All true, but trying to tune without a chronograph adds conderable time and work. Example, you get great groups at 25 yards, but with a terrible ES. That tells me it's going to be horrible at 50 yards, don't waste any more time on it.
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How important is it to own chronograph if you tune your gun? And why?
- Thread starter Wosku
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To a degree but who tunes and checks accuracy at 25 yds if you are shooting longer distance? I certainly dont even tho I do use a chronograph. Like I said you might have an es of 5 and get tiny groups at 25 yds but falls apart at 50+. Accuracy testing at 25 yds when you plan on shooting out to 100 yds is pointless in my opinion even if you have chrony numbers. I never check accuracy under 50 yds. Not using a chrony shouldn't add any time to tuning. The fps makes no difference in tuning if you dont want a specific fps.
If you are tuning a new rifle and the chrony says you are getting 860 fps and the accuracy isnt up to par knowing its 860 fps dont matter. You will make an adjustment with or without a chrony. After that adjustment the fps is irrelevant again and only the accuracy matters. I say that if the person doesnt care what fps/ fpe the gun is making and only cares about accuracy.
I use a chrony buy not to tell me if I should make an adjustment. I use it so when my accuracy is where I think it should be I already have my numbers and dont need to shoot again. I also usually buy a rifle based on a window of power so I need the chrony to verify I get the accuracy I want in that window. If I didnt care what power the rifle made the chrony would be somewhat useless to me for accuracy tuning.
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I would not want to tune without one. Sure there are a lot of old school air gunners tha can do it without and that does impress me. Not enough to try it though.
I have an FX. Love it. Fits in my gear bag and an extra set of batteries fits in the small bag I have for it. Mine got finicky about placement then a fellow shooter told me to take the thing off the barrel, turn the Barrel V thing straight down and shoot. No more placement issues, no more barrel droop or POI changes. Sure there are better chronies out there but it does what I need it to.
I have an FX. Love it. Fits in my gear bag and an extra set of batteries fits in the small bag I have for it. Mine got finicky about placement then a fellow shooter told me to take the thing off the barrel, turn the Barrel V thing straight down and shoot. No more placement issues, no more barrel droop or POI changes. Sure there are better chronies out there but it does what I need it to.
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I've been using the FX chronograph for 2+ years now. I love it. Yes, it eats batteries, and the battery compartment uses a dumb screw. But those are the only criticisms I have of it.
Two work arounds for the battery issue is to use rechargables, and do not store it with batteries inside. The other would be to build a remote battery pack with an on/off switch. I do the former, but I find I only use the FX a few times a year so that's okay.
Two work arounds for the battery issue is to use rechargables, and do not store it with batteries inside. The other would be to build a remote battery pack with an on/off switch. I do the former, but I find I only use the FX a few times a year so that's okay.
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I’m a firm believer in a chrono. Why, just the other day I replaced the delrin piston on my amp reg to the new brass one and after three shots, the velocities slowly went down with each shot in great numbers. From 980 and three shots later down to 675. It was handy that the chronograph was able to tell me this right away so I was able to troubleshoot correctly.
With the FXchrono, I like the fact I’m able to save the string after a tune by emailing it to me and saving it on my notes, date stamped. We’re all getting older and our memories aren’t like they used to be, so referring to notes help.
And for all you guys with the two complaints of batteries getting eaten up and the pain in the arse battery lid screw, just convert over to permanent batteries wired in series, and providing you with a usb plug. At home I plug into power via a usb ported plug, and while remote I plug into a battery power pack that lasts a long time!
What I have taped to the chrono is just the extra cord tape that comes with the batteries. Wound up the extra and taped it. I never worry about swapping batteries or charging up rechargeables.
With the FXchrono, I like the fact I’m able to save the string after a tune by emailing it to me and saving it on my notes, date stamped. We’re all getting older and our memories aren’t like they used to be, so referring to notes help.
And for all you guys with the two complaints of batteries getting eaten up and the pain in the arse battery lid screw, just convert over to permanent batteries wired in series, and providing you with a usb plug. At home I plug into power via a usb ported plug, and while remote I plug into a battery power pack that lasts a long time!
What I have taped to the chrono is just the extra cord tape that comes with the batteries. Wound up the extra and taped it. I never worry about swapping batteries or charging up rechargeables.
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I haven’t read all the responses here but a chrony is a great tool.
It seems a lot of folks including myself find the adjustability of air guns particularly appealing and for me it was nice to move away from using board penetration to gauge power to something consistent and repeatable.
I would feel blind in a way without the chronograph to show me what’s up.
It seems a lot of folks including myself find the adjustability of air guns particularly appealing and for me it was nice to move away from using board penetration to gauge power to something consistent and repeatable.
I would feel blind in a way without the chronograph to show me what’s up.
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Agree completely, also by not using a chronoyou really get in tune yourself with your rifles and soon enough you can tell pretty closely how fast the guns are shooting,....I know that because when I started using Chronograph my guestimate was pretty spot on with the data,.....I still do it today, I first do it by feel then maybe I crosscheck with a chrono and that isn't often.
Like driving, I don't use GPS of other aids.....zero, I rather get connected,
that is also why I love traditional archery, it's all instinctive.
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I guess all that matters is that you end up with a good tune, and your method obviously works for you. But your example demonstrates a situation in which I would find a chronograph useful. Assume your accuracy isn't satisfactory, and you know from experience that your best accuracy will likely be in the 880-890 range. In your example, without a chronograph you don't know that you're shooting 860, so, which way do you go? It could be 860, or 960. I think you are doing what works for you, and it's a method in which you have confidence, can't argue with that, I just see real value in the chronograph, for me. And it's fun, as I enjoy seeing the exact result from a specific adjustment.
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I use a chrono but the question was is it necessary to tune. The simple answer is no if you only care about the best accuracy not fps/fpe. Sure you might use more pellets and time if you are going the wrong direction but the question wasnt whats the fastest way to tune. I think a chrono is essential for me and shooting in general whether its a powder burner or pcp. But for the question posed its not essential but very useful. It sounds like we do things the same but I can do an accuracy tune without a chrono and I am sure any one could if they pay attention and record the adjustments as they tune.
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Absolutely right. I've done without a chrono several times, and the accuracy result was just as good as had I used the chrono. My only issue, I had to go back and tweak it, because the power level wasn't where I needed to be. I would have had to do the same with the chrono, but I would have gotten it done in a single session.
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M
Member 32425
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Hi Wosku. So here is a bit of my rambling and a little story (hope you all like stories -- true ones). You asked how important it is to own a chronograph if you tune your gun (and why). Airgunning is physics -- lots of it. You can ignore all that stuff and just fiddle with your gun settings and try different weights of slugs/pellets until you get good enough accuracy or good enough power or whatever is good enough for you. Maybe you get everything working great in just a day or a weekend of fiddling. For some guys that's all there is to it and they are happy shooters. My best friend is like that. I talked him into buying an expensive airgun (thousands of $) that took months to get here. In the mean time he borrowed an inexpensive airgun ($350) and was able to kill ground squirrels at an unbelievable 200 yards (verified with my rangefinder) with two to three shots at each squirrel. That was with a cheap 9 power fixed scope with simple crosshairs.
The next weekend at the same place with the same airgun and same 25 cal NSA slugs, he was shooting at more ground squirrels that were not nearly as far away (about 100 yards) and the slugs were hitting the dirt well short of the target. He didn't have a wide enough field of view through the scope to aim any higher with the squirrel still in view through the scope. My buddy thought there was something wrong with the scope. I had my cheap chinese chronograph and my smartphone with a ballistics app on it, so we chronographed some shots. I plugged the numberes into my ballistic app. I crunched some numbers and told my buddy that the muzzle velocity was simply too low to do what he was doing the week before. This proved that the problem was not with the scope and that, for some reason, the muzzle velocity had to be lower than the week before (we didn't know what the muzzle velocity was the week before because we didn't chrony it). Fortunately I remembered what the regulator pressure and spring preload was from the previous weekend. It sure would have been nice if we were taking notes when the gun was working well and included the muzzle velocity as part of the info. So for me it kind of narrowed down the problem to either a dirty barrel or a problem with the valve or maybe an air leak. We cleaned the barrel and got a bunch of crappy lead fouling out of it. I was shocked because I've always used NSA slugs and have never seen anything like that. Later we learned that the guy who owned the gun had shot a bunch of crappy pellets through it between the current weekend and the previous weekend -- that explained the crud, but we didn't find that out until the next day. So we cleaned the barrel and chronied more shots and the muzzle velocity was up a lot from before the cleaning. My buddy then had no problem taking out those pesky ground squirrels at long ranges again for what was left of the weekend.
So Wosku, even if you are not planning a sniper one-shot-one-kill assault on a squirrel and you don't need any fancy tuning, you can still make good use of a cheap chinese chronograph -- and take notes when things are working well -- ambient temperature included.
I have an FX Radar chrony, a Shooting Chrony Beta, and a cheap chinese chrony. The FX Radar chrony is the only one I sincerely WANT to shoot -- repeatedly -- a full mag. I don't think I will ever trust the FX chrony. $200 piece of time-wasting junk. I love the cheap chinese chrony for airgun use.
grungy
The next weekend at the same place with the same airgun and same 25 cal NSA slugs, he was shooting at more ground squirrels that were not nearly as far away (about 100 yards) and the slugs were hitting the dirt well short of the target. He didn't have a wide enough field of view through the scope to aim any higher with the squirrel still in view through the scope. My buddy thought there was something wrong with the scope. I had my cheap chinese chronograph and my smartphone with a ballistics app on it, so we chronographed some shots. I plugged the numberes into my ballistic app. I crunched some numbers and told my buddy that the muzzle velocity was simply too low to do what he was doing the week before. This proved that the problem was not with the scope and that, for some reason, the muzzle velocity had to be lower than the week before (we didn't know what the muzzle velocity was the week before because we didn't chrony it). Fortunately I remembered what the regulator pressure and spring preload was from the previous weekend. It sure would have been nice if we were taking notes when the gun was working well and included the muzzle velocity as part of the info. So for me it kind of narrowed down the problem to either a dirty barrel or a problem with the valve or maybe an air leak. We cleaned the barrel and got a bunch of crappy lead fouling out of it. I was shocked because I've always used NSA slugs and have never seen anything like that. Later we learned that the guy who owned the gun had shot a bunch of crappy pellets through it between the current weekend and the previous weekend -- that explained the crud, but we didn't find that out until the next day. So we cleaned the barrel and chronied more shots and the muzzle velocity was up a lot from before the cleaning. My buddy then had no problem taking out those pesky ground squirrels at long ranges again for what was left of the weekend.
So Wosku, even if you are not planning a sniper one-shot-one-kill assault on a squirrel and you don't need any fancy tuning, you can still make good use of a cheap chinese chronograph -- and take notes when things are working well -- ambient temperature included.
I have an FX Radar chrony, a Shooting Chrony Beta, and a cheap chinese chrony. The FX Radar chrony is the only one I sincerely WANT to shoot -- repeatedly -- a full mag. I don't think I will ever trust the FX chrony. $200 piece of time-wasting junk. I love the cheap chinese chrony for airgun use.
grungy
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Nomore problems with batteries. I had this battery travel-pack for almost ten years but we couldn't travel the past two years, so I employ it in best possible way. I think I recharge it this year maybe 2-3 times, and for emergency there is the second usb port for cellphone or my range tablet.
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How important is a chrony for tuning? How important is your eyes for driving?
Without a chrony is like driving blind. How are you going to know your speed to tune your gun?
Fx chonry is ok but is expensive. There are many chorny out there 1/4 the price that does the same thing.
Without a chrony is like driving blind. How are you going to know your speed to tune your gun?
Fx chonry is ok but is expensive. There are many chorny out there 1/4 the price that does the same thing.
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For any job to be well done and also repeatable ... takes the correct tool/s.
The Chronograph is one such tool.
Nuff said ...
The Chronograph is one such tool.
Nuff said ...
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i see alot of guys bashing the fx chrono,
i have one,
and to me its literally the best thing ever.
being able to go out on the porch at night and run some strings,yes please lol
of course i understand stuff happens, defect/damage/etc...
placement seemed to play a big part in it functioning how it should,
with it vertical
(such as when banded to the muzzle)
i had a few hiccups.
when i mounted it horizontally on the front side rail on my impact it worked every time and has ever since.
i have one,
and to me its literally the best thing ever.
being able to go out on the porch at night and run some strings,yes please lol
of course i understand stuff happens, defect/damage/etc...
placement seemed to play a big part in it functioning how it should,
with it vertical
(such as when banded to the muzzle)
i had a few hiccups.
when i mounted it horizontally on the front side rail on my impact it worked every time and has ever since.
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sure thing.
its from midwest elite airguns.
heres a few pics,and the link to it.
i leave it attached to the chrono,
it fits into my impact case perfectly so bonus there too.
midwesteliteairgun.com
its from midwest elite airguns.
heres a few pics,and the link to it.
i leave it attached to the chrono,
it fits into my impact case perfectly so bonus there too.
FX Chronograph Picatinny adapter - Midwest Elite Airgun
No longer do you need rubber bands or long poles holding your chronograph. With the Midwest Elite Picatinny adapter you can slide your chronograph right on to your picatinny rail.
midwesteliteairgun.com Upvote 0
When I was shooting powder burners competitively I had a chrony and used it occasionally but not often. I wanted consistency and a given rifle and a given hand load delivered that. It didn’t seem to matter how fast the bullet was going, I got good groups as long as I took care in my prep work. I’m much newer to airgunning but again, pellet speed doesn’t seem to matter. A little practice has shown that as long as pressure stays in a certain range I get tight groups. I don’t pest so that’s all I need. I suspect that shooters who are more deeply into tuning will get more use from a chrony and the data it delivers but for me I see no need.
Rick H.
Rick H.
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