Hunter Class - new shooter on a budget.

[gfhickman]

I'd try either the 13.43s at 820 or the FTT 14.66gr at 780fps.

If you really think you're going to stick with the game maybe look into a Huntsman in .177 through the classifieds or even new. Id still recommend sticking with what you have for now but wanting a new gun is definitely understandable. Those Huntsman are sort of budget friendly and you very likely won't grow out of it soon or have any real issues.

I do like the idea of invest in your first purchase and buy something that will last, but a huntsman is out of my budget range.

If I do consider this route I would have to shoot my Avenger until July at the shortest. Part of the reason I started this thread was to search this kind of advice. I might outgrow a new Avenger 177 quickly and wish I had just saved for a better rifle. Until I started researching this sort I had never seen a Daystate, let alone heard of them.

There is so much to learn and consider I know, and I appreciate the help for sure. I will have to get my hands on lighter pellets and see what my Avenger likes as a starting point.

 

[Sqwirl57]

I do like the idea of invest in your first purchase and buy something that will last, but a huntsman is out of my budget range.

If I do consider this route I would have to shoot my Avenger until July at the shortest. Part of the reason I started this thread was to search this kind of advice. I might outgrow a new Avenger 177 quickly and wish I had just saved for a better rifle. Until I started researching this sort I had never seen a Daystate, let alone heard of them.

There is so much to learn and consider I know, and I appreciate the help for sure. I will have to get my hands on lighter pellets and see what my Avenger likes as a starting point.

Yeah thats kind of why I and a lot of other guys were saying to use what you have for the first season. 22 cal really isn't that much of a disadvantage if you can shoot it well. My whole first season I shot with a .22 springer and did fairly decent. An Avenger is in a different league in comparison.

Just remember to have fun. Thats really all its about in the long run and you can have a ton of fun with what you already have.

 

[gfhickman]

Yeah thats kind of why I and a lot of other guys were saying to use what you have for the first season. 22 cal really isn't that much of a disadvantage if you can shoot it well. My whole first season I shot with a .22 springer and did fairly decent. An Avenger is in a different league in comparison.

Just remember to have fun. Thats really all its about in the long run and you can have a ton of fun with what you already have.

I approach any sport that way. I like to say I'm only competiting against myself. If I improve from match to match I'm on the right track. Being disabled I want to find things that engage my mind and body, ergo get me out, that are something I enjoy. I love shooting and this will be a sport that I can see my improvement as a marksman. Thanks for your advice on this, I appreciate it more then you know.

 

[Aimright]

I currently have my Avenger 22 shooting H&N Barbuda Match 21.14gr projectiles. I know I'm going to have to try out some lighter stuff and see what I can achieve with that rifle. I am torn that I'll have back to back matches where I'll need to re-tune my rifle from Hunter class FT to bench steel. I doubt I'll be able to be competative with one grain projectile for both disciplines. Thanks for this advice though I'll look what my current firearm is capable of. What is the lightest pellet you think could work for Hunter? I'm seeing pellets in the 10 to 13.7gr neighborhood which would mean tuning between 810 fps (13.7gr) to 950 fps (10gr).

I would try the JSB 13.43s first and then the 14.3s. If those are accurate in your gun you are not going to be handicapped much, especially if you can use 13.43s, as many .177 FT shooters at my FT club use the same weight pellet. Unfortunately the 13.43s were terrible in my Mrod and were prone to spiraling. The 14.3s were good but lost accuracy after 45 yds. It loved the 15.89s but those only went out the muzzle around 740 fps to stay around 20 fpe, but a loopy trajectory was far better than shooting an inaccurate pellet!

 

[gfhickman]

I would try the JSB 13.43s first and then the 14.3s. If those are accurate in your gun you are not going to be handicapped much, especially if you can use 13.43s, as many .177 FT shooters at my FT club use the same weight pellet. Unfortunately the 13.43s were terrible in my Mrod and were prone to spiraling. The 14.3s were good but lost accuracy after 45 yds. It loved the 15.89s but those only went out the muzzle around 740 fps to stay around 20 fpe, but a loopy trajectory was far better than shooting an inaccurate pellet!

I already have 4 tins of the Barracuda 15's so they will be shot during pellet testing. I'll get a tin of various lower grain pellets and work on seeing which work with my Avenger. I'll just have to figure out how I want to go about the testing. I might create a new thread with a process I'll try out just to get feedback, first I'll do some searching here and else where.

 

[MikeAndrews]

You have gotten very good information from all who have already posted. If I could add to their knowledge the athlon Midas Tac scopes are most excellent. Good luck and welcome to the rabbit hole.

 

[gfhickman]

You have gotten very good information from all who have already posted. If I could add to their knowledge the athlon Midas Tac scopes are most excellent. Good luck and welcome to the rabbit hole.

This rabbit hole is just another of the many in going down. Being an engineer by profession (retired) its nothing new. Thanks for the advice, added to the research pile. If you enjoy what you're doing it is never work.

 

[Franklink]

I would try the JSB 13.43s first and then the 14.3s. If those are accurate in your gun you are not going to be handicapped much, especially if you can use 13.43s, as many .177 FT shooters at my FT club use the same weight pellet. Unfortunately the 13.43s were terrible in my Mrod and were prone to spiraling. The 14.3s were good but lost accuracy after 45 yds. It loved the 15.89s but those only went out the muzzle around 740 fps to stay around 20 fpe, but a loopy trajectory was far better than shooting an inaccurate pellet!

Having personally shot some matches with the JSB .22/13.43 and the .22/14.3, I agree 100% that they're more competitive than many give them credit for.

Know your trajectory, be able to accurately estimate the distances (within reason) and learn how your barrels chosen pellet behaves in the wind, and you can be competitive with .22.

Yes , the wind pushes the .22 a bit more than a .177, and yes it's ever so slightly more difficult to poke the .22 into a 3/8" kill zone, but you can have just as much fun shooting field target with a .22 as you would with a .177. The best part of this situation is that you already have a .22, so you're not even out the cost of a gun to try out field target, as long as it'll adjust to under 20fpe.

 

[gfhickman]

Having personally shot some matches with the JSB .22/13.43 and the .22/14.3, I agree 100% that they're more competitive than many give them credit for.

Know your trajectory, be able to accurately estimate the distances (within reason) and learn how your barrels chosen pellet behaves in the wind, and you can be competitive with .22.

Yes , the wind pushes the .22 a bit more than a .177, and yes it's ever so slightly more difficult to poke the .22 into a 3/8" kill zone, but you can have just as much fun shooting field target with a .22 as you would with a .177. The best part of this situation is that you already have a .22, so you're not even out the cost of a gun to try out field target, as long as it'll adjust to under 20fpe.

I've come around and agree. I do like the out nothing to try. Even though that isn't actually true as I'm going to have to do a bunch of pellet testing. Pellet testing on the other hand is time behind my gun which is its own reward. Lol.

 

[Sqwirl57]

I've come around and agree. I do like the out nothing to try. Even though that isn't actually true as I'm going to have to do a bunch of pellet testing. Pellet testing on the other hand is time behind my gun which is its own reward. Lol.

You don't even have to be out that money. If you message me your info and I'll get you an assortment of .22 pellets to test through your gun

 

[gfhickman]

You don't even have to be out that money. If you message me your info and I'll get you an assortment of .22 pellets to test through your gun

I really appreciate that. In 8 days I'll message you. Lol. Seriously though I really appreciate the offer. I went on pyramid last night and buying one of everything sub 15gr is over $150.

 

[Sqwirl57]

I really appreciate that. In 8 days I'll message you. Lol. Seriously though I really appreciate the offer. I went on pyramid last night and buying one of everything sub 15gr is over $150.

All good. I have most of them on my shelf so I'll just make you a doggy bag to test from. I sent you a message. You should be able to respond to it without waiting the 8 days

 

[John "spysir" Blount]

Totally agree with run what you have just get to a (every) match. Used a .22 w/15.9g JSB at the GOB club for a while, some of my best scores.
Someone mentioned "you Might" end up with a used rig from a fellow club member and trying before buying is great!
Likely only me but an older airgun (used) is often better than the newest. A couple of screaming ( looks like anyway) deals on AOA used rifles right now but they may sell fast! Like today IF I had the money. This model daystate was an excellent rifle and seals tend to last more than 10 years: https://www.airgunsofarizona.com/us...an-mkii-walnut-.22-w/crx-muzzle-brake-–-used/
Also (weight may be a concern?) the old Falcon rifles are outstanding: https://www.airgunsofarizona.com/usedguns.html/lot-020-falcon-fn-19-th-laminate-.177-–-used/
.22 in FT is roughly the same drop as all the "12fpe" folks deal with, run the pellet that groups best at range regardless of fps.
Go, shot, have fun you will learn more in one day than reading for a year.
Also I've shot with some of the folks from the clubs near you, excellent bunch of people, you will enjoy.

John

 

[scotton]

.22 in FT is roughly the same drop as all the "12fpe" folks deal with, run the pellet that groups best at range regardless of fps.

You aren't wrong, but WFTF doesn't have the ranging issues that hunter does. Need a strong bracket game if shooting heavy pellets with 16x.
I've been dabbling with Open class and it's great to be able to shoot 13.4s with a 50x scope. If I was going to shoot Hunter, I would probably stick with the 10.3s to get a little flatter trajectory. Gun shoots great with either, but the wind calls are easier with the 13.4s.

I totally agree, the OP needs to find the lightest pellets that will shoot reasonable groups at 50 yards. If the ranging is good and the dope is good, the amount of drop doesn't really matter too much.

 

[scotton]

Also, a trick that the WFTF shooters use it to raise the scope height. Flattens out the far dope (where ranging is tougher) and increases the dope on the near shots (where ranging is easier). If you watch videos of European FT shooters, they typically have a tall scope riser because their shoots tend to have more long shots and their kill zones for the short targets aren't as small as ours.

 

[gfhickman]

Also, a trick that the WFTF shooters use it to raise the scope height. Flattens out the far dope (where ranging is tougher) and increases the dope on the near shots (where ranging is easier). If you watch videos of European FT shooters, they typically have a tall scope riser because their shoots tend to have more long shots and their kill zones for the short targets aren't as small as ours.

Question: does raising the optic also adjust the zero distance, in order to zero at the top of the arc? I've always mounted my optics with the shortest rings that will work with my optic/gun combo.

 

[tpw037]

@gfhickman
I'm also looking to get into FT and have posted a question that got buzz stirring and for me to get worked up.

Nevermind that. I had an UTG 4-16 scope on my M3 for backyard plinking and it did the job. While looking into HFT and reading so much about the focus (parallax) wheel I really looked at my scope. I noticed that if I had a target at 15yds and adjusted based on focus, I was still seeing parallax issues. Only when it was ever so slightly out of focus was the parallax a non issue. I could see that being an issue if you really wanted to make every shot count.

Since then, I purchased an Athlon Helos and I can tell you from first hand experience, it's a night and day difference. I'm not plugging the brand but I was blown away with the quality, sharpness, accuracy, reticle, and focus. To each is own, but I would suggest investing in quality glass. You can always swap it out on your next PCP upgrade.

That's just my 2 cents. However, it's only worth a 1/2 cent. Keep us posted on your adventures.

 

[scotton]

Question: does raising the optic also adjust the zero distance, in order to zero at the top of the arc? I've always mounted my optics with the shortest rings that will work with my optic/gun combo.

Not unless you take it to extremes. The shot curve is still the same shape so the top is still zero. Basically you are moving the curve closer for the close targets and moving the curve out for the far targets. That's just for visualization purposes, changes to the scope don't have any effect on the shot curve, just our perception of it. Otherwise you could just remove the scope and the pellet would fly to infinity. Raising the scope by as much as an inch shouldn't change the zero distance.

 

[gfhickman]

Not unless you take it to extremes. The shot curve is still the same shape so the top is still zero. Basically you are moving the curve closer for the close targets and moving the curve out for the far targets. That's just for visualization purposes, changes to the scope don't have any effect on the shot curve, just our perception of it. Otherwise you could just remove the scope and the pellet would fly to infinity. Raising the scope by as much as an inch shouldn't change the zero distance.

Sorry for the confusion. Yes it's all about our perception of the curve. I was curious if that effects our perceived location of the top of the curve. I guess I could play with the concept with a ballistics calculator to see the effect of higher height over bore settings.

 

[thane]

Scope height becomes more valuable with slower pellets amplified by poor ranging glass.
UTG at 45-55 yds will be very similar, 50/55 indiscernible. You can knock out a half inch of POI ranging error with higher scopes.
You will pay for it with 9 moa (red) at 10yds vs. 19 moa (pink) at 10yds with higher scope.

Pick your poison. (title TX200 .177 in error)