Forced Kneeling

[Cloud9AG]

Just FYI, I am the MD that has the German WWII tank targets and one of them is coming towards the shooter and it can only be knocked over by shooting down the barrel. I don't plan on retiring any of the targets at ASC matches anytime soon. You lost me on this one too Ron, but we can still be friends.

 

[AirNGasman]

Just FYI, I am the MD that has the German WWII tank targets and one of them is coming towards the shooter and it can only be knocked over by shooting down the barrel. I don't plan on retiring any of the targets at ASC matches anytime soon. You lost me on this one too Ron, but we can still be friends.
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Just FYI...




The misses on that target are ALL MINE!

 

[Cloud9AG]

Just FYI...




The misses on that target are ALL MINE!

And that makes me want to continue to use them. They are your kryptonite! Can’t believe I actually discovered one of your weaknesses! LOL

 

[AirNGasman]

And that makes me want to continue to use them. They are your kryptonite! Can’t believe I actually discovered one of your weaknesses! LOL

FYI- those targets are a weakness of mine; but buxom red-heads are my kryptonite!Can't seem to hit ANYTHING in their presence; much less my clever pick-up lines.

Why don't you mess me up with a few of those, Jeff? BTW, I don't mean targets of buxom red-heads; rather, score-keepers.

 

[zx10wall]

And that makes me want to continue to use them. They are your kryptonite! Can’t believe I actually discovered one of your weaknesses! LOL

His TRUE kryptonite are midget strippers

 

[scotton]

Just FYI, I am the MD that has the German WWII tank targets and one of them is coming towards the shooter and it can only be knocked over by shooting down the barrel. I don't plan on retiring any of the targets at ASC matches anytime soon. You lost me on this one too Ron, but we can still be friends.
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And I'm the idiot that has to keep painting them. I mean, look at that fine Sharpie detail work. I may have missed my calling.

Now that I think about it, let's do 4 basic animal silhouettes, painted solid yellow with black paddles. That would make my life much easier. I'm selfish enough to make people shoot boring targets if it saves me 15 minutes at painting time.

FYI- those targets are a weakness of mine; but buxom red-heads are my kryptonite!Can't seem to hit ANYTHING in their presence; much less my clever pick-up lines.

Why don't you mess me up with a few of those, Jeff? BTW, I don't mean targets of buxom red-heads; rather, score-keepers.

Hey, Jeff, you thinkin what I'm thinkin?

 

[Franklink]

Why not just make a “Seniors” class? I believe other shooting sports have them.

While I'm typically against more classes and certainly in favor of actually consolidating the already thoroughly diluted pool of shooters into one or two classes (modified Open and WFTF)....a senior class is everything Ron is asking for. He wants age-based exceptions made? welp, a senior class would be hitting that nail squarely on the head.

 

[AirNGasman]

While I'm typically against more classes and certainly in favor of actually consolidating the already thoroughly diluted pool of shooters into one or two classes (modified Open and WFTF)....a senior class is everything Ron is asking for. He wants age-based exceptions made? welp, a senior class would be hitting that nail squarely on the head.

"a senior class is everything Ron is asking for. He wants age-based exceptions made?"

Nope; you're not listening, FL. I am neither asking for a Senior class, nor an age-based exception.

But rather than RE-explain what I'm PROPOSING, it's all there for your reading pleasure in the 14 pages of this thread.

BTW, please stop misrepresenting my proposals.

 

[AirNGasman]

And I'm the idiot that has to keep painting them. I mean, look at that fine Sharpie detail work. I may have missed my calling.

Now that I think about it, let's do 4 basic animal silhouettes, painted solid yellow with black paddles. That would make my life much easier. I'm selfish enough to make people shoot boring targets if it saves me 15 minutes at painting time.

Hey, Jeff, you thinkin what I'm thinkin?

No, Scott. Don't think you can talk Jeff into helping convince me to dress up like a buxom red-head so you can body-paint me!

I think Jeff likes brunettes.

 

[Franklink]

"a senior class is everything Ron is asking for. He wants age-based exceptions made?"

Nope; you're not listening, FL. I am neither asking for a Senior class, nor an age-based exception.

But rather than RE-explain what I'm PROPOSING, it's all there for your reading pleasure in the 14 pages of this thread.

BTW, please stop misrepresenting my proposals.

YOU quoted "ageism."

You ARE asking for an age-based exception, just not calling it that. A rose by any other name......

You want the rules changed to accommodate older shooters, youve said as much yourself. Potato, puhtato.

A senior class accomplishes exactly what you want, just not in the way you want. So we're back to you wanting to have your cake and eat it too

By your own admission, senior shooters can't hang with youngsters with current kneeler rules. So let the senior shooters compete against other likewise "handicapped" shooters, even if the handicap is a choice like you also admitted it is for you.

 

[AirNGasman]

YOU quoted "ageism."

You ARE asking for an age-based exception, just not calling it that. A rose by any other name......

You want the rules changed to accommodate older shooters, youve said as much yourself. Potato, puhtato.

A senior class accomplishes exactly what you want, just not in the way you want. So we're back to you wanting to have your cake and eat it too

By your own admission, senior shooters can't hang with youngsters with current kneeler rules. So let the senior shooters compete against other likewise "handicapped" shooters, even if the handicap is a choice like you also admitted it is for you.

Perhaps I should have used fewer compound sentences in my posts.

 

[Franklink]

You're not as sly as you like to think yourself.

We can all see that this is a self serving attempt to continue to be able to win matches, and doing so without needing to kneel. You don't like the senior class option because that places you in your own group, outside of the rest of the field of competitors, and where a win wouldn't mean as much since you shot the course the easier way.

Hence why I say you're wanting to have your cake and eat it too. You want an exception made, but don't want to be excluded/segregated into a scarlet letter labeled senior class.

You are not proposing it as an exception, but rather a rule change. Regardless of the framing, this proposed rule change would constitute an exception. Ie something that benefits you specifically.

 

[AirNGasman]

You're not as sly as you like to think yourself.

We can all see that this is a self serving attempt to continue to be able to win matches, and doing so without needing to kneel. You don't like the senior class option because that places you in your own group, outside of the rest of the field of competitors, and where a win wouldn't mean as much since you shot the course the easier way.

Hence why I say you're wanting to have your cake and eat it too. You want an exception made, but don't want to be excluded/segregated into a scarlet letter labeled senior class.

You are not proposing it as an exception, but rather a rule change. Regardless of the framing, this proposed rule change would constitute an exception. Ie something that benefits you specifically.

"You're not as sly as you like to think yourself."

If you're considering becoming a professional mentalist specializing in reading minds FL, I suggest you not quit your day job. You're no better at reading minds than reading forum posts. But thank you for again allowing me to restate the truths about my proposal.

1) Like my proposal, handicap parking spaces and wheelchair ramps don't accommodate only seniors.
2) I have several FT friends that are not senior, yet are unable to assume the kneeling position. I suspect you do also.
3) In seeking accommodation for them and seniors I serve not just myself, but the greater good of not only a large and growing percentage of FT shooters, but consequently ALSO the greater good of Field Target. Yes, 1/3 or more is a large percentage.
4) I don't mind a Senior class option; that already exists.
5) I'm proposing neither an exception, nor a rule change.
6) I am proposing an accommodation in the existing Kneeling rules for a large percentage of FT shooters. That accommodation would have no negative impact on anyone; only positive.
7) I/We seek no advantage.
8) I/We request ONLY no disadvantage.
9) Just as wheelchair ramps are also used by non-seniors and non-handicaps, so, also, would able-bodied FT shooters be welcome to use my proposed accommodation. It excludes no-one.
10) It's there for those that need it, and those that prefer it. Hence, NO-ONE loses due to disadvantage(s).
11) I still win at least my share of FT matches, despite shooting Kneeling lanes offhand.
12) I will continue doing so.

Happy Shooting,
R

 

[Franklink]

No mentalist skills necessary to see that you think yourself quite clever.

Whether you view ft as a sport or as a hunting simulation, either way I've never seen a wheelchair ramp on a sports field or while out hunting.

Thanks for laying out your proposal yet again. Those less stubborn (or perhaps more intelligent) bailed on this discussion after the first 8 or 10 times you tried to sell it as something other than what it is. It's a challenge for me to not speak up when I see someone lobbying for self-serving "accomodations "

 

[Solo1]

Good lord did everyone in this thread walk up hill both ways to school in 3’ of snow? Don’t believe some of you

 

[Franklink]

Good lord did everyone in this thread walk up hill both ways to school in 3’ of snow? Don’t believe some of you

Lol, "back in my day" we had to shoot some of the shots in a field target match KNEELING!!! Can you believe the absurdity of that?!?! Only the most spry of us could manage to contort themselves into the kneeling position (yeah, one knee on the ground, it was brutal). Of course that was back before all the lanes were wheelchair accessible and before there were porters to carry you gun and gear from one lane to the next.

 

[Solo1]

Lol, "back in my day" we had to shoot some of the shots in a field target match KNEELING!!! Can you believe the absurdity of that?!?! Only the most spry of us could manage to contort themselves into the kneeling position (yeah, one knee on the ground, it was brutal). Of course that was back before all the lanes were wheelchair accessible and before there were porters to carry you gun and gear from one lane to the next.

Yea the last time i went i forgot the battery for my remote actually had to push my rig from lane to lane so much trouble when you can’t just sit there and remote drive your rig to the land and line up the shot on the ipad!

 

[Garrettkq]

Lol, "back in my day" we had to shoot some of the shots in a field target match KNEELING!!! Can you believe the absurdity of that?!?! Only the most spry of us could manage to contort themselves into the kneeling position (yeah, one knee on the ground, it was brutal). Of course that was back before all the lanes were wheelchair accessible and before there were porters to carry you gun and gear from one lane to the next.

Funny part about it is that I hear that EXACT same thing about Prone.... "back in the day can you believe i actually had to shoot FT laying on my belly" "I could barely get up" Hahahah (and now eHFT [lots o prone] is the hot thing in europe)

 

[steve123]

OT a bit but I have a interesting story. Years ago when I would set up the FT courses I strayed from the norm and made "ONE" lane that required using 4 positions, so one shot was offhand, one kneeling, one sitting, and one prone. Yuh know just for the fun of it to break things up a bit and man did it do so but not like I thought it would.

Some of the older shooters actually thought I was purposely discriminating against them when in all honesty I hadn't considered the difficultly they would have getting into prone. That's one shot out of 40 mind you.

They banded together and got a hold of the club officers which got me in hot water but darn it somehow they wouldn't fire me. Kinda like like when my wife tells me I'm welcome to fire her if I don't like her cooking, lol.
Literally some never came back to our Mormon lake match in spite of my email of apology for not considering their physical limitations and a promise to not do such a thing again?!

Well alrighty then back to our scheduled programming.

 

[Franklink]

Thanks for sharing @steve123. I disagree though, your interesting story isn't even in the least bit off topic. But rather a perfect example of people seeing offense or intentional exclusion where none was intended. So it's the same thing we've been talking about here.

To my knowledge and as recounted by those more experienced than myself, field target has always had positions that weren't perhaps optimal, some might even say "hard." Now that we've got aging participants they're thinking those non-standard positions exist specifically to hold them back or make it difficult. Yet those same aging participants shot those "hard" positional shots in the past without any complaints, because they're simply part of what field target is.

So maybe it's human nature to be stubborn about accepting the effects of age? Or maybe human nature to try to get the rules modified to better accommodate "me."

Either way, it smacks of somebody wanting to move or lower the goal posts. And mind you, those goal posts have always been a standard height and at a standard location. It's only now that that standard height or location is getting harder that the squeakiest wheels are now lobbying for change.