GX CS4 Overheating issue

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Tonight's results were worse than earlier. It ran about 40 min earlier today, but tonight it didn't even make it to 30 min. I logged the ambient, water, head, and motor temps. Starting pressure was 3000 and shut off was 3600 with a cutoff set at just over 4500. After the shut off, I turned it off, unplugged the temp sensor, and it would indeed start back, though I agree that's not an acceptable solution. How hot does the water get if you just let it keep running for hours with no temp sensor?

I notice that the water, head, and motor temps all track pretty closely together. It's also clear that the unit is cooling challenged for all 3. The head temp and water temp should indeed track together if there's a good heat transfer. The motor temp is likely just coincidence that it's about the same. There's a lot of heat being removed by the fan though the radiator, and the temps in the reservoir are post radiator. It would be interesting to see what they are going into the radiator.

I'll see what GX says, but since I can't even top off my normal tank, there's no way I'm keeping this. Disconnecting the temp sensor and letting it burn up isn't a well engineered solution I'm afraid. It was much cheaper ordering this through GX rather than Amazon, but I'm already regretting not using Amazon because this would already be in the box with a label on it.

The log file of the temps is attached. It looks like it shuts off around 150F.

View attachment CS4-I Extech temps.xlsx
 
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13brv3 said:
I tried a longer run, 73F ambient, clean distilled water with good flow. I started at 3500 psi in the tank, and at about 35 min I slowly bled that down some to keep from hitting the cutoff at 4500. At 44 min, it shut off, and so far can't be restarted by any form of power cycling. I guess I'll have to do some troubleshooting, but you really shouldn't have to with a brand new compressor. I haven't touched the grease pot knob, though I did unscrew the grease pot to see how much was in it. There's a good size air pocket, but I left it alone. 0-300 bar with the capped hose is 24 sec.

I had a thermocouple in the water the whole time, and noted the temps every 5 min. I don't understand how some people run around 115 max and others go over 150F. Temps below, sorry if the format is ugly.

MinutesWater temp
0​
73​
5​
92.1​
10​
113.5​
15​
127.4​
20​
136.8​
25​
143.3​
30​
147.7​
35​
151.2​
40​
154​
44​
155.8​
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I'm thinking about what you said and I wonder if your compressor doesn't have a extremely tight fitting set of pistons causing excess drag/friction which in turn causes the increase in temps? Or if you haven't tore in to it yet, I'd be curious to see how much grease is actually inside the compression cylinder. It might not have near enough from the initial setup from the factory. Just food for thought.

Thanks
Ray
 
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ray1377 said:
I'm thinking about what you said and I wonder if your compressor doesn't have a extremely tight fitting set of pistons causing excess drag/friction which in turn causes the increase in temps? Or if you haven't tore in to it yet, I'd be curious to see how much grease is actually inside the compression cylinder. It might not have near enough from the initial setup from the factory. Just food for thought.

Thanks
Ray
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I do think there's some difference in compressors from the factory. Some people document a max temp under 120F, and theirs can run for hours. Some like mine and the OP's unit overheat quickly. I would never consider tearing into a new unit since it's under warranty and should have been tested and working properly when shipped. GX basically told me the same thing the OP reported, linked to the same video.
 
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13brv3 said:
I do think there's some difference in compressors from the factory. Some people document a max temp under 120F, and theirs can run for hours. Some like mine and the OP's unit overheat quickly. I would never consider tearing into a new unit since it's under warranty and should have been tested and working properly when shipped. GX basically told me the same thing the OP reported, linked to the same video.
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That is unfortunate, but that is what I thought GX would say. I haven't checked the water temp with the temp sensor disconnected. I will do that when I fill my bottle up next time. Did you use paypal to pay through the GX website? I submitted a dispute, printed the entire email conversation into PDF, attached it to the claim. I also added their warranty info, photo of my 'meat thermometer' in the water reservoir at 150 deg F, and described the interaction in extreme detail. I think I said above, but GX never responded to the claim in time, and I got my money back.
 
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Here are their most recent replies that were in my email this morning. At this point I'm telling them I need to return it at their expense for a refund since I'm unwilling to disable a safety circuit on a unit that's clearly defective. I will also not let them "repair" it since they already said the only thing they'll do is unplug the sensor. I'll tell them one final time to issue return/refund instructions, and if they don't, it will be PayPal time.

Rusty




Our temperature control switch is set at 65℃, with an error of 10℃. 150F is 65.56℃. Our machine is not a constant temperature device. This is normal. For example, the piston is well sealed and the motor power error will cause the temperature to rise quickly. Our machine can reach 80℃. The purpose of our initial design of the temperature control switch is to prevent the piston from burning out due to water not circulating at the beginning! If you want to solve this problem now, you can remove the temperature control, as the water circulation of the machine has been fine.

------------------

pls check the fan if runs well? feel if there is warm wind coming out from fan hole by hand.
it is not defective, can not return, just need to follow guide to solve this.
as i said, temperature sensor has been useless. even we repair for you, we will also disconnect it for you. P

------------------

as we said, we also met this kind of problem before, we also confirmed with supplier and engineer, the sensor is a defective design, compressor has many protection design, we also added temperature protection on the cylinder and converter, so just feel free to disconnect this cable, then you do a test.
if it influnce safety, we won't let you do this.
 
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When I insisted on a return/refund they had the nerve to insult me. I shouldn't post their last response, but I can't help it. Get out your popcorn.... The iphone reference was icing on the cake!

From GX:
Hello
we said it is not defective. in other words, you returned to us to repair, we also will remove that part. we have told you it does not need anymore. in other words, the protection switch is useless .
Also note the temperature is normal even it reach to 170f. Every compressor will reach different temperature, depends on using time, local temperature, coolant type.
we told you to disconnect it. we are sure it has no any safety problem. Machine has many protection designs you don't know.
Other buyers will also meet this kind of problem, they can understand this easily. and glad we helped to solve.
When you buy a iohone, met a problem, send to seller, i think it is normal that you just need a working machine, will apple tell you how they repair?
we have warranty rules. If it was not quality reason, we don't support this kind of return.
hope understanding.
 
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I just sent them my final reply:

"The compressor doesn’t work as advertised. It overheats in 30 min in an air conditioned basement. This is the definition of “defective”. I will not disable a temperature safety circuit, and I won’t return it for “repair” since you’ve already said you will just disable the sensor. I’ve lost confidence in your compressors based on this experience, and that of others, so the only acceptable option is to return this defective compressor at your expense for refund. I will find a new compressor from a different manufacturer. Please give me a return label for the unit."

I guess I should await my insult, and start compiling my PayPal dispute documentation. Fortunately, the old F10 Shoebox just keeps going.

Rusty
 
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guess I should await my insult, and start compiling my PayPal dispute documentation.

I'd not waited this long ..

Thing is so many happy campers on a gx but I'm the lemon king so if there's that one in 10 thousand lemons out there I'm sure to get it ..

Everybody get a lemon product time to time . Just depends on how reputable the folks you buy from treat you when you do ..
 
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Hello everyone, I would suggest when you go to buy another compressor please contact (colt 1900). He is a member on the forum and a great guy to deal with. He sells refurbished GX Compressors and warranties them. Yes he lives here in the states and has a quick response to email or phone calls when needed. I know this because I have bought pumps and parts from him with ZERO problems. He has gone far and beyond what was expected of him and is usually at airgun shows to buy, ask questions or just simply have a conversation with. Please give him a shot and I promise you won't be disappointed.
 
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You stated you were using "distilled water"? Is that all you have in the cooling system? If it is I would suggest you get some water wetter and mix with your distilled water. It will help lower the temp and maybe run cooler? It's worth a try at this point. This is what I use in my CS4.
https://rislone.com/products/hy-per-cool-super-coolant/

Thx
Ray
 
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ray1377 said:
You stated you were using "distilled water"? Is that all you have in the cooling system? If it is I would suggest you get some water wetter and mix with your distilled water. It will help lower the temp and maybe run cooler? It's worth a try at this point. This is what I use in my CS4.
https://rislone.com/products/hy-per-cool-super-coolant/

Thx
Ray
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Water Wetter is just a surfactant that likely won't make much difference. A couple drops of dish soap probably would work as well. The head and water temps are very close, and the air coming out of the radiator fan is very hot, though I didn't measure it. That all pretty much verifies that there's good heat transfer all around.

The problem is clearly the amount of heat being generated by the compressor. I've seen too many videos of people running these for hours at a time using 50/50 glycol mix and not having any cooling issue. That's how it's advertised to work, and probably how most of them do work. The OP and I got duds. I doubt GX actually makes these since the same compressor is sold as the Omega as well. Likely they didn't have anything to do with the design and choice of that 65C thermal switch. If the compressor is truly expected to operate as high as 80C, it would have an 80C switch.
 
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olafberzerk said:
Sucks you got a lemon too. At least you'll get your money back and have a compressor to play with. It still works, just not sure how long it will last.
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The engineer in me really wants to do more testing on this, but I'm trying to resist until I get a resolution. I think you also mentioned that your 0-300 bar test with just the hose was around 24 sec like mine. The manual says something like 36 (clearly too lazy to look it up <g>). It would be interesting to get the test time from someone who's unit runs well below the overtemp limit. I wonder if the tolerances just stack up to the point where some are tighter than others. Oddly, it's possible that a tighter piston might be more efficient, though with higher temp. As it wears, you would expect the temps to go down.

I'd like to know more about the temp limit, and why 65C was chosen. If the temp maxed out at 80C, how bad woudl that be for the compressor? I'd like to believe that whoever engineered this initially made a rational choice to preserve the life of the unit, and aparently didn't explain any of that to the GX support person :)
 
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13brv3 said:
The engineer in me really wants to do more testing on this, but I'm trying to resist until I get a resolution. I think you also mentioned that your 0-300 bar test with just the hose was around 24 sec like mine. The manual says something like 36 (clearly too lazy to look it up <g>). It would be interesting to get the test time from someone who's unit runs well below the overtemp limit. I wonder if the tolerances just stack up to the point where some are tighter than others. Oddly, it's possible that a tighter piston might be more efficient, though with higher temp. As it wears, you would expect the temps to go down.

I'd like to know more about the temp limit, and why 65C was chosen. If the temp maxed out at 80C, how bad woudl that be for the compressor? I'd like to believe that whoever engineered this initially made a rational choice to preserve the life of the unit, and aparently didn't explain any of that to the GX support person :)
Click to expand...
All most all of these compressors are rated for 70-80c for max temperature. After you get your money back unplug the temperature sensor and run it. I would bet you your compressor is going to last longer than mine. Mine has 2hrs on it and only runs 125f max but takes all of 30 sec for the pressure test. I am running straight royal purple water wetter.
 
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I talked to Warren - the Air Shootist before buying a portable compressor and he highly recommended this Orcair model. He said that he has 2 of them and has ran the crap out of them with 0 issues and lots of hrs on them. They are currently $319 on amazon.
92532092-2068-4BD7-9AC1-64635A391980.png


I only went with the cs4 because I found it on Aliexpress for $409 free shipping and it is supposed to be one of the quietest compressors out there. (Nothing wrong with my yong heng but way too loud)
I also had a understanding that I probably wouldn’t have any kind of warranty to speak of going that route but I can buy any parts it may need fairly cheap.
 
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