Has anyone noticed that LOP is frequently left out of rifle specifications? What target shooter would try to compete with bad LOP in a rifle? As a short lad I learned to pull a gun forward before hitting the shoulder with the buttstock. That slows you down and tends to make you less precise. Sometimes you miss completely on game. So why would a manufacturer leave out a major factor in whether I could be happy with their gun? Just one of my perennial whinings. Be Well, Bandito.
LOP LISTINGS
- Thread starter Bandito
- Start date
It is quite likely a case where Air Gunners as a whole are not schooled or even aware of what the Powder Burner community has practiced for centuries .. That of LOP ( length of pull being a shoulder to trigger / grip dimension ) Drop ( Center line of Receiver to center of shoulder ) Offset ( Side to side alignment of receiver to butt stock at shoulder )
While "Field Guns" generally follow averages as a kinda fit all, the target or serious shooters very much payed attention to these adjustable variables having the after market stock manufacturers thriving.
Yes there have been many an AG that has some adjustablity, but why it can be changed or should be changed to fit the shooter has been largely lost because of the noise of screw this on upgrades & retrofits that look cool etc ...
IMO ....
While "Field Guns" generally follow averages as a kinda fit all, the target or serious shooters very much payed attention to these adjustable variables having the after market stock manufacturers thriving.
Yes there have been many an AG that has some adjustablity, but why it can be changed or should be changed to fit the shooter has been largely lost because of the noise of screw this on upgrades & retrofits that look cool etc ...
IMO ....
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So as a person of short stature I change most guns. Do lots of folks here change something other than clean the barrel and adjust trigger on receiving an airgun? Be Well, Bandito.
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I always lengthen the length of pull on my airguns. I like it to be about 14.75 inches and none have been close. I'd love to have a Daystate Hunstman with a left hand walnut stock but I am sure the LOP would not fit and fixing that is likely to detratct from the pretty stock. So if I buy one it will be the safari model so at least the height of the comb can be adjusted and I think an added spacer to get LOP right will not look as bad. The other "fit" issue I have is the distance from the back of the grip for the trigger hand to the trigger. I want the last joint of my trigger finger to be on the trigger, not the middle of the finger. My hands are too big for all the commercial airguns I've tried. I make custom stocks to fix these issues on some of my airguns.
I shot shotguns before rifles. With no sights getting a gun that fits is even more important with a shotgun. They also kick a lot more than an airgun which is less comfortable when the gun doesn't fit.
I shot shotguns before rifles. With no sights getting a gun that fits is even more important with a shotgun. They also kick a lot more than an airgun which is less comfortable when the gun doesn't fit.
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LOP is not a totally consistent spec that can be freely compared. The distance from trigger to butt is a measurement, but the configuration of the pistol grip and comb can result in different fits between guns with the same LOP. Example: two SxS shotguns may have identical LOP specs. One is a double trigger measured from the from trigger, the other is a single trigger that may be an inch or more rear of the other gun's front trigger. Two identical measurements, but they will feel very different, and they will not both fit the same shooter.
In rifle shooting, the different positions require different stock fit, so an adjustable stock is almost a requirement. As with almost anything involved in shooting, it requires experimentation.
In rifle shooting, the different positions require different stock fit, so an adjustable stock is almost a requirement. As with almost anything involved in shooting, it requires experimentation.
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I started a thread a while back about pros and cons of different stock materials; synthetic, metal, wood etc… it was interesting to read responses especially one lad who thought ergonomics was a waste of money
https://www.airgunnation.com/thread...tock-v-synthetic-stock-v-metal-stock.1311105/Upvote 0
This is true. I have noticed that with my powder burning long guns, LOP for me is determined for the type of rifle, meaning semi-auto or bolt or lever. Seems like most of my air rifles have a longer LOP than I prefer.
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Hmm, while a slightly interesting notion...
When I was born, my wrist was (still is) flexible. My elbow was (still is) flexible. My shoulder was (still is) flexible. Even, as required, my neck is flexible.
Nature gave me the possibility to (mostly)...adapt...to my surroundings.
And...no, I've never measured the length of pull (lop) of any of my rifles (fire arm or pellet). As I said, because I have the ability to adapt, I really don't care what that measurement is.
And yes, there are some rifles, like the rear cocking design, that are not desirable to me, I do...even have a couple of Daystate Pulsars, and a Renegade. I also have a Taipan shorty.
Like the old, Marine saying, "Adapt and Overcome".
Mike
When I was born, my wrist was (still is) flexible. My elbow was (still is) flexible. My shoulder was (still is) flexible. Even, as required, my neck is flexible.
Nature gave me the possibility to (mostly)...adapt...to my surroundings.
And...no, I've never measured the length of pull (lop) of any of my rifles (fire arm or pellet). As I said, because I have the ability to adapt, I really don't care what that measurement is.
And yes, there are some rifles, like the rear cocking design, that are not desirable to me, I do...even have a couple of Daystate Pulsars, and a Renegade. I also have a Taipan shorty.
Like the old, Marine saying, "Adapt and Overcome".
Mike
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Like Mike, I tend to adapt to the rifle, rather than work to make it adapt to me.
I have too many to make them all fit, I guess...
Still, some feel a lot better than others. For me, it seems that the balance is more important. I guess that's the main reason I hate the new side focus monster scopes... especially for FT...
Bob
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Adapting to the gun works, at least sort of. I tried that on my 30-06 when I first shot it and bruised my shoulder. I added an inch to the LOP which still leaves it too short for my preference but I got it to the point it doesn't give me bruises. Airguns have nearly no recoil so that is not an issue. But I find I shoot better, lower 30 yard challenge scores and/or smaller groups, when my guns are comfortable for me to shoot. To me it's a bit like finding the best pellet for a gun. I want to get the best it can do which requires making it fit me. But my desired dimensions are a bit off the beaten path I suspect and those of you who's body is more "normal" can probably work with a "as received" gun better than I can. I kind of envy that since it allows you to avoid the efforts I spend getting a gun to work well for me. But I have to work with what God gave me.....
PCPs do not typically have the stock supporting the barrel directly as is common on bolt action powder burners. I find I can swap stocks including going from wood to plastic without an effect on my POI. That is handy and avoids having to decide between free floating or slight upward pressure. I think it also makes the choice of stock material pretty much a question of how you want it to look. I also have the tools and skill to make the custom stock I want out of wood but I cannot shape plastic or metal nearly as easily or well. A wood stock for me helps a lot on making it fit me and I also think it can look nicer. By making the wood stock larger, however, my latest stocks have added a little weight to my P35s. I could drill holes on the inside where it would not show to "fix" that but I'm inclined to just put up with a few more ounces weight to get the fit and appearance advantages of my custom wood stocks. Inherently the wood is less dense so the stock can be lighter made of wood but most wood stocks are not hollow and if you also make them bigger they can end up heavier.
PCPs do not typically have the stock supporting the barrel directly as is common on bolt action powder burners. I find I can swap stocks including going from wood to plastic without an effect on my POI. That is handy and avoids having to decide between free floating or slight upward pressure. I think it also makes the choice of stock material pretty much a question of how you want it to look. I also have the tools and skill to make the custom stock I want out of wood but I cannot shape plastic or metal nearly as easily or well. A wood stock for me helps a lot on making it fit me and I also think it can look nicer. By making the wood stock larger, however, my latest stocks have added a little weight to my P35s. I could drill holes on the inside where it would not show to "fix" that but I'm inclined to just put up with a few more ounces weight to get the fit and appearance advantages of my custom wood stocks. Inherently the wood is less dense so the stock can be lighter made of wood but most wood stocks are not hollow and if you also make them bigger they can end up heavier.
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14.25" just might be my own personal, perfect length of pull for me!
But if I were to pick up a completely different rifle, and adjust its LOP to exactly 14.25", I would probably believe its either too short, or too long, and decide to adjust it one way or another.
It seems like 2 different rifles, will probably have different ideal LOP's, for me.
Adjustability is a great thing.
But if I were to pick up a completely different rifle, and adjust its LOP to exactly 14.25", I would probably believe its either too short, or too long, and decide to adjust it one way or another.
It seems like 2 different rifles, will probably have different ideal LOP's, for me.
Adjustability is a great thing.
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