Lol.. ya, i could use a extra arm and hand sometimes 2 . Or if i could use my legs and feet like a monkey can
Also check the side for and left or right / windage bends
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Tuning HW90 barrel droop
- Thread starter JayJay
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Also check the side for and left or right / windage bends
I am a monkey, still tricky. Crow …Tail comes in handyLol.. ya, i could use a extra arm and hand sometimes 2 . Or if i could use my legs and feet like a monkey can
Also check the side for and left or right / windage bends
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When you got the barrel off and front site as well you can roll it on glass between the muzzle and block.. then you got a 360 check
None of this works well on shrouded stuff. Unless pulled apart ( check shroud ,check straw barrel,ect)
None of this works well on shrouded stuff. Unless pulled apart ( check shroud ,check straw barrel,ect)
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This is an easy method to check straightness of your barrel. I read where members bent their barrel straight, which should be no problem.
I sharpened skates for a living. The blades were made of several grades of steel. Occasionally I would get a bent blade which your can’t sharpen properly unless straightened. What I found was that once a blade bent it was repeated over and over where the steel was relaxed. I realize there’s I lot of pressure on a skate blade, but there’s a lot on a barrel when jacking it especially the 90.
If you bend a barrel, I think you weakening the barrel from what I experienced. Maybe the barrel is a lot heavier. I believe it changes the structure of the steel. I’m just thinking out loud. Please correct me if I’m wrong. Not educated in this field. Crow
I sharpened skates for a living. The blades were made of several grades of steel. Occasionally I would get a bent blade which your can’t sharpen properly unless straightened. What I found was that once a blade bent it was repeated over and over where the steel was relaxed. I realize there’s I lot of pressure on a skate blade, but there’s a lot on a barrel when jacking it especially the 90.
If you bend a barrel, I think you weakening the barrel from what I experienced. Maybe the barrel is a lot heavier. I believe it changes the structure of the steel. I’m just thinking out loud. Please correct me if I’m wrong. Not educated in this field. Crow
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Somthing got to give somewhere.. the less you got to go the better off your going to be. Steel is forgiving like in a welding bend tests. Visual or xray cracks and all or your out the door... Next.
Kinda like we say a patch is a patch..
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I don't think you'd hurt a barrel much on bending it. Most barrel makers use a big hand wheeled wheeled press to straighten barrels after they're made. I bet Weihrauch does the same at the factory. I'd hate to do it on my own though....
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I've bent almost all of my Weihrauchs at one time or another. Probably at least a dozen for others. I never had a barrel go soft and not hold its position. Weihrauch barrels are often bent left or right as well. Adjusting left and right is trickier to get right than up and down.
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Seems a comon thing if ones off a tad . Its not like your bending to or from a "U". Or going back and forth and it snaps it like you would a wire..lol.
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Hi, I know what you mean about balancing the straight edge. That's why I finally got that Wixey electronic level. It's got a magnet which just snaps on the barrel and cylinder.
I was looking at Hateful McNasty's post above. He used a pair of levels. Good idea! So I tried an old line level.
First level it on the cylinder, then move to the barrel block, and then the end of the barrel.
Holy Moly!
Two key observations.
- The bubble is the same on the barrel and barrel block. Therefore the barrel is straight.
- All the droop is between the cylinder and the barrel.
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The divisions are equal to 1/8" rise per foot. One division is therefore equal to ASIN( (1/8) * (1/12) ) = 0.6 degrees.
So this HW90 barrel droops about 0.6 degrees with respect to the middle of the cylinder. That's about the same as the UTG drooper mount, which gives you 10 inches rise per 30 yards.
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In my country, some Ivan was able to bend the barrel of an HW-30 by 80mm from the muzzle down... I was told this by a fellow gunsmith, he said that he doesn't know what that 'Ivan' was doing, but that he's done it. The gunsmith only got the Weihrauch in for repairs.
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May sound silly .. loosen up your hinge nut and bolt then open and close the breech to set the latch and check as you re tighten do a little and recheck .. also this may help on a new breech seal as its not as compressed as ot will woth age/ use .. ( i guess you could pull the seal and see how much correction that gives ).
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Interesting thread. Does using the barrel to cock these rifles play any part in the droop? or is this the way the guns are shipped from the manufacturer? or is it a combination of both? However it is, are there other brands going through the same issues or just Weihrauchs? Seems bizarre one of... if not THE most renowned air gun builders in the world would be making and shipping rifles with bent barrels.
Or....is it that most other brands being inferior are just not generally in the position to be scrutinized like these rifles? That is to say when it comes to accuracy Wiehrauch seems to be the gun used to measure all others. Just thinking out loud here.
Or....is it that most other brands being inferior are just not generally in the position to be scrutinized like these rifles? That is to say when it comes to accuracy Wiehrauch seems to be the gun used to measure all others. Just thinking out loud here.
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I don't think cocking causes barrel bending. Weihrauch barrels are stout. I straightened an old one using a small 1 ton arbor press. I had to put my full body weight on the lever to get it to bend even a little.
My two new HW90's came with about half a degree of droop. But my HW30 and 95 were droopless.
All four guns have perfectly straight barrels. The droop is caused by dimensions in the HW90 cylinder itself.
My theory is that HW90 droop is intentional. These guns are shipped with iron sights, which mount on the barrel itself. The benefit of droop is that it moves the cylinder down and out of the line of sight.
On the other hand, the HW30 and 95 are field models, and are shipped with scopes. They don't even have holes to mount iron sights. Therefore Weihrauch makes sure they have no droop.
This is just a theory.
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Wow, that's about 3 inches. Maybe he let go of the barrel before before latching it. The barrel snaps up and can bend. The HW30 barrel is lighter than the rest of their break barrels.
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Hi,
I tried that. I also tried forcefully cycling the barrel latch several times. But the mechanical tolerances are very tight. Like a bank vault door.
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From the factory. Barrel cocking guns can maintain astonishing accuracy and consistency over thousands of rounds. If cocking the gun using the barrel as a lever had any affect on this the guns would be incapable of even reasonable accuracy.
Beeman used to have a service available to gun buyers called "select barrel angle". For a small fee they would, supposedly, go through inventory and hand pick a rifle with closer to level, or no droop, for those people who planned to use receiver sights and scopes. They also had a service called "barrel angle correction". This would adjust a gun's droop for people who had rifles in the field and wanted to add receiver sights and scopes but run out of up elevation. Read "bend the barrel" here. These were the days before a drooper mount.
I don't know if droop was engineered into the rifles or if droop was simply a manufacturing anomaly that had a tolerance attached to it. As said above, the capability to make perfectly aligned parts is not a question. Why they put it in or left it in is a mystery but if it's on purpose it may be to compensate for worn parts as the gun aged. Even that sounds like a stretch to me.
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Very interesting info. Clearly, Beeman was not able to order non-droop guns from Weihrauch if they had to hand pick them from their own inventory. It's also interesting that Beeman regarded barrel bending as a legitimate remedy. I wonder just how they did that.
As you say, we still don't know if Weihrauch has a different droop tolerance for scoped rifles. And I agree that droop as a form of wear compensation is a stretch.
I'm still unhappy about the HW90 droop, so my next project will probably be to skim a little off the barrel block on my carbine barrel. I had hoped to avoid that. We'll see.
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Another way to look at this is...why is it that the barrels generally droop if not perfectly straight, that is to say droop seems to be primarily the only way they are untrue as far as straightness is concerned, at least I haven't seen any discussion about barrels being out of alignment any other way than 'down' other than the occasional 'up' pointing barrels, which seems attributed to the barrel slipping from the hand before fully cocked and snapping back to closed via the spring. Once in a blue moon it's been mentioned a barrel being bent other than down..or up. So much so there are scope mounts manufactured to compensate for barrel droop.
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I believe if your barrel is true the droop is at the breech. Them old rws / diana used the ball instead of the chisel . ( A few others as well ). Today even if you look at the diana 34 ems breech block it looks almost like a hw with the chisel ..
Also if the angles of the breech block is off or of the chisel point angle is in correct.. i seen some guns that looked hunchbacked..lol the droop showed bad at the breech.
Thing about the breech is you really cant take off the block to make it come down cause you loose clearance ( tightness) at the detant chisel..
Now you think is the chisel angle cuts wrong ? Will a new one cut " better ' lock up straight ? Cant say this go round in air guns my latest been stright even the poor ol'gamo..
Also if the angles of the breech block is off or of the chisel point angle is in correct.. i seen some guns that looked hunchbacked..lol the droop showed bad at the breech.
Thing about the breech is you really cant take off the block to make it come down cause you loose clearance ( tightness) at the detant chisel..
Now you think is the chisel angle cuts wrong ? Will a new one cut " better ' lock up straight ? Cant say this go round in air guns my latest been stright even the poor ol'gamo..
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