FX Panther no-hype review and tests
- Thread starter RusBear
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Hi mr RusBearHi, everybody! Let me introduce myself: Nikolay Boldov from Russia. Moscow, won Extreme Benchrest and American Field Target in 2019 (AZ, Extreme Benchrest) and 50 Yard Benchrest, One Gun Challenge in 2022 (AZ, Extreme Benchrest).
A few days ago, I’ve got my FX Panthera in .22 caliber. I consider this gun as a long range benchrest (150 yards) competition heavy slug (.22 40gr) shooter for my purposes.
My experience of slug shooting starts from 2017 when I began my experiments with 40gr slugs in .22 caliber, so I have a bit of experience in this topic.
I will try to describe my experiments, results, observations on this airgun in no-hype style with undoubtable (as much as possible) video proves here .
Technical details on FX Panthera can be found here: https://fxairguns.com/rifles/the-panthera/
Part 1. First acquaintance with Panthera out of the box
I will not describe Panthera’s appearance and it's main features here (yet) as you can find it in other youtuber’s videos. I will share my tests and results here.
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Note: I’ve made a mistake saying that tungsten hummer is installed in my Panthera in my first post in social media about this gun. No tungsten hummers yet – just regular one, so this version is straight out of the box, no modification was made.
So, the very first thing I wanted to test is what speed and how many shots can this gun give me with it’s 300cc bottle and huge (156cc) plenum.
The result is 25 shots in 250-142 bar with 40gr slugs at the speed of 273 meters per second (896 fps). Average air consumption is 11,3 cubic centimeters of air per joule, that is a very good result as for me taking into account barrel length and projectile weight.
Here is the video prove and the table of calculations:
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My first impression.
- I didn’t expect FX Panthera to be able to shoot those heavy slugs at that velocity (it should be rather accurate according to my experience) out of the box.
- I really didn’t think that it would be possible to make 25 rather consistent shots from 300cc bottle
- Really happy to have opportunity to shoot 40gr long (12,5mm / 0,5 inch) .22 slugs out of the box with usual magazine
- I didn’t think that it would be possible to shoot those speeds with usual tube-like probe. I had to use pin probe for that needs in all my previous airguns.
Part 2. Know your gun power abilities
The next step I’ve taken to get acquainted with my FX Panthera in a better way is knowing it’s power parameters. My thoughts were the following. Panthera has a huge power plenum of 156cc and it is not an easy task to take it all out during shooting (at least this comes out of my previous experience with this type of airguns). And my thoughts were that using MAX hammer spring tension is not a bad idea, because on high pressures I usually use, the hammer can barely harm the valve. So, there is nothing bad in setting the hammer to maximum power level (that is a bit above 4 micro wheel settings) and testing the gun on different regulator adjustments.
I’ve made my tests on 120 – 200 bar with the step of 10 bar and made 4 shots on each to get average velocity of that setting. I’m not sure if using regulator on the pressures above 170 bar is “legal” so don’t try to repeat.
Here is the chart of results that I’ve got (just to remind – 40gr .2185 slug)
Bar Hammer set Average velocity
FPSAverage velocity meters per second 120 MAX 827 252 130 MAX 860 262 140 MAX 892 272 150 MAX 909 277 160 MAX 938 286 170 MAX 958 292 180 MAX 975 297 190 MAX 995 303 200 MAX 1001 305
You’ve got to take into account that the slugs I use are of rather big diameter - .2185 and of unusual shape – they are more like .22lr ammo. Usually slugs like H&N of the same weight gives +25-30 fps speed on the same settings (from my experience with FX Impact M3).
My intuition tells me that one of the most interesting setups for me (besides the one show in part one of that blog) will be the following:
175 bar reg pressure,
2,85 microwheel hammer settings
970 fps (294 meters per second) with my 40gr .2185 slugs
So, I decided to test that setup from 250 bar in the bottle and got 16 good shots. Here is the prove:
If everything goes fine, I plan to go outside and shoot at my shooting range tomorrow to at least 100 yards distance.
Part 3. Be wise with your hummer strike power
Past weekend was not the best to make accuracy tests outdoors, so I decided to have some tests and tuning indoors – in my workshop.
Is that a wise decision to use maximum hammer hit strike on lower reg pressures like 150 bar? Absolutely not. It will not increase the velocity of the projectile, but will raise your air consumption per shot to unreasonably high values. Here is what I’ve got during my test with reg pressure of 150 bar and 40gr .2185” slugs. 3 shots per every power settings were made and average result was put into the table.
Reg pressure Micro
adjustmentFPS Meters per second 150 bar 1.25 584 178 150 bar 1.5 686 209 150 bar 1.75 793 242 150 bar 2 883 269 150 bar 2.25 915 279 150 bar 2.5 915 279 150 bar 2.75 922 281 150 bar 3 922 281 150 bar 3.25 918 280 150 bar 3.5 918 280 150 bar 3.75 918 280
So, as I got higher with micro wheel adjustment after 2.25 position, the sound of the shot became louder and the gun definitely vibrated much stronger every time. There is no need to go on higher hummer strike power – just the waste of air and destabilization of the projectile due to huge amount of useless air coming after it.
It is the simplest and obvious example of how it works. There is a curve of velocities going up, as we raise the hummer power from the lowest level, then you reach the maximum velocity and then stabilizing without any profits on velocity, but loss in air consumption. That is how it work with big plenums. Note: In case with low volume power plenum guns the curve will go down after the reached plateau of velocities if you will continue to increase hummer strike level.
I will not deny that there are some situations and reasons to go up to a bit higher hummer strike power after reaching the plateau, but it is the matter of very special purposes and should be done wisely with full knowledge of what you do and why.
Part 4. Brief review of FX Pantera and first try to shoot 40gr slugs to 100 yards
Part 5. RECORD?!?!?
Not much text this time - everything is in the video. 100 yards, .22 40gr slugs, 60 shots (6 groups by 10 shots) one by one without stop, single shutter made video as a prove - 0,97 MOA! It is not a hype - it is a fact. Amazed with FX Panthera stability, never met something like that before!
I also recently bought a fx panthera caliber .22 barrel 700mm. And my purpose of using it is only accurate shots from the table and at a distance of 300 meters in a friendly club. The ammunition available to me is 34 grain slug. Currently, the thing that confused me and I could not get to the best state is the most optimal setting of the hammer and regulator pressure for accurate shots at this distance without putting too much pressure on the gun and damaging the hammer. According to the previous shots with fx m3, I use .217 diameter slugs, but I don't know if you suggest .2185 diameter for panthera? Can you help me to achieve the best accuracy at a distance of 300 meters with a 34 grain slug? With what level of diameter and what level of regulator pressure and hammer settings?
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I think not all the liners are the same, also the slugs available, also the temperatures and humidity.... what level of diameter...
You shall slug your liner (push one slug in from breach end to half the length and push it back from the muzzle) and measure it. Whatever number you get give it a plus 5 micron or eventually in inches less then half a thousandth, and that shall be you starting point for diameter. And tune it from there for shortest dwell time.
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Hi RusBear,Hi mr RusBear
I also recently bought a fx panthera caliber .22 barrel 700mm. And my purpose of using it is only accurate shots from the table and at a distance of 300 meters in a friendly club. The ammunition available to me is 34 grain slug. Currently, the thing that confused me and I could not get to the best state is the most optimal setting of the hammer and regulator pressure for accurate shots at this distance without putting too much pressure on the gun and damaging the hammer. According to the previous shots with fx m3, I use .217 diameter slugs, but I don't know if you suggest .2185 diameter for panthera? Can you help me to achieve the best accuracy at a distance of 300 meters with a 34 grain slug? With what level of diameter and what level of regulator pressure and hammer settings?
I got the new Panthera 700 on last September 2023 and after various test decided to use ZAN slug 40 grain .217.
Below you can find results of 3 groups of test done:
1) after final set-up with ZAN slugs (7th Oct. 23),
2)on Jan.24th, 24
3)on Feb. 3rd, 24 (7 tests).
In between October 2023 and February 2024 I shot about 1700 shots (only same type/size of ZAN slugs) and I've never cleaned the rifle barrel, but I don’t think this could be a problem.
All 1700 shots were done with same setting of October: P=175 bar, Micro=3.5 Macro = 22, (except few clicks less on Micro for all test done on Feb 3rd, 24).
Analyzing the below data regarding speed, STD Dev and Delta (Max speed -min speed), they have been getting worse.
What can I do to obtain again the expected good consistency value as obtained on October 7th,23? This expensive rifle is expected to be very consistent in performance.
Thank you very much for your help.
Final Setting on October 7th, 2023:
Pressure 175 bar, micro 3.5, Macro 22 Each test consist of 18 shots (1 Full magazine)
On below 7tests, the test conditions were the same mentioned above except REDUCING MICRO OF FEW CLICKS only
and the speed decreased a little bit accordingly:
07/10/23 24/01/24 Nr. 7 Tests done on 3/2/2024
1 test 1 test 1test 2test 3test 4test 5test 6test 7test
AVERAGE [m/sec] 301 291 283,4 288,6 285,8 285,8 282,9 283,6 286,6
STDev 2,5 4 4,4 4,3 4,5 2,2 2,6 3,5 3,1
(MaxSpeed-minSpeed) [m/sec] 3 8,5 13,7 19,0 15,1 9,1 7,2 13,4 11,9
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I can't stand it any longer...... so, I must ask. Where is anything from FX or NRL/PRS rimfire that references a required power factor for said matches?
There are power factor requirements for certain action shooting sports, for purposes of classification of shooters, but none exists in NRL/PRS rimfire.
I have an idea as to why it is such a big deal to you, but I would like to know, for certain, why it is such a problem.
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Been eating you alive for 22+ months eh?
Per FX fashion, their marketing team came straight out of the gates promising the moon and the stars.
Fourth paragraph down in their initial press release here.....
Thread 'Introducing the New FX Panthera: A Dedicated, Purpose-Built Air Rifle Made to Win Precision Rifle Competitions.' https://www.airgunnation.com/thread...-to-win-precision-rifle-competitions.1279491/
And in case you don't want to follow the link....
"...22LR precision shooters will identify the ability to shoot the same BC slugs and weights they are used to, but with the control and standard deviations that only FX Airguns can deliver."
I watched a guy with a Panthera shoot an Ultimate Field Target match a while back. As discussed here almost two years ago, he had to fill up every couple shots during sight-in, I'd estimate I saw him fill up 5+ times in a 30 minute period. And that was the same story for the 48 shot match. From an accuracy standpoint he did quite well, just had to fill his gun 8-10 times over the course of sight in and the actual match.
It was never "such a big deal" to me, just the realistic discussion of what to expect from it when the Panthera first hit the market.
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Actually, no. I only read this yesterday. But you have been worrying about the “power” of the gun in almost every post you have made in this thread. I find it interesting that you continuously post quotes from FX advertising, and then you continue to bitch about the power factor of the Panthera. The problem I see is that not a single quote I have seen you post mentions power. Yet here you are…..
I think it would bode much better for you to just clearly profess your agenda and bias against the platform and move along.
Or you could continue to maintain your image and I will sit back and continue to enjoy the free entertainment.
Makes no difference to me.
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You said "I can't stand it any longer" and quoted something I said almost two years ago. Your opening line of resurrecting this discussion is why I asked if it's been eating you alive for almost two years.
As to your other retort.....
I JUST quoted where FX said .22 rimfire guys can shoot the same weight and BC they're used to.
No agenda here, Ive got the same opinion of the Panthera now that I had then, low shot count is the deal break for me and the way I like to enjoy airguns. It's called physics, increase the power level and that decrease the shot count. Start with a small onboard bottle and shot count was small before increasing the power, and even smaller after increasing the power. Other's may not mind filling up so often and those are the guys who bought Pantheras. Good for me. Good for them.
If you stumbled upon this old conversation you must be considering the Panthera. If you are cool with the above, buy one. If not, don't. Simple as that.
This discussion petered out almost two years ago. Before today I hadn't made a comment here in 22+ months, and only revisited it to address your questions to me.
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Although the Panthera and a few other airguns designed to be better suited to PRS and NRL are a step up from airguns pre Panthera for competing "against rimfires" in these specific sports - they aren't quite there yet.
I'll admit it's been fun watching airguns close the gap closer and closer and FX gets a thumbs up for "going there" in airguns designed for this sport.
The low ES is absolutely a plus for the airguns but I still think there is lots of room for improvement.
IMHO the airguns need to be built more robustly. FX is locked into the liner system so doubtful that will change. The way it is now is if the shroud is hit hard against something and a POI shift happens you are SOL at least for that stage and maybe for the whole match. I know because it's happened to me twice before with other airguns.
Heavy match grade shouldered barrels screwed into a stiff over built receiver is a major part of the winning recipe and of course optimized for weight balance off a bag. Example it's much harder to induce a POI shift to a Vudoo 22rf, or the like, if mishandled.
Next is super high BC swaged or turned slugs. A G1 BC nearly twice of what a 22rf bullet has is a great advantage to utilize and 25 caliber would net a few more edge hits on steel as well as allow one to locate where hits and misses land easier because of a heavier projectile which would net a few more points here and there. Basically if you can't see where you missed you don't know where to correct too. Currently the Altaros 60gr/.245BC are very impressive even at a slow 862 fps in my V3.
Then FPS in that sweet spot near to what subsonic rimfires have which means getting up there close to 1050 fps.
As far as precision capability goes "almost" seems a good desciption for airguns these days. Some of the better rimfires with really good ammo found for the gun can often do sub moa at 100Y. I've read an article of one 22rf rifle averaging .5 moa at 100Y inside a test facility.
Definately be nice to be able to do two stages before filling again.
Such a improved gun in the hands of the top PRS or NRL champions would no doubt win over rimfire. BC - BC- BC, and low ES.
I'll admit it's been fun watching airguns close the gap closer and closer and FX gets a thumbs up for "going there" in airguns designed for this sport.
The low ES is absolutely a plus for the airguns but I still think there is lots of room for improvement.
IMHO the airguns need to be built more robustly. FX is locked into the liner system so doubtful that will change. The way it is now is if the shroud is hit hard against something and a POI shift happens you are SOL at least for that stage and maybe for the whole match. I know because it's happened to me twice before with other airguns.
Heavy match grade shouldered barrels screwed into a stiff over built receiver is a major part of the winning recipe and of course optimized for weight balance off a bag. Example it's much harder to induce a POI shift to a Vudoo 22rf, or the like, if mishandled.
Next is super high BC swaged or turned slugs. A G1 BC nearly twice of what a 22rf bullet has is a great advantage to utilize and 25 caliber would net a few more edge hits on steel as well as allow one to locate where hits and misses land easier because of a heavier projectile which would net a few more points here and there. Basically if you can't see where you missed you don't know where to correct too. Currently the Altaros 60gr/.245BC are very impressive even at a slow 862 fps in my V3.
Then FPS in that sweet spot near to what subsonic rimfires have which means getting up there close to 1050 fps.
As far as precision capability goes "almost" seems a good desciption for airguns these days. Some of the better rimfires with really good ammo found for the gun can often do sub moa at 100Y. I've read an article of one 22rf rifle averaging .5 moa at 100Y inside a test facility.
Definately be nice to be able to do two stages before filling again.
Such a improved gun in the hands of the top PRS or NRL champions would no doubt win over rimfire. BC - BC- BC, and low ES.
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I shot the highest score ever at 100m in the matches this year with .22lr with 310 points, but also with the Panthera in the airgun competition with 309 points, so you can say .22lr and airguns are equal now.
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To be fair, ANY precision barrel is going to suffer from a POI change, if hit hard enough against something.
Rim fire platform is NOT the solution to that problem.
And, with a paper target, it really dosent matter if it gets hit at 1050 FPS, or 800 FPS, a bullseye is still a bullseye!
Rim fire platform is NOT the solution to that problem.
And, with a paper target, it really dosent matter if it gets hit at 1050 FPS, or 800 FPS, a bullseye is still a bullseye!
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True in a way concerning a hit against a barrel, shroud/liner system but on the other hand the amount of force it takes to cause a POI shift on a bull barreled 22rf almost can't be compared to the same hit on a liner system. I saw the video of a guy pushing on the shroud liner system of his Panthera and it moved the shift over substantially as he showed on the target afterwards.
The same thing goes with how stout the receiver is and how the barrel fastens to it. My point is to greatly lessen the potentiality of problems by overbuilding the gun.
Although currently I don't have a bull barreled 22rf (have had a 6 of them through the years) I do have custom centerfires with bull barrels and they don't shift, or I should say not more than .1 mil. I don't even case them half the time. Year in and year out I can grab one of them and put the first shot on a 1" sticker at 100Y which is my zero distance.
6mmBR - same precision rifle above at 1000 yards
Ok your other point is true in a way as well however for ELR distances in PRS 22 if the yardage of a steel is off a few yards compared to actual distance a projectile starting at 1050 fps has more chance of hitting than one at 800 fps.
Basically what I'm getting at is it's glaringly apparent 22rf is King for these dynamic 22rf sports for "reasons".
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Good for you and that's a great achievement!
Does your Panthera do .5 MOA at 100M consistently. I bet not.
The day Mike N of Thomas Air goes to the nationals or worlds and wins against the top 22rf BR shooters in one of these "all 22rf" matches I'll agree with you. Even he admits his airguns and slugs(as awesome as they currently are) can't quite compete in these 22rf BR matches. He definitely has the skills to do so. The guy literally puts hundreds of thousands of projectiles through his customers guns/barrels in testing a year. He's got the skills and if they'd let a air rifle compete I'm sure he'd still finish high.
Almost is the best way I can think of to describe the precision of a top pcp vs top 22rf.
However for PRS 22, I think, and I'm guessing here, that consistent .8 MOA is good enough and would win the nationals because the shooters skill is much of it.
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My panthera and also my Sinner .223 shoots six 5 shot groups within 0.6 moa average. I shoot both the 100m competitions with .22lr and airgun. After 5 matches i lead both competitions and with airgun i have this year for the first time more points than with my .22lr. I shot 4 airgun matches with my panthera and 1 with the Sinner. The 5 years before all with the Sinner.
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