Tuning HW70A Black Arrow tune

I'll get inside of an HW97, R1, R9, AA Pro Elite, TX200 SR/standard, Walther LGU, HW50, Diana Sidelever, even the sinister P1 (preload city!), but this little pistol was "above my paygrade". 😉 

A thorough mental exercise akin to playing chess in 3D, plus it channeled my inner watchmaker self: some serious manual dexterity required, especially with part no. CS558 (x2!). 

The game plan was to:

*square off the spring ends, followed by polish

*degrease and relube with the good stuff

*replace OEM HW 25mm parachute seal with an Aussie 25mm concave seal

*reverse position of the long rear guide, use as a long tophat/piston weight

*fabricate a sleeve for the piston from steel shim stock

*polish flat "bearing surface" of the long guide

*introduce zero additional preload 

My thoughts were:

The Aussie seal sits almost 1mm lower than the OEM parachute seal, and has less lost volume (absence of parachute groove). The extra weight of the long guide now inside the piston will allow for more mass and a bit longer dwell time at the end of the compression stroke. Based on these mods alone (completely reversible), I expected a gain of around 30 fps. As received, in factory stock condition after break in: RWS 7gn Basics: 367 fps avg, H&N Excite Plinking Wadcutters 7.48 gn: 425 fps. 

Reversing the guide position would essentially mimic the P1 set up, where the long guide is inside the piston. Only one way to find out if it will work.

Some pics of the pistol stripped down:

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Yes that's the head of a JSB 7.9 Express nestled in the transfer port. It's a whopper at just over 4mm. Hmmm....

Notice the bent spring- the bend was inside the piston; the spring end was closed at an angle and not square so that didn't help. After taking care of the spring ends (polish, heated and closed/quenched/tempered, then mirror polished) the now polished long guide was slipped into the bent end which straightened it out pretty good. The fit of the guide was very nice: not loosey goosey but a push interference fit. Sleeve in place inside piston, everything lubed and assembled. 

The 2 springs, CS558 (I'll never forget those) are extensions springs with hooks on both ends and articulate the trigger sear to the pistol frame. Connecting this spring to the 2 surfaces was the most tedious. It could be worse: FWB 65 or RWS 6G GISS 🤔🤓

Barrel pivot tension adjusted, relubed.

Galling on undercarriage frame from the double jointed cocking lever: addressed with Dow Corning M77. I wanted to use a piece of an ARH cocking lever insert for an HW50, but it is too narrow for that, so a better solution awaits for a future project. 

The results were impressive: zero dieseling/smoking from the get go and the buzz was now gone. Cocked smooth, shot smooth. The performance gains were pretty sweet as well: RWS 7gn Basics now doing 410 fps avg (43 fps higher than before) and H&N Excites 7.48gn now doing 460 fps avg (35 fps higher than before). Sweet🍷🔥🤓


After some plinking and scope adjustment (POI was about 1" higher than before) a 5 shot group standing from 13 yds using H&N Excite pellets. 2 handed grip, mild breezes:



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It's each little challenge that serves as a breakthrough moment. Working on this pistol was very intense and challenging but I'm glad I did it. I think if I were to sleeve the transfer port to 3-3.2mm I may be able to get close to 500 fps with the existing bore and stroke, but that's for another time. 

Thanks for letting me share,

JohnnyPiston








 
Thats great work buddy, I maybe able to help you with the 500 fps.

I tuned the other variant (a bog std. HW70 with the Black stock) about 10 years ago. You have already identified the biggest area of Inefficiency with the gun, namely its TP which i measured using a metric set of drill blanks @ 4.3mm. Running the numbers on the stroke volume, i came up with an ideal TP of 2.8mm. 

I sleeved the TP by first employing the use of a 5mm dia. hand reamer, going up in size! No...I had not gone nuts...Its been said but not this time. It was to achieve a nice surface and one of a std. size. I was then able to employ some 5mm stainless steel tube I had to be a nice shove fit into the new 5mm TP. Conveniently, the inner dia. of the tube was 3mm, which is was very close to the 2.8mm I was thinking of. It would not only increase the pressure peak, but also result in less lost volume. I got 35 fps increase with RWS Wadcutters. The Tube was cut to 8mm length and shoved into place with some Loctite bearing fit (red) 

Next up, i machined a Delrin guide and steel top hat. Steel Top hat because i had grown tired of Delrin Top hats cracking on me but got a 20 fps bonus from the additional piston weighting.

The pistol was already quite good at 440 fps with RWS Wadcutters but i had now climbed 50 fps to 490fps. It was the most i got but within a few fps of what you are aiming at.


 
Steveoo,

I considered sleeving the TP from the get go but thought it'd be interesting to see what it would do with the above changes. I have brass rod: 3.97mm OD x .35mm CS so that would put the port diameter at 3.27mm, perhaps still on the large side but nearly 1mm smaller than factory TP size and it would allow peak pressure to build up. If I do it right it should be a fully reversible mod as well.

I found the piston design very cool: fully rotating, with steel bearings that also serve to determine the maximum stroke AND trigger sear engagement. Tolerances were impressive as well for this little pistol: front and rear bearings were spot on at 24.98 mm. Needless to say, this was not an area that needed polishing😉.

Your Walther pistol tune was an inspiration, BTW. 




 
Thanks buddy, Your 3.25 inner dia should still give you a nice improvement. 

Yes the HW70 is very well made and a design which has stood the test of time now since the 70s. Limits and fits I found to be superior even to the HW45. I felt it was let down slightly by not being blued steel, but even its paint job is superbly done, not far off looking like bluing.

Can be tweaked to easily achieve 470 fps and quite pellet tolerant. Agreeing with you on the trigger group....some patience required there.

Its a good gun....pretty much matching the accuracy of the regular bunch of SSP guns but 50 to 60 fps more velocity for flatter trajectory and perhaps pests at close range once tuned. 

Edit...I had put easily tuned to 570fps...I meant 470fps.
 
I may revisit the idea of getting one of these Black Arrows. So many good things going on with it.

I had sidelined all the benefits (at the time of ownership 10 years ago) because it was sub 500 fps, but now in world awash with 400 fps SSP designs, i am re-thinking.

The good features i noted from when having the HW70 variant have not been altered for cost cutting purposes like so many guns. These being the quality of the break barrel, with screwed bolt and locking screw...just like HW rifles. So many pistols now just using roll pins, or dowels for this purpose. The 3 bearing points on the piston spread the wear better, and was solidly made, but at 25mm means the diameter is able to take an off the shelf Red seal which was not available to me 10 years ago. Most pistols, such as the Webley Tempest etc have pistons too small in diameter to take one of these seals. Its a major consideration. Trigger and rifling are excellent and this Black Arrow now with an excellent mounting rail. Stock finish seems improved if anything.

I am thinking about employing a Delrin guide rod, with a heavy Phosphor Bronze Top hat.


 
I'll get inside of an HW97, R1, R9, AA Pro Elite, TX200 SR/standard, Walther LGU, HW50, Diana Sidelever, even the sinister P1 (preload city!), but this little pistol was "above my paygrade". 😉

A thorough mental exercise akin to playing chess in 3D, plus it channeled my inner watchmaker self: some serious manual dexterity required, especially with part no. CS558 (x2!).

The game plan was to:

*square off the spring ends, followed by polish

*degrease and relube with the good stuff

*replace OEM HW 25mm parachute seal with an Aussie 25mm concave seal

*reverse position of the long rear guide, use as a long tophat/piston weight

*fabricate a sleeve for the piston from steel shim stock

*polish flat "bearing surface" of the long guide

*introduce zero additional preload

My thoughts were:

The Aussie seal sits almost 1mm lower than the OEM parachute seal, and has less lost volume (absence of parachute groove). The extra weight of the long guide now inside the piston will allow for more mass and a bit longer dwell time at the end of the compression stroke. Based on these mods alone (completely reversible), I expected a gain of around 30 fps. As received, in factory stock condition after break in: RWS 7gn Basics: 367 fps avg, H&N Excite Plinking Wadcutters 7.48 gn: 425 fps.

Reversing the guide position would essentially mimic the P1 set up, where the long guide is inside the piston. Only one way to find out if it will work.

Some pics of the pistol stripped down:

View attachment 130802View attachment 130807View attachment 130815View attachment 130825View attachment 130833View attachment 130842View attachment 130851View attachment 130861View attachment 130874View attachment 130885View attachment 130898View attachment 130904View attachment 130916View attachment 130937View attachment 130961View attachment 130969View attachment 130981View attachment 130995View attachment 131004

Yes that's the head of a JSB 7.9 Express nestled in the transfer port. It's a whopper at just over 4mm. Hmmm....

Notice the bent spring- the bend was inside the piston; the spring end was closed at an angle and not square so that didn't help. After taking care of the spring ends (polish, heated and closed/quenched/tempered, then mirror polished) the now polished long guide was slipped into the bent end which straightened it out pretty good. The fit of the guide was very nice: not loosey goosey but a push interference fit. Sleeve in place inside piston, everything lubed and assembled.

The 2 springs, CS558 (I'll never forget those) are extensions springs with hooks on both ends and articulate the trigger sear to the pistol frame. Connecting this spring to the 2 surfaces was the most tedious. It could be worse: FWB 65 or RWS 6G GISS 🤔🤓.

Barrel pivot tension adjusted, relubed.

Galling on undercarriage frame from the double jointed cocking lever: addressed with Dow Corning M77. I wanted to use a piece of an ARH cocking lever insert for an HW50, but it is too narrow for that, so a better solution awaits for a future project.

The results were impressive: zero dieseling/smoking from the get go and the buzz was now gone. Cocked smooth, shot smooth. The performance gains were pretty sweet as well: RWS 7gn Basics now doing 410 fps avg (43 fps higher than before) and H&N Excites 7.48gn now doing 460 fps avg (35 fps higher than before). Sweet🍷🔥🤓


After some plinking and scope adjustment (POI was about 1" higher than before) a 5 shot group standing from 13 yds using H&N Excite pellets. 2 handed grip, mild breezes:



View attachment 131010View attachment 131023



It's each little challenge that serves as a breakthrough moment. Working on this pistol was very intense and challenging but I'm glad I did it. I think if I were to sleeve the transfer port to 3-3.2mm I may be able to get close to 500 fps with the existing bore and stroke, but that's for another time.

Thanks for letting me share,

JohnnyPiston
Everybody asks about how to get that end cap off... but nobody talks about how to get it back together. I need to know that trick!
"broke down in New Mexico"