HN SLUGS first thoughts did I get defects ?

[jwrabbit123]

HI I usually shoot my own casted slugs but the last month or so I decided to test other brands which others here are using , and seeing how they are , I have tested some of NSA 22 and 30 cal hi speed slugs in my Edgun R5M in .22 caliber and 30 caliber , My tune is set up for my MP slugs shooting about 69 FPE



I got some HN slugs in mail today I decided to shoot some of the 27 grian ones . I have been waiting to try these out , I watched Videos on them and remembered they said they used a lube for slugs for accuracy improvements , I my self have a few types of accuracy oil ,

So I grabbed a Tin , I noticed they had black foam instead of white , I eagerly removed foam , and saw the slugs with a ton of lube on them , They were also very dark , My thought was maybe the oil they used ? or pure lead ? , I then grabbed a few they felt extremely gritty , I looked at my fingers and saw lead , I then decided to dump out 2 small tins so like 600 slugs , I grabbed some hot water and dawn and washed and rinsed , I saw a ton of lead , I was like ??? . I then poured a bit of the blackish water and filings on a few paper towels , I then put them out to air dry then I want to weigh and check constantly of sizes and weight , But I want to show people here what came out of mine geeze this isnt all of it probably 1 tin worth most went down drain ,

These were dirtiest slugs I ever bought so far , I am glad I caught it , I have good guns and dont want this stuff inside my PCP actions or bolts or in my transfer port and entering

valve ,

I do hope HN sees this and cleans them , Bust what I do not understand if they are swagged why is their all these filings ??????????

I spend too much on my guns and alot of time to tune my guns , I make sure everything is perfect , this isn't acceptable to me .



you guys please check yours before you try them ,

I have not shot any yet ,I was seriously thinking of returning them but I will wash and sort and try them and hopefully they see what is going out to us end users ,

LOU

anyone else have this ?????



unwashed

rinsed

lead flakes pellets were coated in oil and this , I dont want this in my guns

and like dirty oil

 

[Acruz]

Someone should be embarrassed that made it out the door. What ever happened to QC?

 

[Pickzilla]

Well that's an environmental hazard! Yikes. QC folks must have been on drugs. 

 

[ChuckHunter]

Holy cow thats horrible!!!

I've been holding off on buying some just waiting to see some reviews from here in the states....that's not a good first impression! I sure hope they shoot after all that prep your having to do

James from Michigan 

 

[RobR]

My FX hybrids were just as bad. I loaded up my Dreamline mag twice and there are 20 plus little flakes of lead trapped in the mag. I usually wash everything but thought I could be lazy for what I paid for them.

 

[jwrabbit123]

maybe HN will respond and send me new ones and swap these to see just how bad mine are , I will test the 27 gr but I wont touch other grains yet



Not for nothing I can cast 1000 slugs and resize them here and no flakes I do not have to clean ammo I make , Imagine with hollowpoints all shavings causing all to fly different and yes little things add up at long range , 

I know HN makes slugs and they know what a precision slug is , I wonder if they even realize this is what got to me in USA , I am sure others in this lot must be same , did anyone look at theirs please .

LOU

 

[TarheelScott]

Thank you for the heads up jw. That wooommmpppps !

 

[STO]

That dark color, combined with a "gritty" nature, makes me think they may have tumbled them in molly lube. It is not uncommon in the firearms industry for bullets to be coated molybdenum disulfide, and some people swear by it for that application, however I believe it is quite rare in the airgun industry. Maybe someone more seasoned than I could comment on this? 

 

[ChuckHunter]

I was thinking kinda the same thing...maybe a moly or graphite coat but all the shavings mixed in is not good !

James from Michigan 

 

[Pickzilla]

That dark color, combined with a "gritty" nature, makes me think they may have tumbled them in molly lube. It is not uncommon in the firearms industry for bullets to be coated molybdenum disulfide, and some people swear by it for that application, however I believe it is quite rare in the airgun industry. Maybe someone more seasoned than I could comment on this?

The oil is most likely a remnant of the bulk manufacturing process... lead is sticky, so they use oil to keep it from sticking in the presses. JSB does also... BUT, they are supposed to clean it up as best as possible by rolling the pellets/slugs in thin towels. That amount of free lead shavings means they most likely rushed em out the door. Not pretty. 

 

[jwrabbit123]

I believe same it is oil to lube dies it should be cleaned , it was dark , and it is not Moly , I know about this I am a long range shooter it is a bulk oil and yes cleaning must have been skipped they showed rows of woman hand picking , they were not handling these their hands were not like black and with shards of lead in their hands I going to show HN and see what they say

Update I did show HN this thread in an email and sent pics and asked if they wanted to swap my ammo out with others back to them to see what we getting here in USA , No answer yet , In video he did tell AEAC they inspect all and they do track my lot so if any bad ones they can fix issues , NO answer yet from them , it has been 24 hrs

 

[Long_Shot]

How do the back of them look up close? Did the lead pieces come off the base of the slugs, leaving small imperfections in the bases possibly? Just a thought.

Does look like they were never cleaned in the photos and your description of what you cleaned off them.

That HP hole doesn't look very deep. Have you even considered weighing/measuring diameter of some to check for consistency?

 

[villaman]

H&N slugs shoot fantastic out of my crown , mates wild cat and know of another 10 shooters who have the same results as us 

Only tried 21 and 23 gr 217 / 218 but all shot really great in both liners and at 121 yards had a group under 3/4 inch 

 

[jwrabbit123]

Update from H&N

I spoke to a man from H&N and I gave him info from the tins and the Production manager and the QC manager said that amount of shavings is totally normal and the advise up not to clean off the special accuracy lube , Thank you H&N for checking into this and clearing it up for us . and thank you for getting back to me so quickly HN .

LOU

 

[StarlingChaser]

I had 2000 of these slugs ordered when I read this, 27g in .217, 27g in .218, and 30g in .217. Mine looked the same way. I washed all 10 tins in dawn and hot water and re-lubed them in slick 50 supercharged. I have not shot any yet but I took a few picks. I personally hope these work good for me because the price is so much better. You can buy 3 and get the 4th free from PA and there are 200 per instead of 100. I did use calipers on them and they were very consistent. .217’s were .217 and .218’s were .218. I can wash them if the price is right, lol. If anyone is interested I can post results later but might be a while. Gun is tuned for NSA 23g right now at 122 bar, need to shoot them 1st. Also I lube all my pellets and slugs with same stuff just to keep cleaning down, in my opinion it helps for that. The pics are of the cleaning bowl and strained through a towel after all 10 tins. 

 

[jwrabbit123]

ok well I was not only one who noticed , HN said not to clean they are fine in guns , I did fire some cleaned and some uncleaned , they had said accuracy would suffer cleaning off the accuracy oil and you can damage skirts , by cleaning them .

I just wanted to say I have shot them both ways , I am waiting to hear If Hn wanted any real world test data , as I can do this with this ammo

 

[Kaeokini]

Aloha LOU,

Glad you made contact with H&N, their answer seems like a corporate thing to say. I don't know about you but I would wash & lube the slugs also, your right in washing those slugs, I wouldn't want all of that slag going into my guns. (Accuracy oil)  never saw that in Steve's video when he visited the factory. I ordered from Neil (NSA) & Dale (VK) and never had slag like what you cleaned off. I might have to hold off on ordering H&N slugs, being I would want all of that slag to get into my guns. I hope they will let you do a real world test...

Aloha, Keone

 

[jwrabbit123]

Kaeokini 



yes they said it is accuracy oil , I make cast and I have had a corbin swag , I use noe and Lee and a Lyman lube-matic sizer , I use pure lead I have bought and made wire before and I make most slugs with 95% lead and 5% tin and I never ever saw this , swagers or sizers I do have no shavings like this ,

I know they must make millions a day but have you saw slugs or pellets ths dirty ? I did offer to send back others , but they said it was normal . So I donno

I have saw manga-flow machines which make 15k slugs per hr per machine and they dont have this either , I thought honestly they would of checked lot s and then maybe figured out which machine and recheck what isnt aligned or what ever , But also in their video they showed all these ladies qc them , lol their hads didnt look like mine , I had to remove 3 lead splinters after 1 session of shooting 600 of the 27 gr unwashed gathering data .

 

[StarlingChaser]

So did you see any accuracy changes with or without cleaning? For me it is not an option. I was not putting that in my gun period. I don’t think it would hurt the gun other than make the barrel dirty and loose accuracy. It would make a mess out of your magazines for sure and get all over your fingers which end up all over your gun, scope, etc. How did the 27’s do overall?

 

[StarlingChaser]

So I wanted to update. I will also start another thread since there is so little info out there on the H&N slugs. Look for H&N 27g & 30g testing. I started out today by going out to the farm and shooting starlings and to use up my supply of 23g slugs. It got so windy the 23g were unreliable 18mph with 33mph gusts. They dont shoot all that great out of my gun anyway, good enough to shoot starlings if it is fairly calm but not ethical in that wind. Anyway since I had used up all my heavier slugs it was time to break out the new H&Ns. A recap 27g .217, 27g .218, 30g .217. I used the 27g .217`s at my work bench to set my starting point. I went to 963 fps then used the valve stop to back it down to 946. I set up at 30 yds. I then shot 5 or 6 shots to get the scope close. Next I shot a 5-shot group for all 3 sizes. I never touched any adjustments just shot the 3 groups. To say the least I will be washing more of these slugs! Here are the pics of my results.