RAW Rapid HM1000X Hammer Spring

[MikeAllen]

What range of velocities should I expect from hammer spring adjustment on the R.A.W. HM1000X .25 caliber rifle? On mine, turning the hammer spring 2-3 full rotations in or out has almost no effect on velocity. I know it is supposed to be a fine adjustment, but I'm seeing only 1-2 fps difference.

 

[Stubbers]

What range of velocities should I expect from hammer spring adjustment on the R.A.W. HM1000X .25 caliber rifle? On mine, turning the hammer spring 2-3 full rotations in or out has almost no effect on velocity. I know it is supposed to be a fine adjustment, but I'm seeing only 1-2 fps difference.

Sounds like another over-sprung pcp, what regulator setting are you running?

Best options are to either up the regulator, or, order a new spring with slightly less lb/in rating.

This calculator will allow you to determine the current springs rating, if you're willing to tear down and measuring with calipers.

Spring Rate Calculator

-Matt

 

[MikeAllen]

Sounds like another over-sprung pcp, what regulator setting are you running?

Best options are to either up the regulator, or, order a new spring with slightly less lb/in rating.

This calculator will allow you to determine the current springs rating, if you're willing to tear down and measuring with calipers.

Spring Rate Calculator

-Matt

Thanks Matt - I’ve also engaged Air Worx in troubleshooting.

 

[Stubbers]

Thanks Matt - I’ve also entrapped Air Worx in troubleshooting.

Good deal. If you do go the route of seeking a weaker spring, make sure it has similar dimensions (OD, ID) and equal length, primarily only reducing the lb/in rating.

-Matt

 

[Raydee38]

I swapped out the RAW reg on my .22 with a Huma regulator and to get the desired velocity I wanted I had to turn the Huma reg down quite a bit (110psi). After that my hammer spring barely makes any changes also.

 

[Stubbers]

I swapped out the RAW reg on my .22 with a Huma regulator and to get the desired velocity I wanted I had to turn the Huma reg down quite a bit (110psi). After that my hammer spring barely makes any changes also.

If you're keen on tearing down and measuring the spring dimensions to figure out the rating.

Compression Spring Calculator

compression spring calculator, compression spring design, compression spring calculation, compression spring calculations, calculate spring constant, spring design, calculating spring constant

www.planetspring.com

From there you can source a spring similar in dimensions with a smaller wire od, and check that calculator again to make sure its not TOO weak. Ideally only a 1-2 less lb/in spring.

There are other ways to skin the cat but the above allows you to return to the stock spring if you wish.

-Matt

 

[Raydee38]

If you're keen on tearing down and measuring the spring dimensions to figure out the rating.

Compression Spring Calculator

compression spring calculator, compression spring design, compression spring calculation, compression spring calculations, calculate spring constant, spring design, calculating spring constant

www.planetspring.com

From there you can source a spring similar in dimensions with a smaller wire od, and check that calculator again to make sure its not TOO weak. Ideally only a 1-2 less lb/in spring.

There are other ways to skin the cat but the above allows you to return to the stock spring if you wish.

-Matt

I will def look into that. I wonder if the RAW .25 comes with a heavier spring than the .22 does. I did switch the barrel and probe on my RAW .25 for a .22 but never messed with the hammer spring.

 

[corny]

While it’s difficult to know what going on now.

But when I ordered springs from Martin a couple years ago, they were specificly marked that they were intentionally long and to be clipped during the tune.
And to be honest I never found the hammer adjuster to do much of anything on a raw.my thought was its simply to fine tune for the sweet spot.

In order to tune up or down. I had to adjust the reg, and either make a hammer spring spacer or clip the spring itself.

I guess what I’m trying to say, they really aren’t setup to srsly mess with fps.
Your best bet is recording where you are now, get duplicates of stuff to mess with the tune.

 

[Stubbers]

While it’s difficult to know what going on now.

But when I ordered springs from Martin a couple years ago, they were specificly marked that they were intentionally long and to be clipped during the tune.
And to be honest I never found the hammer adjuster to do much of anything on a raw.my thought was its simply to fine tune for the sweet spot.

In order to tune up or down. I had to adjust the reg, and either make a hammer spring spacer or clip the spring itself.

I guess what I’m trying to say, they really aren’t setup to srsly mess with fps.
Your best bet is recording where you are now, get duplicates of stuff to mess with the tune.

If the HST adjuster makes reasonable changes in preload, it SHOULD make reasonable changes to fps...having the same spring cut down doesn't necessarily help, you need a spring with a lower lb/in rating...that is unless, it is a Cothran style valve that just blows open, then a HST is useless, but I doubt this valve is such a style.

-Matt

 

[Motorhead]

Your already MAXED OUT

 

[Airgunmann]

Sounds like another over-sprung pcp, what regulator setting are you running?

Best options are to either up the regulator, or, order a new spring with slightly less lb/in rating.

This calculator will allow you to determine the current springs rating, if you're willing to tear down and measuring with calipers.

Spring Rate Calculator

-Matt

Yeah over sprung I know the hammers are quite heavy as well when I had my hm1000x i was able to shave quite a bit of weight off the hammer and shorten the spring

 

[Chasdog]

What range of velocities should I expect from hammer spring adjustment on the R.A.W. HM1000X .25 caliber rifle? On mine, turning the hammer spring 2-3 full rotations in or out has almost no effect on velocity. I know it is supposed to be a fine adjustment, but I'm seeing only 1-2 fps difference.

I just shot my new hm1000x 22 caliber yesterday day with Lab radar. It started out at 1088 fps with the 25.39 jsb pellets , after moving the hammer adjustment wheel 4 or 5 times it came down to 957 fps. That’s where I left it. So my wheel worked. Since I moved it incrementally each time I’m not sure how much I moved it , but my guess is about 1 revolution or slightly less.

 

[Raydee38]

Here is the part I am not understanding with my RAW .22, even if I am maxed out with the reg set at say 120bar and shooting 930fps with the hammer spring all the way in, shouldn't it still slow the FPS down when it is screwed all the way out?

 

[Jaxjax]

Sounds like we need a basic RAW tuning tutorial with factory Regs & Huma. It would be helpful for many I'm sure. Now to find someone willing to take the time to do that.

 

[MikeAllen]

My reg was set so it delivered about 870 fps. When I spoke to RAW they suggested that I increase reg pressure by 1/4 turn. This upped the velocity to about 910 fps and also made the hammer spring more effective. One half turn increased velocity from 910 to 919. I'm continuing to mess with it and will report my findings.

 

[corny]

Here is the part I am not understanding with my RAW .22, even if I am maxed out with the reg set at say 120bar and shooting 930fps with the hammer spring all the way in, shouldn't it still slow the FPS down when it is screwed all the way out?

Generally speaking, most ppl will not tune a gun at max velocity for any set reg pressure. It tends to be loud and a air hog.

That being said, if a gun it set up to really slap open a valve, it can take a couple turns to start seeing a reduction in fps.

Raw usually doesn’t allow a ton of turns before the adjustment screw hits the wood stock.

 

[Raydee38]

Generally speaking, most ppl will not tune a gun at max velocity for any set reg pressure. It tends to be loud and a air hog.

That being said, if a gun it set up to really slap open a valve, it can take a couple turns to start seeing a reduction in fps.

Raw usually doesn’t allow a ton of turns before the adjustment screw hits the wood stock.

I have my reg turned way down (Huma Reg), I had it set to 140 or 150 and was shooting .22 pellets at 1010fps so I turned the reg down to 110bar to get the pellets shooting closer to 920-930 with the hammer spring about right in the middle of the travel. Backing it all the way out makes just about no difference in fps for some reason. I turned it in a little just to see if it changes the velocity and it doesn't seem to do anything. Martin said that there is no difference in hammer springs between the .22 and .25 RAW's.

 

[MikeAllen]

RAW sent me a regulator under warranty, thinking that may have been part of the problem. It was preset at 145 BAR. What I've heard - and experienced - is that Diabolo pellets like speeds in the 850~900 fps range. The new reg pushes .25 caliber 34 grain pellets down the alley at 923 fps average. They are hitting very nicely - lots of 10's and X's. My previous experience (FX M3) was 872 fps was the sweet spot. I'm thinking the different twist rates are the difference - 1:24 choked for the FX versus 1:17.7 unchoked for the RAW. Thoughts?

 

[Ranchibi]

RAW sent me a regulator under warranty, thinking that may have been part of the problem. It was preset at 145 BAR. What I've heard - and experienced - is that Diabolo pellets like speeds in the 850~900 fps range. The new reg pushes .25 caliber 34 grain pellets down the alley at 923 fps average. They are hitting very nicely - lots of 10's and X's. My previous experience (FX M3) was 872 fps was the sweet spot. I'm thinking the different twist rates are the difference - 1:24 choked for the FX versus 1:17.7 unchoked for the RAW. Thoughts?

Mike! I am glad RAW sent you a new reg! Chokes definitely slow projectile speeds (I dislike choked barrels on modern PCP's as there is no need for them now that ammo manufacturing is tight)! Twist rates also make a difference, although each barrel is slightly different, I tried shooting 18gr @ 880-900 thru my RAW but it is so much more accurate at 950-990, so definitely the twist rate working here on non-choked poly barrel.

 

[MikeAllen]

Mike! I am glad RAW sent you a new reg! Chokes definitely slow projectile speeds (I dislike choked barrels on modern PCP's as there is no need for them now that ammo manufacturing is tight)! Twist rates also make a difference, although each barrel is slightly different, I tried shooting 18gr @ 880-900 thru my RAW but it is so much more accurate at 950-990, so definitely the twist rate working here on non-choked poly barrel.

Thanks! Great information. I think all of the air rifle manufacturers are actually owned by the pellet manufacturers! I can go through 1,000 pellets just to determine if my settings match my suppositions! I think those that control wind all over the world are in on it also!