HW95/R9 Piston seal

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Sqwirlfugger57 said:
That gun was bought brand new from Krale so not sure how else it would have gotten in there unless Krale opened it up
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It could of been Krale or the distributor they deal with. Believe it or not Krale doesn't deal direct with Weihrauch. I've opened up lots of Weihrauchs and not once did they ever have white grease in them. Might have been a consumer that returned the rifle after playing with it.
 
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Mycapt65 said:
It could of been Krale or the distributor they deal with. Believe it or not Krale doesn't deal direct with Weihrauch. I've opened up lots of Weihrauchs and not once did they ever have white grease in them. Might have been a consumer that returned the rifle after playing with it.
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Yeah I'm not sure. I went back to check receipts and that gun shipped April 6, 2021 and the picture is stamped May 15th which sounds about right. I remember waiting awhile before finally opening it up. I wish I still had the chrono readings because this thing was throwing a spread of 100+ fps out of the box and was still pushing in the 60s when it finally got torn down. Granted I was shooting CPHPs at the time which have always had a larger spread than most.

All in all, it really wasn't a huge deal. Cleaned it up and it's going strong to this day. That gun changed my whole view on air rifles.
 
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Sqwirlfugger57 said:
Yeah I'm not sure. I went back to check receipts and that gun shipped April 6, 2021 and the picture is stamped May 15th which sounds about right. I remember waiting awhile before finally opening it up. I wish I still had the chrono readings because this thing was throwing a spread of 100+ fps out of the box and was still pushing in the 60s when it finally got torn down. Granted I was shooting CPHPs at the time which have always had a larger spread than most.

All in all, it really wasn't a huge deal. Cleaned it up and it's going strong to this day. That gun changed my whole view on air rifles.
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I'm sure it's a great rifle now. Not many Weihrauchs are un redeemable. Most take some work to get right
 
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Been away from this thread I started for a bit. Wow those are some pretty messed up seals in some photos.

I cleaned out the compression tube thoroughly. Was no damage to the Vortek seal after two massive detonations. No further detonation or noticable dieseling. Just a nice crisp thump when firing. The MV spread and SD tightened up significantly for most pellets I tested. For a nominal 12 fpe tune kit I'm getting 12-13 fpe with the lighter pellets and 11-12 with the heavier ones.

Now what I'm noticing is a metal on metal grinding when I cock it. It appears to be the cocking shoe rubbing on the tune kit spring guide. There is a streak of rubbing noticeable in the metal. I put some light tar grease on the spring guide but that didn't help much. It's not a huge deal but continuous use like that may cause problems down the road. Any ideas on this? Regards
 
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I've had the cocking shoe on the 95, and 80 series guns carve up several PG4 steel outer guides. Same goes for the cocking arm foot on the Hw30s and 50s. It can also happen if there is a burr on the inside of piston at the end of the cocking slot.

Sometimes radiusing and polishing the edges of the cocking shoe or foot works. Sometimes it don't. Things move around in there dynamically and while it may initially clear it may have interference later. I've had guns damaged by the slivers of steel riding up and down the compression tube.

This interference has happened on almost all my Weihrauchs with cocking shoes and most with a cocking arm foot.

I've discussed this problem with Tom at Vortek several times. Occasionally he'll tell me he's changed the dimensions and I'll try another kit. I did this last month with my 22 Hw95 Field Pro. Nope, I still had problems with it no matter how much polishing and radiusing I did. He eventually made me a traditional guide to replace the PG4 style.

I like Tom, his PG2 kits were great, his seals IMO are the best but the PG4 kits have damaged my guns and exponentially increases my labor when doing a tune.

I think the safest way to go is a Maccari kit and a Vortek seal.

Don't keep using your rifle if the cocking shoe is cutting into the guide. It can and will permanently damage the compression tube.
 
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I suffered the same issue with my HW95 Vortek kit. I ended up REMOVING the steel outer spring guide and reinstalled the rest of the components. I did use the original Weihrauch bottom spring washer. I also let Tom at Vortek know. The kit works very nice without the steel outer guide. It would have been fantastic if Tom would offer a replacement plastic guide for those that encounter issues. I sure would have felt better about that purchase.
 
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I did as Pea-shooter O.G and removed the Vortek outer metal spring guide. I saw his post about that issue a while back and we discussed it. I'm glad I did. My HW95 shoots just as nice without it and the cocking cycle is even better. My HW95 was new in 2021 and the cocking shoe has a nice radius and was not giving me trouble. I had it apart and saw a lot of wear on the metal outer spring guide. That's why I removed it. It seems mine was wearing everywhere except the cocking shoe slot.

IMG_1512.JPG
 
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TXRMike said:
I did as Pea-shooter O.G and removed the Vortek outer metal spring guide. I saw his post about that issue a while back and we discussed it. I'm glad I did. My HW95 shoots just as nice without it and the cocking cycle is even better. My HW95 was new in 2021 and the cocking shoe has a nice radius and was not giving me trouble. I had it apart and saw a lot of wear on the metal outer spring guide. That's why I removed it. It seems mine was wearing everywhere except the cocking shoe slot.

View attachment 330454
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That's worn like that because it rotated during use
 
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TXRMike said:
I did as Pea-shooter O.G and removed the Vortek outer metal spring guide. I saw his post about that issue a while back and we discussed it. I'm glad I did. My HW95 shoots just as nice without it and the cocking cycle is even better. My HW95 was new in 2021 and the cocking shoe has a nice radius and was not giving me trouble. I had it apart and saw a lot of wear on the metal outer spring guide. That's why I removed it. It seems mine was wearing everywhere except the cocking shoe slot.

View attachment 330454
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Mine doesn't look anywhere near as scored as that at this point. I'm thinking about grinding a fraction of a millimeter or so from the bottom of the cocking shoe to see if that provides clearance. There is not a lot of resistance when cocking the gun, removing a small amount of metal from the bottom of the shoe may make it clear the guide tube. Any thoughts on that? Anyone tried that approach?
 
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Pea-shooter O.G. said:
I suffered the same issue with my HW95 Vortek kit. I ended up REMOVING the steel outer spring guide and reinstalled the rest of the components. I did use the original Weihrauch bottom spring washer. I also let Tom at Vortek know. The kit works very nice without the steel outer guide. It would have been fantastic if Tom would offer a replacement plastic guide for those that encounter issues. I sure would have felt better about that purchase.
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Without the spring guide is it still a smooth "thump" shot cycle?
 
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Both of my PG4 show some break in marks all the way around, but have had it apart enough times that I know there is no issue.
After a few hundred shots, there is little to no contact noise or feel.

This is with the 12fpe kit and the standard kit. I tend to switch power levels fairly often.

As we approach schikmunk season, it will go back to near full power and the .177 barrel.

I have added several other airguns to my lineup that will alleviate some of my switcharoo tendencies.
 
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When I had the dieseling problem that damaged the piston seal I opted for an ARH kit with a Vortek seal per recommendations from forum members. My HW95 .22 has what I believe is the new style cocking shoe and after a through cleaning/polishing I lubed with Krytox GPL-205. The rifle cocking cycle now is absolutely soundless until the piston latches in the trigger & the shot cycle is a sharp thump. 10 shots yesterday had a 5 FPS spread at 17 FPE using FTT 14.66 gr pellets. I also re-used the Weihrauch factory thin washer that sits in front of the spring top hat & the foil shield. The rifle is much more accurate than I am able to shoot but really enjoy plinking and the occasional tree rat.
 
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I've had mixed results with modifications to facilitate the PG4 steel guide. When I have time I'll elaborate more. I covered most of the important points in my earlier post.
Bottom line. If you are in the market for a kit I recommend the Maccari kit and Vortek. If you have a PG4 steel kit you're trying to work I'll be back later with some suggestions.
Gtg
 
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I've ground down polished the radius if my R1 shoe and it work. I have tried several times with my 20 caliber R9 and 22 Hw95 Field Pro. Neither worked for me. The R9 is a special edition and I was lucky enough to catch it in time. The R1 has a bigger tube and different shoe. Maybe that's the difference.
20230128_102202.jpg

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I've had better luck with the Hw30 and 50s. It has foot on the stamped cocking arm. If you grind, radius and polish those enough you can get them to work.
20221109_093231.jpg

Also pay attention to the the inside edge of the piston cocking slot. That can get smeared and carve up the guide as well.

HTH
This is what my latest Vortek kit looked like after Tom cut me a new guide.

20230128_112630.jpg
 
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Mycapt65 said:
I've ground down polished the radius if my R1 shoe and it work. I have tried several times with my 20 caliber R9 and 22 Hw95 Field Pro. Neither worked for me. The R9 is a special edition and I was lucky enough to catch it in time. The R1 has a bigger tube and different shoe. Maybe that's the difference.
View attachment 330629
View attachment 330630
I've had better luck with the Hw30 and 50s. It has foot on the stamped cocking arm. If you grind, radius and polish those enough you can get them to work.
View attachment 330639
Also pay attention to the the inside edge of the piston cocking slot. That can get smeared and carve up the guide as well.

HTH
This is what my latest Vortek kit looked like after Tom cut me a new guide.

View attachment 330644
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OK, I see what you did with the radius. I'll give it a try. Worse case I'll remove the spring guide.
 
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I just got done with a r9 . Boring day i grabbed another arh seal and fitted it in .

Man i had to do some grinding on it to size it down ..lol. glad it had some meat to take off to fit the tube and slide properly ( imo). Took it out and shot it about 20 times or so then re checked the screws... By ear it sounded good and shot straight..lol. Just need pellets to crony it other than the ones im using now.. well see in time if i keep it in or throw the hw stock seal back in it ..
 
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OK, back again with further bumbling to report but hopefully found the source of contact of the rubbing while cocking.

Taking the breech out I really messed it up
IMG_0097.JPG

Why? Like a jerk I forgot to back out the recoil stop pin from the scope mount, scratched the hell out of the breech.
IMG_0098.JPG

As soon as I realized what I did and backed the screw out it popped right out. Fortunately it was a 12 fpe kit and the spring is 2 inches shorter than the stock spring so it didn't launch across the room..

In any case I think it's not too jacked up to reuse. Just need to file down the cocking shoe a bit. I think I have a pretty good idea where it's rubbing.
IMG_0099.JPG
 
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