributor.

A Prod is a nicely made simple PCP from a U. S. manufacturer who is good about supplying parts. It is accurate and ideal in my mind for hand pumping. All my others are not so great to get parts for and were made in China. I like them all but I like the P35s the most. I get about 100 shots per fill from the 177 and 60-70 for the 22 and 25. It would take hundreds of strokes on a hand pump to fill them but it definitely could be done. You only have to fill them above the regulator pressure so you don't have to go to 250 bar. My regs are all under 150 bar.

 

[whatsapcp]

My first PCP was a Marauder pistol in 2020 after I retired. If it was my only PCP I would probably still be hand pumping it. It only stores 60cc (or is it 66cc?) of air which makes it easy to pump but limits your number of full power shots. Maximum fill is 3000 and with a stock tune you probably will not want to fill it that far. It is my only PCP I haven't messed with the trigger on or modified to get it more quiet. I did modify it for a little more power. I can get 20 fpe out of mine but only for less than one magazine. So I have it set to about 18 fpe and I get almost three mags near this power level. With the stock tune you can probably get 4. Mine is accurate and short and it is my lightest PCP at 5 lbs with it's Hawke Vantage 2-7 scope. As has been stated, it's around 1 pump stroke per shot to refill it. Easily less than 50 pump strokes. You have to do it fairly often if you are plinking or target shooting but at least it's easy.

Next I got an Avenger in 25 caliber. Whole new experience. I think I only hand pumped it to 300 bar once. Hundreds of pump strokes are required, even for a fill to around 3000 psi. That encouraged me to get a Yong Heng and then a used SCBA tank. My Avenger is tuned to over 40 fpe which is a power level the 25 reaches easily. A 22 should get there. But you don't really need 40 plus fpe to get a decent trajectory or smack squirrels or target shoot/plink. With hevy 25 grain pellets you do have to get up there a bit, however to drive them over 800 fps. But in a 22, low to mid 30s is plenty.

My favorite PCPs are my three P35s. All worked fine out of the box. I got the first one in October of 2021 (another 25 caliber) and got the others in June of 2022. The 22 is the most accurate. I think the parts are really sized for a 22. I have twice put three Baracuda Match in the same exact hole at 25 yards with it. It is not pellet fussy and the regulator will hold a 16ES over 30 shots, the most I've tested. SD was under 4 if I remember right. My other P35s and my Avenger are worse than this but still very usable. I have adjusted the triggers and polished the crowns with JBs paste on a brass screw. I've had to change a few O-rings in the 25 due to my error and my change of the regulator (to slow it down with FTTs) but they've been essentially trouble free guns. It seems to me that the most negative comments on these guns come from people that purchased them several years ago. I see significant differences between my 25 and my other two that were made less than a year apart. I think SPA has improved.

A P35 is a P15 with side (instead of rear) cocking. The P15 stock is beech, however, and the P35 is plastic. The P15 is less than 4.5 lbs where the P35 is a bit over 5 lbs. I shoot left handed so it was no contest, I wanted the P35. But the top cocking rod of the P35 pushes the scope up quite high so you will shoot under your target until about 20 yards. That is common to bullpups but a bit worse on a P35. The Stoeger Bullshark is heavier still at 6 lbs, has a different plastic stock, a 19.25 inch barrel (instead of 450mm or about 18 inches) and less space in the shroud. But the bullshark comes with a 1/2 UNF fitting on the shroud for a moderator (the P15 and P35 don't but DonnyFL sells them). The P15 and P35 can be easily quieted with either a hair curler mod or an in shroud printed moderator. I've done both. Because of the limited space getting a bullshark to the same level of noise means either a moderator sticking out of the shroud or the shroud slide forward about 3 inches (versus 1.5 inches for a P15 or P35). A major advantage of the bullshark is you can buy it from a U. S. distributor.

A Prod is a nicely made simple PCP from a U. S. manufacturer who is good about supplying parts. It is accurate and ideal in my mind for hand pumping. All my others are not so great to get parts for and were made in China. I like them all but I like the P35s the most. I get about 100 shots per fill from the 177 and 60-70 for the 22 and 25. It would take hundreds of strokes on a hand pump to fill them but it definitely could be done. You only have to fill them above the regulator pressure so you don't have to go to 250 bar. My regs are all under 150 bar.

I've read just about every post of yours regarding the P35! Lots of great info, thanks for sharing.

 

[whatsapcp]

After lots of thinking and silly amounts of research and rabbit holes, I figured I would update the thread:

Current plans are to pickup a Notos when they come back in stock, along with a hand pump. This will get me shooting and messing with a PCP that people are having good results with, and the price is right.

If a great deal on another gun pops up, I may jump on it (like a cheap Prod that was collecting dust in someones safe!).

If I end up really enjoying the PCP world, I'll drop some more money. I already have a bucket list of like 20 guns thanks to this forum

Thanks everyone for helping out!

 

[Godlike1125]

Hey everyone! First post, but I've been lurking for years.

I've been interested in getting into PCP rifles for a long time, but I always find a reason to not purchase one (not enough time to shoot, too much initial investment, too many options, new tech constantly coming out, whatever random thing to stop the purchase).

A few friends recently got into them and I am done with excuses! I need help picking a rifle, and I was hoping the forum could help out.

Current Plans:
My main use will be pesting rats, starlings, and pigeons. I intend to only shoot lead-free.

Budget:
I don't want to go over $500 for the rifle. I know that puts me into a lower budget for lots of the nice PCPs out there... but I want to make sure I like using a PCP before going further. When you add in scopes, fill tanks/pumps/compressors, the money just goes higher and higher. I'd love to get away with hand pumping for a while if I can (depending on gun).

What I've Looked at:
I've almost bought a P15 several times over the last few years. They seem like great guns for the price. I see there is a P35 now that looks like an upgraded model, but I haven't found many reviews comparing the two.

I'm also seeing options like the Hatsan Flashpup, or AEA Challenger that look pretty great for the price. The new Umarex Notos also looks like a ton of fun from recent threads!

Nice to Have:
These aren't deal breakers, but I'd love to have a super quiet/backyard friendly gun, that I can fill with a handpump.

That's where I'm at! I don't feel strongly about a caliber... 22 sounds fun. The only airgun I've personally owned is a Benjamin 397 in .177, so this is a whole new world for me.

Thanks!

You can get one as low as $240 from PA. There you go!

 

[whatsapcp]

You can get one as low as $240 from PA. There you go!

View attachment 340112

I had to go to PA and look in the refurbs to see what was $250 to identify the gun, haha.

For any other noobs interested: it is an Air Venturi Avenger