Anschutz German tunnel front sights

There's been much discussion about iron sights on the forum lately, so a few notes about tunnel front sights may be of interest.

This photo shows two familiar vintage German front sights. They have three basic parts:
+ tunnel housing that clamps to grooves at the muzzle
+ sighting elements in the form of flat metal inserts with side tabs for alignment
+ threaded sleeve that clamps the insert into the tunnel

This simple design permits inserts having different sighting elements - tapered or straight posts, sidebar or lollipop rings, etc. - to be easily interchanged.


Over the years, German sights used three different standard thread sizes for the sleeves. These will interchange between makes, and enabled the development of aftermarket accessories that likewise fit any sight tunnel with the same sleeve thread.

The earliest sleeve size used an M17 thread (17.0 x 0.5mm), which Diana and Weihrauch still use on sporting rifle sights. Anschutz later developed the slightly larger M18 thread (18.0 x 0.5mm), which remains very common. Most new top-of-the-line 10-meter guns use a yet larger M22 thread (22.0 x 0.5mm). Aftermarket accessories are no longer made for M17 sights, but there is a world of interesting goodies available for M18 and M22.

Now here is where some confusion comes: THE SLEEVE THREAD AND THE METAL INSERT SIZES ARE DIFFERENT THINGS! The tunnels have an internal "shoulder" - slightly SMALLER in diameter than the sleeve thread - into which the insert nests:


Therefore, SLEEVES of the same size DO interchange between different manufacturers' sights, and take the same accessories. But with a few exceptions, the INSERTS are proprietary and DO NOT interchange between makes, since their diameters and side tabs differ. Here's a random selection of what I have on hand:


Note in the photo two interesting exceptions to the proprietary rule:

+ Walther: they pioneered flat metal inserts in the 1950's, and Diana and FWB copied their M17 insert pattern verbatim - even though FWB has an M18 tunnel and sleeve! But the three made different types and sizes of posts and rings, making them fun to interchange (Diana's beaded post is a personal plinking fave).

+ Anschutz: their M18 inserts, with their distinctive asymmetrical tab pattern, are almost an informal industry standard, used by other manufacturers. They offer many different post and ring elements, and there are many aftermarket inserts and other accessories. Their older tunnels fit perfectly centered on Weihrauch barrels, too.

As far as I know, the Weihrauch insert pattern remains strictly proprietary. Shooters are limited to the six element shapes they have offered for many years; you can't use them in any other brand of sight; and no other brand of inserts fits.
 
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just a couple of additions
the Lyman 93 take Anschutz 17.2 insert and the plastic globe sight from Air Venturi takes Anschutz inserts
the early 15.9mm insert are used in the Kimber 82 .22LR
and some slimline info when they were being sold out of Canada many years ago
nice post Mike
SlimelineSightInsertsFlyerPg1.jpg
 
Thanks marflow...great info as always!

Here's a few follow-on shots. First, the eternal, never-changing six elements from Weihrauch:
IMG_1859.jpeg


Just a small selection of Anschutz factory inserts:
IMG_1861.jpeg


And a nifty set of photo-etched Anschutz-compatible inserts from Lee Shaver. These are so fine I literally couldn't see some of them before cataract surgery.
IMG_1867.jpeg


Here are some ancient accessories for M17 sights: A) sight with double front and rear sleeves; B) Gehmann adjustable ring; C) Gehmann adjustable post; D) 1.3x "eagle eye" lens. The lens replaces the front sight sleeve, the other two go in place of the rear one.
IMG_1709.jpeg


IMG_1708.jpeg


Again, these M17 accessories are no longer made - a minor tragedy for Weihrauch fans! - I just wanted to show how they work. You can still get similar goodies for M18 and M22 sights.
 
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i don't think people know that sights are a collectable subset of air rifles
You Mike and I have fallen deep in the rabbit hole way too far for me but at the same time it is all worth money and i don't see it going down in price
and there is very little out there for sale
Diopters and globe sights, inserts are all in the same rabbit hole and then add a Gehmann or two
good fun
 
The prices on quality older sights sure are not decreasing, and unfortunately, neither is my fascination with them.
I usually only buy sights that I have a need for at the time, but, there is always one that pops up and makes you go ooooooohhh.

I truly lament the scarcity of HW rear diopters now, 11 or 13 mm.
 
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There's been much discussion about iron sights on the forum lately, so a few notes about tunnel front sights may be of interest.

This photo shows two familiar vintage German front sights. They have three basic parts: a tunnel that clamps to grooves at the muzzle, the sighting element as a flat metal insert with leveling side tabs, and a threaded sleeve that clamps the insert. This simple design lets inserts with different element types - tapered or straight posts, sidebar or lollipop rings - be easily interchanged.


Over the years, German sights used three different standard thread sizes for the sleeves. These interchange between makes, and enabled aftermarket accessories to be developed.

The earliest size was M17 (17.0 x 0.5mm), which Diana and Weihrauch use on sporting rifles to this day. Anschutz later developed the slightly larger M18 (18.0 x 0.5mm), which remains common. Most new top-line 10-meter guns use a yet larger M22 (22.0 x 0.5mm).

Now here is where some confusion comes: THE SLEEVE THREAD AND THE METAL INSERT ARE NOT THE SAME DIAMETER! In this shot, you see the tunnels have an internal "shoulder" - slightly SMALLER in diameter than the sleeve thread - into which the insert nests:


Thus while different manufacturers' sights may share accessories fitting a common sleeve thread, their inserts typically do NOT interchange as the diameters and side tabs differ. To illustrate, here's a selection of some I have on hand:


Walther pioneered flat metal inserts and the M17 thread in the 1950's. Diana and FWB copied their insert pattern verbatim - though the latter is an M18 tunnel! But each maker used different shapes and sizes for the sighting element, making the inserts fun to swap around (Diana's beaded post is my favorite FWB plinking element!).

As far as I know, the Weihrauch insert pattern remains proprietary. Shooters are limited to the six element shapes they have offered for many years.

The Anschutz inserts - note the distinctive asymmetrical tab pattern - are used by many other manufacturers. They offer many different post and ring elements, and aftermarket inserts and other accessories are plentiful. Their older tunnels fit perfectly centered on Weihrauch barrels, too.
Excellent post. I refine my HWM17 ones into a very pointy inverted V. I have hit Sparrows in the head at 65 using this method.
Another thing I have found that works is I keep my front tunnel sight on when I scope them. No matter what insert for this. On lower magnification I can use that front site to gain an extremely repetitive hold, face/cheek/eye placement and pitch of head. It only lines up centered when you are in line.

That’s why I always prefer the front sights over the smoother brake. I still use them even though it’s scoped
 
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Thanks marflow...great info as always!

Here's a few follow-on shots. First, the eternal, never-changing six elements from Weihrauch:
View attachment 426908

Just a small selection of Anschutz factory inserts:
View attachment 426909

And a nifty set of photo-etched Anschutz-compatible inserts from Lee Shaver. These are so fine I literally couldn't see them before cataract surgery.
View attachment 426911

Here are some ancient accessories for M17 sights: A) sight with double front and rear sleeves; B) adjustable ring; C) adjustable post; D) "eagle eye" lens. The lens replaces the front sight sleeve, the other two go in place of the rear one.
View attachment 426920

View attachment 426921
Oh man I want the Lee posts and Eagle Eye!!
So nice
 
Oh man I want the Lee posts and Eagle Eye!!
So nice
New "eagle eyes" are still around for M18 sights, but not M17 unfortunately.

Mr. Shaver's inserts are still available for Anschutz, and several other brands of sights. His web site is definitely worth a look...someone should talk him into making a set for Weihrauch sights...
 
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The clear inserts that marflow showed are great fun to use, giving a very thin and crisp "floating" ring with no sidebars.
IMG_4502.jpeg


An interesting feature of the Slimline clear inserts, is that they are only microscopically smaller in diameter than the securing sleeve thread. So, they do NOT fit into that inner "shoulder" like metal inserts - but rest BEHIND it. The highlighted size thus fits ANY M18 sight - Anschutz, FWB, Diana, etc. The pic above is an FWB 300S.
IMG_6678.jpeg


For years, you could buy an economical set of this size, with a full selection of aperture opening diameters - mine (obviously well used, LOL!) came from Champion's Choice in Nashville. I've used these in M18 FWB, Anschutz, and Hammerli sights with no problem. I haven't seen the sets around for a while though.
IMG_1479.jpeg
 
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the slimline clear sights were sold out of Vancouver or Victoria Canada they were always advertised in the Shotgun News 19.95 for the set in the storage container
but any company that want to sell them he would print covers that had the name of the seller on them
and that gave people the idea that, that company made them, but they were all slimline
but the seller in Canada just disappeared and as stock dried up there were fewer and fewer people selling them
we know the Ebay seller out of Canada still has some but i wonder who is making them now

now Diopter sight at a great price
well, that would be in Germany on EGUN auctions, is it easy to buy from NO, can it be done YES is it just fun to look, well YES it is
here is Diana
https://www.egun.de/market/list_items.php?mode=qry&plusdescr=off&wheremode=and&query=diana+&quick=1
and the guns you will never get bit and pieces yes if the seller will ship them, if you email a seller will he return an email sometimes but shipping anything out of Germany is expensive and there is no reason for it
 
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Just a small selection of Anschutz factory inserts:
View attachment 426909
I managed to snag one of these old Anschutz globes off of Egun. Have you ever tried putting one of their spirit levels on that globe?

I am looking to transition to the glass high end inserts, but I will need a bubble level if I lose the post in my metal inserts.
 
I'm sure there is a way to do that, but I don't know what it is! I have no experience with bubble levels.

If you just need a horizontal reference, I believe Anschutz makes inserts simiar to the one in this photo, that have scribed lines on them. But note their inserts have a recessed edge, and snap into a special slotted sleeve (lower left in the photo). The standard solid sleeve for metal inserts (upper left won't center them up.

The old Slimline inserts above work a little differently - they have a solid edge and are a little bigger in diameter (same diameter as the sleeve thread) and are not brand specific. You can simply drop them into any M18 sight. But they are hard to find these days.

IMG_6180.jpeg
 
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