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FT Targets

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rob_g

Member
Apr 19, 2019
227
134
Ontario, Canada
I'm playing with a design for FT targets. The bunny targets have the capability to use the same base & linkage while the face plates can be swapped out. The reducer can also be swapped out. The material thickness is 10ga but can be increased easily if needed. We are looking for something that can be upsized to withstand hits from the ever increasing air rifle powers. I've tried to keep the linkage simple so most of the work is in the laser cutting. I have added an eccentric to stop the paddle and control the paddle rest position. The bolts will be tacked into position on the base bracket and link arm to minimize wobble.

The lollipop target started as a joke at the last match. It has a 40mm kill zone with a 12mm wide ring around it. Sometimes you just need to be a dick lol.

I would like critique of my design and how I can improve it and things I should watch out for. I have these two out for cutting right now. I'm hoping another week or so we can prove them out. I'm a little concerned how the single plate pivot joint on the face plate arm will work and if I need to spread it out and have two plates.

BUNNY UP.1629909515.JPG
BUNNY UP-2.1629909525.JPG


LOLLIPOP UP.1629909544.JPG
LOLLIPOP DOWN.1629909551.JPG


Lollipop Side.1629910181.JPG

 
Rob,

First of all I give you credit for asking for comments.

Second, I give anyone who tries to improve FT in any way some credit right from the start, running matches, making targets, whatever. Your drawing is quite nice too.

Third, full disclosure. I tried making targets and it was a failure. lots of work and not a great result.

Now critque.

1. Why did you bend the ends of the base down? That will make it more difficult to mount in almost any case and it adds work and cost. It makes the base stronger but no need to really.

2. Some targets of similar design are spring loaded. That might make it work better.

3. Your kill zone reducer is an odd shape which will add work and cost. A round shape works well and I fasten them by tapping the reducer and using a cap screw from the rear of the target. I use three cap screws.

4. I prefer face plates of small animals, not shapes or anything else. Just my opinion, i know. 

5. Ask yourself if you have the equipment to actually produce the targets. I just cannot see how it would make economic sense unless you are planning to make targets for extreme field target using much more powerful guns(over 20 foot pounds of energy). Air Venturi and Gamo targets are available as are interchangeable face plates and they work well.

I just found that making my own targets was a lot of work without very good results but you may be much more talented than me with access to good equipment . 

I wish you good luck with your adventure.

Respectfully submitted,

Rick B.
 
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where the kill zone mechanism has to lean forward to lock the arms if not when you hit anywhere on the face it will fall on your auto cad program put letter on each piece so that when an idea is given they can give you which piece should do what if you know what mean 5th picture the plates are parallel thats not gonna work the rear plate has to lean forward i am a sheetmetal worker ( retired rather ).
 
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I really like your design and ability to change faceplates. Check out a target by Rick Stoughtenburg. Single point staking, (A Match Director's delight!} I ran Illinois Field Target for 6 years with Rick's target, no cold lines other than reset strings. Western Wayne Michigan used his targets exclusively. Not affected by a little out of level. They have worked perfect at many National and World events. I was a close friend of Rick. Sadly he passed away too young.

I think your design and Rick's could meld into easier construction than yours WITH increased reliability. I certainly could be wrong. I think with your skills you could even improve it. I wish you great success.

DonC
 
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I agree with Don, Ricks targets were thicker material, one reason they stood the test of time!! I would recomend a heavier material for long term results. If my memory is correct his material was at least 3/16" thick. Many had replacable washers to change kill zone sizes, Rick hand made each one, with todays equipment you could standardize all the mechanism sizes to better be ablevto produce a bigger quanity with better accuracy and at a lower cost. Make a few samples to iron out any bugs and for testing. We akways tested our targets to fall with 3-4 ft lb energy, which is less than a 12 ft lb rifle at 55 yds!!
 
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Rob,

First of all I give you credit for asking for comments.

Second, I give anyone who tries to improve FT in any way some credit right from the start, running matches, making targets, whatever. Your drawing is quite nice too.

Third, full disclosure. I tried making targets and it was a failure. lots of work and not a great result.

Now critque.

1. Why did you bend the ends of the base down? That will make it more difficult to mount in almost any case and it adds work and cost. It makes the base stronger but no need to really.

2. Some targets of similar design are spring loaded. That might make it work better.

3. Your kill zone reducer is an odd shape which will add work and cost. A round shape works well and I fasten them by tapping the reducer and using a cap screw from the rear of the target. I use three cap screws.

4. I prefer face plates of small animals, not shapes or anything else. Just my opinion, i know. 

5. Ask yourself if you have the equipment to actually produce the targets. I just cannot see how it would make economic sense unless you are planning to make targets for extreme field target using much more powerful guns(over 20 foot pounds of energy). Air Venturi and Gamo targets are available as are interchangeable face plates and they work well.

I just found that making my own targets was a lot of work without very good results but you may be much more talented than me with access to good equipment . 

I wish you good luck with your adventure.

Respectfully submitted,

Rick B.
Click to expand...

1) I bent the base for strength plus the plate that everything mounts to is pushed up thru a slot in the base plate. The welds will stay on the underside of the base plate leaving the top side clean for aesthetics and clearance of the kill zone paddle arm.

Base-1.1629977515.JPG


2) I've thought about the spring loading and have ideas of how to add a torsion spring if it proves necessary.

3) The kill zone reducer is an odd shape. The extra hole will allow me to add an M4 SHCS for the reducer to sit over top of for anti-rotation if required. All the pieces are being laser cut so shape is irrelevant. You can have anything you want with no extra cost. The tear drop profile would be almost the same as a round. By using carriage bolts I just have a square hole cut to fit the bolt.

4) I have a number of critter profiles for the face plates. The lollipop idea came from discussions at the last match of what kind of target would pi$$ people off. One fellow made a comment about the lollipop being an all-or-nothing target for hunter class. Placed out at 45-55 yards it will be a challenge lol

5) With the laser cutting we only need to add some weld, paint and fasteners to get a target. These are being made out of 10ga for the prototype. The idea is to upsize the materials to 3/16" or 1/4" for the ever increasing air rifle powers. I would also have to look at increasing the kill zone sizes for setting them out to further distances. The Gamo and Air Venturi targets are fine but they seem to be in short supply here in Canada. They are also getting expensive as a Gamo squirrel is $42 and a Diana rabbit is $50. These aren't near as heavy as what I've come up with.
 
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where the kill zone mechanism has to lean forward to lock the arms if not when you hit anywhere on the face it will fall on your auto cad program put letter on each piece so that when an idea is given they can give you which piece should do what if you know what mean 5th picture the plates are parallel thats not gonna work the rear plate has to lean forward i am a sheetmetal worker ( retired rather ).
Click to expand...

If you look at the last pic you can see the lines showing the linkage. The link arm bottom pivot point is over center so if the face plate is forced back by a missed shot it will be held in place by that joint. I am using the eccentric washer (no shown as actually contacting in the pic lol) to control how far forward the kill zone paddle comes. This will allow us to tune it. If needed we can let the paddle fall forward more and bring the lower link pivot point further over center.

I just took a screen shot off my computer for the pics. I maybe should have shown a drawing with the components identified.
 
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I like it !!!

Will agree on keeping the basic shapes of the mechanics squared and EASY to fabricate. Area around the KZ hole heavy enough to back up and support the face place against it.

Too little of backing and target will shutter when struck being more likely to rattle down.



Love the CAM for setting the paddle over travel .... great idea !

On the main paddle pivot would try and use a LARGE SHOULDER bolt that offers increased bearing surface and won't wear as badly as just a threaded bolt being pivoted upon.



As the Target maintenance man for the SVFTC's targets these past 8 years have seen what 1000's of shots and resets, use & abuse does to our beloved Field targets !!!

* We run @ 1/3 Welded double face plate Gamos with better linkages, @ 6 Target Art with balance being super duty Rhynos to the tune of @ 70 targets in total.
 
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I like it !!!

Will agree on keeping the basic shapes of the mechanics squared and EASY to fabricate. Area around the KZ hole heavy enough to back up and support the face place against it.

Too little of backing and target will shutter when struck being more likely to rattle down.



Love the CAM for setting the paddle over travel .... great idea !

On the main paddle pivot would try and use a LARGE SHOULDER bolt that offers increased bearing surface and won't wear as badly as just a threaded bolt being pivoted upon.



As the Target maintenance man for the SVFTC's targets these past 8 years have seen what 1000's of shots and resets, use & abuse does to our beloved Field targets !!!

* We run @ 1/3 Welded double face plate Gamos with better linkages, @ 6 Target Art with balance being super duty Rhynos to the tune of @ 70 targets in total.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure I understand about the kill zone hole being heavy enough. Are you saying material thickness should be greater or more material around the kill zone hole? 

What do you consider "large shoulder bolt"? The current pivot bolts are 5/16". I understand the need for a shoulder bolt to give a better pivot surface. Are you thinking 3/8 or 1/2" diameter?
 
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Speaking the AREA surrounding the KZ hole. wider this area less will be the side to side motion created by out of KZ pellet impacts

Shoulder bolt will decrease wear in the pivot as diameter increases and likely 1/2" or better w/o threads being worn upon is just fine.

More than Pivoting, wear is just that of vibration / impact of the target falling. This joint really aligns the rest of the parts shot to reset etc ....
 
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Speaking the AREA surrounding the KZ hole. wider this area less will be the side to side motion created by out of KZ pellet impacts

Shoulder bolt will decrease wear in the pivot as diameter increases and likely 1/2" or better w/o threads being worn upon is just fine.

More than Pivoting, wear is just that of vibration / impact of the target falling. This joint really aligns the rest of the parts shot to reset etc ....
Click to expand...

Thanks for the feedback. I'll look at implementing some of these after we test the prototypes, (already being cut lol). What material thickness do you have running on the shoulder bolts (did you add material here to get a better surface)? Did you go to the work of reaming the holes in the pivot arms that fit over the shoulder bolts or a simple drill "on size" hole?
 
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The lollipop target idea came out of a discussion at a match of "what would be a dick target to make". With a full size kill zone it will be put out at 40+ yards. It wasn't meant to be friendly target lol. We also made another linkage assembly with a replaceable face plate capable of taking a reducer. I'm trying to prove out the linkage design on the fold down targets and the reset targets. With all the components being laser cut it only required a minimum of welding.

image.1630637850.jpg
IMG_20210901_175232.1630638079.jpg

 
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Retired sheetmetal worker/ toolmaker here also, you will need a thicker face plate due to the constant hammering from being shot at. This constant hammering will deform the faceplate plate over time, even Stoutenbergs heavy faceplates showed some distortion after thousands of hits. In time you will need a spring assist you try to incorporate one into your design atvthe begining. As time goes on lead dust and dirt will mske the mechanism sticky and an assist spring will be needed!!!! I helped Stoutenberg with his design back when he started designing and building targets. No matter what he did, an assist spring was needed due to the heavier materials. The thin light duty targets can get away without a spring but end up failing over time due to light weight msterials. Like your approach and thanks for trying to build a better target, however, there are some things already tested and approved that you will need to add to your design. Age and mother nature will add stresses you havent thought of yet. Good luck !!
 
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