I can guess. I would be interested which states or municipalities have gone or are going down this road to tyranny.
Lead Free
- Thread starter Keyman62421
- Start date
There are some aspects of shooting lead free that could be desirable. For instance, pesting where a rapid reduction in fps may help prevent collateral damage.
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So, Steve...... I actually have about three rifles in my collection that prefer the lead free pellets and shoot the tightest groups with them. So to me, it isn't all about lead free pellets being mandated. Don't get me wrong, I would not want to have to shoot all lead free, just offering this for thought.
Have a great day!
Have a great day!
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Maybe the same ones that thinks killing all the cattle to stop them from farting to save the planet from climate change.
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I think the statement on california is incorrect. The introduction of lead free powder burner items is directly related to that state.
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California is lead free for firearms hunting. Airguns are not classified as firearms so lead is still legal for hunting.
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Polycase has developed a new type of bullet that has many advantages, as least for handgun applications. Bullets weigh approximately 70% as much as lead bullets with similar profiles. Lighter weight means higher velocities and less recoil. In addition, PolyCase bullets are lead-free, and low ricochet — two qualities important for indoor and close-range training. The injection-molding process also reduces weight variations (compared to cast lead bullets), and ensures excellent concentricity. Molding also allows unique shapes that are impossible to produce with conventional bullet-making methods (see photo).
maybe this could work ? I use the .380 pictured on the right . but a possible slug design ?
maybe this could work ? I use the .380 pictured on the right . but a possible slug design ?
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"Boy, to me that sounds like Cali govt logic. Shouldn’t ALL hunting be lead free in Cali ?"
I don't think that they've figured it out yet.....but they will.
I don't think that they've figured it out yet.....but they will.
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I'm not anti lead and use FX/JSB Diabolo. Birds eat everything and will eat a lead bullet/pellet, it will not pass through like a mammal. It will sit in their gizzard until it is small enough to pass. Meaning it will be fully digested into their blood. I can post a pic of a black, lead poisoned gizzard with what was left of the pellets. It is not out of tyranny but knowledge that these laws are passed.
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It’s a little bit of both, tyranny and knowledge. Sure birds eat everything but where in the wild do you find pellets lying around in piles? The probability of a bird consuming a bullet or pellet in the woods are as good as me winning the lottery.
If we are taking about lead birdshot, then it’s a different story, BUT pellets and bullets are not as plentiful in nature. After all, who is hunting with a machine gun to produce so much lead that it’s more plentiful than good’old rocks?
PS. California would probably do more good going after domestic cats, wind turbines and solar farms… there is a trade off with everything.
-Marty
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If/when demand goes up for lead-free pellets (read: when there's more money to be made from them), the manufacturers will invest more resources into making lead-free pellets that perform better. Right now they are still a bit of an after-thought so there's not a ton of innovation in that space, but competition and profit will change that if/when needed.
I saw this same scenario play out with lead-free electronics solder over the past 20 years or so. Back then, lead-free solder was practically unusable for hand soldering (though it was ok for machine soldering where the application variables are very tightly controlled). Even the most skilled people would struggle to use it when soldering by hand, and poor joints were common...and a huge problem. Since then, as various mandates took place, the demand went way up (because it legally had to) and solder manufacturers invested a lot in perfecting complex lead-free alloys and fluxes that could be easily soldered by hand. I actually don't even mind using it anymore. It took a long time, but lead-free solder went from being basically junk, to being about 95% as good as regular leaded solder. Out of necessity. And they'll probably close that remaining 5% gap even more over the next decade.
Just a comparison and example from someone who once hated lead-free solder, and currently hates lead-free pellets
I saw this same scenario play out with lead-free electronics solder over the past 20 years or so. Back then, lead-free solder was practically unusable for hand soldering (though it was ok for machine soldering where the application variables are very tightly controlled). Even the most skilled people would struggle to use it when soldering by hand, and poor joints were common...and a huge problem. Since then, as various mandates took place, the demand went way up (because it legally had to) and solder manufacturers invested a lot in perfecting complex lead-free alloys and fluxes that could be easily soldered by hand. I actually don't even mind using it anymore. It took a long time, but lead-free solder went from being basically junk, to being about 95% as good as regular leaded solder. Out of necessity. And they'll probably close that remaining 5% gap even more over the next decade.
Just a comparison and example from someone who once hated lead-free solder, and currently hates lead-free pellets
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Good points on demand and supply. That said, the H&N and Predator lead free pellets are already very good and often more accurate than standard pellets, but only if wind and power are not an issue. I often use the H&N Baracuda Greens with awesome results for target work!If/when demand goes up for lead-free pellets (read: when there's more money to be made from them), the manufacturers will invest more resources into making lead-free pellets that perform better. Right now they are still a bit of an after-thought so there's not a ton of innovation in that space, but competition and profit will change that if/when needed.
I saw this same scenario play out with lead-free electronics solder over the past 20 years or so. Back then, lead-free solder was practically unusable for hand soldering (though it was ok for machine soldering where the application variables are very tightly controlled). Even the most skilled people would struggle to use it when soldering by hand, and poor joints were common...and a huge problem. Since then, as various mandates took place, the demand went way up (because it legally had to) and solder manufacturers invested a lot in perfecting complex lead-free alloys and fluxes that could be easily soldered by hand. I actually don't even mind using it anymore. It took a long time, but lead-free solder went from being basically junk, to being about 95% as good as regular leaded solder. Out of necessity. And they'll probably close that remaining 5% gap even more over the next decade.
Just a comparison and example from someone who once hated lead-free solder, and currently hates lead-free pellets
Having said all that, from a cost and mass perspective lead is superior.
-Marty
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This thread has comments on a bird-shot study. Read what constitutes low and high density of shot. Low was 150 shot per square meter (1/2 a load of #7 1/2). High was 2700 shot per square meter (9 full loads of #7 1/2). The 30 study birds were trapped in a cage of unknown size. Only one bird in the study ingested a bird-shot.
Is shooting lead pellets safe for the enviornment?
I live on a flood plane and as such the woods in my back yard has a ton of wild life. Is it dangerous to the environment if I'm constantly shooting lead pellets into the ground where all the animals are foraging? Over the years I have unloaded a bunch of tins. Whats the scoop?
www.airgunnation.com Typically, birds do not eat smooth rocks to aid in grinding the seeds they eat. They prefer stones that are rough. They do not pass the stones through their digestive tracts once they are ground smooth..they are regurgitated from the crop.
FWIW, after making the April 13th post mentioned above, I performed an experiment of my own. I placed a .22 pellet on a cleared piece of dirt near my bird/squirrel feeder. I have sprinkled seed on and around the pellet for 75 days. Probably 2 to 3 thousand Sparrows, CA Towhees, Mourning Doves, Collared Doves, and Crows have all eaten the seed..yet the pellet remains..sitting lonely and now oxidized.
Here are pics of the seed mix. Note the pellet for a size comparison..
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Now THAT is a study. One of the complaints about lead shot was it'd pollute the water and ground, but your study shows that it forms a nice layer of oxidation keeping the lead encapsulated. Which is what they knew way back when before they went to steel shot.This thread has comments on a bird-shot study. Read what constitutes low and high density of shot. Low was 150 shot per square meter (1/2 a load of #7 1/2). High was 2700 shot per square meter (9 full loads of #7 1/2). The 30 study birds were trapped in a cage of unknown size. Only one bird in the study ingested a bird-shot.
Is shooting lead pellets safe for the enviornment?
I live on a flood plane and as such the woods in my back yard has a ton of wild life. Is it dangerous to the environment if I'm constantly shooting lead pellets into the ground where all the animals are foraging? Over the years I have unloaded a bunch of tins. Whats the scoop?
Typically, birds do not eat smooth rocks to aid in grinding the seeds they eat. They prefer stones that are rough. They do not pass the stones through their digestive tracts once they are ground smooth..they are regurgitated from the crop.
FWIW, after making the April 13th post mentioned above, I performed an experiment of my own. I placed a .22 pellet on a cleared piece of dirt near my bird/squirrel feeder. I have sprinkled seed on and around the pellet for 75 days. Probably 2 to 3 thousand Sparrows, CA Towhees, Mourning Doves, Collared Doves, and Crows have all eaten the seed..yet the pellet remains..sitting lonely and now oxidized.
Here are pics of the seed mix. Note the pellet for a size comparison..
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THANK YOU!
People need to understand that most “studies” done in recent times are funded by people with an agenda directly related to the subject matter. They also have a predetermined conclusion they want the study to arrive at. People who conduct the study are wise to arrive at that conclusion because they make their livings doing studies.
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Well, generally nobody except for some Texans with a heck of a lot of money to use a 50 cal machine gun or a rotary machine gun to kill wild hogs. The videos are on YouTube. A smidge excessive but hey if you can why not. They sure did a number on those hogs and there WERE a lot of them.
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