HATSAN and KRAL PCP Rifles and BullPups.....Opinions Please.

[Nalajr]

Hey all,

I came across these 2 brands of PCP rifles and had not heard much at all about them, especially the KRAL. I've heard of the HATSAN and seen a few videos on them and the owners seem to have a pretty good opinions of them. Is KRAL a new entrant into the PCP world?

I'd like to hear what you all think of these brands and if you have any models in specific that you'd like to comment on, please feel free.

The look to be in the price range of the Benjamin Marauder, so that's why I asked.

What do you all think of the accuracy of the .177 models or the .22? Is there any KRAL or HATSAN that you'd choose over a Marauder? Why or why not?

The only thing that's kinda negative I have seen or read on the HATSAN PCP rifles is that they are said to be heavy. I've only watched a couple videos though and not read too many reviews, so what I am saying is not based on much information at all.

The KRAL that I was looking at was the Puncher Mega W Silent and the HATSAN model was the BullBoss QE.

I'm not wedded to the 0.177 and would take a 0.22 if it was a more accurate and better performing setup. Either one would be used for strictly backyard paper punching and some occasional Mini-Sniping like in the very old Guns & Ammo Article where I'd be shooting at 9mm empty cases, animal crackers, life savers and whatever else I can find that would be fun to shoot at from out to 50 meters or so.

What's your thoughts on these? Is either one of these brands one that you'd like to own?

Thank you all for your continued help and suggestions.

Larry

 

[DirtyDovi]

Larry,

I personally own rifles from both brands.. 

From Hatsan, the .22 cal Gladius [short]

From Kral Arms, the .22 cal Puncher Breaker 



I absolutely love both of them! IMO, for the price, both are heard to beat. 
Very fun and very accurate rifles!

The Kral Puncher Breaker is actually one of my all time favorite guns! 
I always stress that.. This includes air rifles and powder burner rifles combined.. 

The ONLY gripe that I have with the Kral.. Some of them can be 'time-bombs'... 
Mine ended up being one of them. The issue was/is the valve-stem inside.. 
The metal was not heat treated properly or at all from the factory,
and by design, then tend to snap. Sure enough, after a few thousand rounds, 
mine snapped. I had to send it in for warranty, but, it Was taken care of.

Funny timing - I should be getting mine back Today! I can't wait!

Now, that was with the Puncher BREAKER.

The newer Krals could and Should all be corrected. *Fingers Crossed*
I also have a brand new Kral NEMESIS .22 / .25 cal combo.

The Puncher Mega rifles look really nice too!

As for Hatsan - Great for the price also, just very heavy. 
My Gladius is built like a tank, so shouldering it is a bit of a pain, but, 
bench rest shooting it is an absolute blast.

I have threads on here regarding Both of these rifles..
Including the play by play for the Puncher Breaker - With updates..

There are a few videos also - where I show accuracy..

Anyways..

While my Kral was in for repairs, I was getting a bit anxious.. 
I seriously almost bought another one to shoot while the 1st was down..

Instead, I got an Artemis P15. [Original / cheaper version of the Diana Skyhawk] 
The P15 has proven to be an Outstanding little gun! Amazing accuracy, 
and IMO, probably better than both of the previously mentioned models..
Comparable in price, smaller, lighter, more accurate - and Regulated too.. 

I love all 3. I think the Artemis P15 is the most fun, 
the Kral Puncher Breaker still just seems to 'fit me' the best out of them..

 

Sam -

[Edit] 

My Hatsan Gladius: Indoor target shooting:
https://www.airgunnation.com/topic/my-hatsan-gladius-came-out-to-play-sight-in-10m-indoor-plinking/ 

My Artemis P15: Indoor target shooting: 
https://www.airgunnation.com/topic/artemis-p15-22-cal-shooting-hn-baracuda-21-14-gr-pellets-video/ 

My Kral PB Thread - Ongoing/Updating: 
https://www.airgunnation.com/topic/my-puncher-breaker-puncher-broken-help/ 

HONORABLE MENTION: ATI Nova Vista Liberty PCP rifles! 
I have the "Freedom" [built in hand pump version] and I absolutely love it.
Inexpensive, light weight, Amazing accuracy, dependable, etc.
The "Liberty model" looks the same, but, it is the regular PCP / regulated version. 
They are getting a Lot of very good reviews, and many people absolutely love them. 
*I just don't own one - yet - So I can't speak for it Personally.

 

[steve-l]

You get what you pay for. After you spend all the money and time tuning these things, you will have just as much invested as if you had bought an FX, but with the market value of a second hand Kral, as well as the very real risk of screwing the gun modifications up to the point that the gun is junk. Your call.

 

[Clifton]

 I have an AT44 in .22 and had a Bullboss in .25. The Bullboss's baffles were quite a bit larger on the ID and made the gun a lot louder. I swapped baffles while I owned it to keep it backyard friendly. The Bullboss had a horrible trigger and was even heavier than the AT44. I sold it after a month and kept the AT44. My next gun will be an FX.

 

[Seth0764]

Hatsan hands down. Dont let these guys bully you into an overpriced "fx". I have a bt65 cost $650 (to tune it if that's what you want to do) you only need a regulator $120 and some machine work but not necessary. no other parts are need. still not close to the cost of an fx. The bt65 shoots great out the box though. My bullboss is awesome too.

 

[mcoulter]

FWIW, I have owned an Air Arms s510 in .22 and a FX Royale 400 in .22. The current PCPs I own are a Hatsan Flash in .177 and a Kral Bigmax in .22. Are my previous guns more accurate and more consistent than my current ones? Yes, absolutely. Which guns have I had more fun with? My current set. Hands down.

I have LEARNED far more with the hatsan and kral. And I will say that the difference in accuracy isn't THAT much better. So the decision has to be a personal one. How much is a *little* better accuracy worth? I can't answer that. The youtube reviewer can't answer that. Only you can answer that. To me it bothered me how much equity I had tied up in the higher end guns. To me having a decent shooting "mid-level" gun is the sweet spot. I'm not afraid to tinker with them and learn A LOT from them

 

[DirtyDovi]

I just got my Puncher Breaker back from Pyramid Air [Air Venturi] today, 
[They not only replaced the broken OEM valve-stem with an upgrade but also gave me another as a spare]
and as soon as I got out of work, I set it back up, sighted it in real quick, and within just a few minutes, 
I remembered Exactly why I enjoy it so much!

 

Bull and Bottom/Center are the 2 dots I used to sight in..
The rest were my actual shots.
Those random looking ones in between does? Those aren't random..
That's where there used to be little tiny numbers: 7's, 8's, and 9's..
The thing is ridiculously accurate..

It's funny seeing people try to knock the lower and mid range guns using hear say and opinions.. 
Then they go on and on about high end [high priced anyways] setups.. 
Well, I was just looking over the board, and saw a few new threads on here..
People trying to figure out out to troubleshoot / FiX their... 'high end setups'..

I'll just throw this out there.. The PB I just shot that target with.. Factory/Stock-Tune. 
The only thing that I did was fine-tune my trigger - comparable to my match-grade bench rest 10/22's.

At 30 yards, I can shoot the thumb tacks off of other people's targets.. 
All the annoying AR15 fanboys there just love me.  



Sam -

PS: I just grabbed a vid from one of my threads on here.. 
While waiting for the PB to get back, I re-sighted my Hatsan Gladius and took it for another spin.. 
Now, it's Freezing here in NY, so this is only at my indoor 10M range, but... 
This rifle will do the same exact thing at 20 yards, 30 yards, 40 yards, 50 yards.. 
I just go with better/heavier pellets and adjust to a higher power setting..  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=123&v=NDIy29cuDQ4

 

[mvonbeamer]

I had a bullboss in 25 caliber. I bought it to see if I would stay interested in PCP rifles without spending a ridiculous amount of money. I actually liked it a lot. I found it to be very accurate and reliable. The issues I had with it was that it was very heavy and as someone said above, the trigger was not great. I could put pellet on pellet at 35 yards all day, so the trigger wasn't terrible I just didn't like the way it broke. I bought a Vulcan and then sold the bullboss. the Vulcan cost three times as much but the trigger is better. You do get what you pay for but not everyone wants to spend $1500 for an airgun. If your new to PCP, the bullboss is fine. Its powerful, reasonably quiet, and accurate. I had absolutely no issues with the rifle.

 

[kkarmical]

 

As much as I love my Kral (.22 P/breaker) I would still go Marauder if I had to choose just one over the other straight from the factory. Better quality control at Crosman. If Buying a Kral just realize that you may have to have a little work done to it to ensure its shooting good.

Kral - better shot count out the box, plus it has a power adjuster which is nice when you do not need to shoot at full power. The gun thinks it's regulated, the shot count comes in with 72 shots between fills which is amazing. It's so light shoots offhand very well,. Under 50 groups good, past that it's more on me than the gun.

Mrod - easy to work on, find upgraded parts ( be warned can become a money pit). One modification ends up being several. For instance I've added a new valve, hammer, springs, regulator, and a bullpup stock to it, and it more than just a gun, it's a project and hobby all in one.

Hatsan for lets make this as heavy as possible

 

[DirtyDovi]

kkarmical, Say it aint' so?!?!  
[I just got done shooting my PB before work, and love it even more now]

I grew up shooting Crosman / Benjamin rifles - Great options also! 
I had to laugh when I read what you wrote about the M-Rods possibly becoming a money pit.. 
Yeah man, there are soooo many awesome modifications and upgrades for those! 
It's probably a good idea that I skipped over those.. I'm a tinkerholic by nature, and never know when to stop.

Great info and well said!

Hatsan: Yup, no doubt.. I think they secretly infuse the composite stocks with concrete/lead dust for added weight.

 

Sam -

 

[kkarmical]

I tend to grab the Kral most of the time, more shots are always welcome.

 

[mcoulter]

One more observation regarding the kral bigmax and hatsan flash. While the kral gets a few points for having a power adjustment wheel (transfer port adjustment) its hammer spring has very little room for adjustment. The hatsan lacks TP adjustment but more than makes up for it in a hammer spring that has a wide range of adjustment to it. I recently opened up the transfer ports on the kral and will be using the TP adjustment to test accuracy with JSB 18.1 grain pellets at different velocities. At full power (TP wide-open) the gun is shooting them a bit fast now and accuracy with them has suffered a bit. However, the extra power I got opening up the ports brought the speed into the sweet spot with the JSB monsters.

I did a full shot string with jsb 18s yesterday and it confirmed that accuracy suffers above 920 fps with them. Here are 130 shots in 10-shot groups at 50 yards. Meh...

:



I shot these groups with the redesigned monsters after topping the gun off. Now this is what were talking about Again 50 yards and 10-shot groups:

 

[pesty3782]

I was in the same boat I have a Taipan in 25 and marauder in 25 and love them both. I wanted a 22 bull pup but didn’t want the taipan price more of a beater rifle. I just ordered up the Hatsan Flashpup from PA. In 22. And a few tins of pellets. I used the code here at the website and got 10% off but had to pay the 20 shipping.

Tony P

 

[jrosiens]

I recently purchased a Hatsan Flashpup .25. Really happy with the accuracy. It is an entry level PCP gun. For my needs it is perfect. I can get a great grouping at 50 yards and hunt small critters if I want. Very quiet and backyard friendly.