FX New member- please help with my new fx dreamline lite 30 cal- i have ton of questions but no answers..

[RabbitofCaerbannog]

I wouldnt be shimming springs, i took 10 shots and removed a high power spring in my impact and just used the 26.5g hammer. A normal spring with enough hammer mass ought to do it and the pressure can be used to control dwell. There's something being overlooked I think too. I'm wondering if a previous poster's comment about a flow restricted valve seat is a direction worth exploring?

That was me. He made another thread about this. It's just him and I. I've been trying to guide him for week now. Probably close to 80 back and forth posts now. Kirkland and bagnall carry both parts. But I'm not sure that's it. I really suspect hes just over powering the valve at the given pressure. I did not tell him to shim the spring. He's not really listening to the advice. Other than what parts to get to fuel his power quest. I've tried. Believe me to get him to just learn the basics first. He's focused on "big number much power"

 

[6gun]

That was me. He made another thread about this. It's just him and I. I've been trying to guide him for week now. Probably close to 80 back and forth posts now. Kirkland and bagnall carry both parts. But I'm not sure that's it. I really suspect hes just over powering the valve at the given pressure. I did not tell him to shim the spring. He's not really listening to the advice. Other than what parts to get to fuel his power quest. I've tried. Believe me to get him to just learn the basics first. He's focused on "big number much power"

Staying at 130 on a 700mm is a little funny to me too for the power bug, ive been there. My gun has seen 175 bar, my buddies saw 190 and blew orings on his beer fueled quest. He had a bunch of tungsten loaded hammers of various weights to find the limits of a 500mm. It's a phase. Next will be balanced tuning I bet.

 

[RabbitofCaerbannog]

I really want him to learn that there are many ways to reach

Staying at 130 on a 700mm is a little funny to me too for the power bug, ive been there. My gun has seen 175 bar, my buddies saw 190 and blew orings on his beer fueled quest. He had a bunch of tungsten loaded hammers of various weights to find the limits of a 500mm. It's a phase. Next will be balanced tuning I bet.

He's at 130 because he had already gone over the manufacturer recommended pressure for that rig hunting power. He JUST GOT This gun. It was 5.5fpe limited to German govt requirements.this is his first FX. Maybe first PCP. He's brand new and I'm trying to teach him how to work up to find the proper settings for his gun. Before he asked for help just screwed the micro in until it bogged down the power wheel at max and put the reg to 160-170. And he was at 717fps losing his mind. So I told him to drop to 130 and to find the sweet spot balance for the valve and hammer spring. Then to work up. But he keeps maxing the hammer out and telling me at no point is his velocity dropping or losing consistency. Meaning he's way past plateauing and he's frustrated. Tomorrow he's going to try and follow advise and back the hammer spring out. He will see whats up. I posted the link to the other thread. You'll see what the idea is. I told him once he identifies that sweet spot. At that point to work up 5-10bar on the reg. And find the sweet spot again. And to do this process up until he reaches whatever velocity he wants. He even said "it's not working I dropped the pressure to 130bar and the velocity is only 770-780"... He was at 160+ only getting 715± He didn't realize that it did work. That you can't just set your hammer spring to max, power wheel to max and pick a pressure and expect high speed. I suspect he's lowered the pressure and only backed the HS screw out a couple turns at most , and he keeps getting to max thinking somehow it's going to work. The second he identified the plateau, raises pressure, the velocity drops and he works up slowly and gets an even higher velocity he's going to get an idea of the balancing act and how the whole system works

 

[6gun]

I really want him to learn that there are many ways to reach


He's at 130 because he had already gone over the manufacturer recommended pressure for that rig hunting power. He JUST GOT This gun. It was 5.5fpe limited to German govt requirements.this is his first FX. Maybe first PCP. He's brand new and I'm trying to teach him how to work up to find the proper settings for his gun. Before he asked for help just screwed the micro in until it bogged down the power wheel at max and put the reg to 160-170. And he was at 717fps losing his mind. So I told him to drop to 130 and to find the sweet spot balance for the valve and hammer spring. Then to work up. But he keeps maxing the hammer out and telling me at no point is his velocity dropping or losing consistency. Meaning he's way past plateauing and he's frustrated. Tomorrow he's going to try and follow advise and back the hammer spring out. He will see whats up. I posted the link to the other thread. You'll see what the idea is. I told him once he identifies that sweet spot. At that point to work up 5-10bar on the reg. And find the sweet spot again. And to do this process up until he reaches whatever velocity he wants. He even said "it's not working I dropped the pressure to 130bar and the velocity is only 770-780". He didn't realize that it did work. That you can't just set your hammer spring to max, power wheel to max and pick a pressure and expect high speed.

I've been tracking as long as you have and I know, many posts. Even pre purchase . I'm a "brand new doesn't matter guy". My local friends went straight for the regulator as soon as they got them too.

My usual order of operations.

Micro and Macro at max settings. If the gun hasn't had a golden screwdriver on it yet. Turn up reg till it starts to taper down fps. There's the power limit, now make it quiet efficient accurate and harmonious.

Where's the tungsten hammer?

 

[RabbitofCaerbannog]

I've been tracking as long as you have and I know, many posts. Even pre purchase . I'm a "brand new doesn't matter guy". My local friends went straight for the regulator as soon as they got them too.

My usual order of operations.

Micro and Macro at max settings. If the gun hasn't had a golden screwdriver on it yet. Turn up reg till it starts to taper down fps. There's the power limit, now make it quiet efficient accurate and harmonious.

Where's the tungsten hammer?

Okay you understand the goal. He's gonna eventually figure it out. I just want him to find that spot where his hammer spring adjustments start to make. Difference. I'm curious as to why he hasn't tried working up pressure. I don't know if something is getting lost in translation.. over and over I've told him he'd have to work up pressure to find anywhere near what he's looking for. But that he can't just plug in 3 numbers that worked on the AEAC video and expect his gun to behave the exact same. Especially since he forewent the suggesting of just spending time with the gun in stock configurations before "powertune" everything. He's learning and I get the frustration. I did this too. . And yes im sorry I misunderstood your point at first. he wasn't instructed to "stay at 130" no matter what. Just to use it as a starting point.

 

[grzech2005]

I wouldnt be shimming springs, i took 10 shots and removed a high power spring in my impact and just used the 26.5g hammer. A normal spring with enough hammer mass ought to do it and the pressure can be used to control dwell. There's something being overlooked I think too. I'm wondering if a previous poster's comment about a flow restricted valve seat is a direction worth exploring?

yes- perhaps it is!

and i would not think its because they restricted the valve seat because the german dealer would rather say it is restricted besides the transfer port and hammer removal for liability reasons.. he would not hide it because i will now find out by taking it out and comparing to the new one model 2024C when i get it in the mail..

but i am thinking that maybe fx made a mistake in the factory and grabbed the wrong valve seat (the restricted version and put that in by mistake.

 

[grzech2005]

I've been tracking as long as you have and I know, many posts. Even pre purchase . I'm a "brand new doesn't matter guy". My local friends went straight for the regulator as soon as they got them too.

My usual order of operations.

Micro and Macro at max settings. If the gun hasn't had a golden screwdriver on it yet. Turn up reg till it starts to taper down fps. There's the power limit, now make it quiet efficient accurate and harmonious.

Where's the tungsten hammer?

micro and macro at max? that's exactly what i did yesterday... and i tried with pw at max but micro a little lower and then cranked it up- either way same results- i get around 850fps, no more with the 45gr jsb

why am i so stuck on the power when i have the zeus with its 1200fpe?

because i want to find the max and then tune it down for precision

but i did not even mount the scope yet because i got stuck on the first stage of finding the max fpe..

if only this gun was normal, like others report- 150bar, pw max, micro near max and produce 950fps then i would be done with the power confirming stage and proceed to precision tuning stage

but i am stuck on the power confirmation stage which tells me my gun is not making the power other DL 30cal are making- that's why i get mad

 

[RabbitofCaerbannog]

yes- perhaps it is!

and i would not think its because they restricted the valve seat because the german dealer would rather say it is restricted besides the transfer port and hammer removal for liability reasons.. he would not hide it because i will now find out by taking it out and comparing to the new one model 2024C when i get it in the mail..

but i am thinking that maybe fx made a mistake in the factory and grabbed the wrong valve seat (the restricted version and put that in by mistake.

Honestly. I'm pretty sure you're smacking the valve WAYY too hard. You've already been up to 70fpe. Go 3 or 4 full rotations anti clockwise. Do SMALL increments. ¼ to ⅓ turns of the 1.5mm screw at Most. If you're bogging the wheel down. That's not good. Just set it at 23 and leave it (UNTIL good velocity is found). From minimum. Do incremental increase of ¼ or ⅓ turn of the screw. Shoot 3 or 4 shots into chronograph PER increment. You should reach a point where it no longer rises. It doesn't have to fall but usually does. But it will stop increasing and it shouldn't be anywhere near full .. at that point. Raise 5-10psi. Then start over. Hell you can even start the test by moving the the reg up to 140-145 and see if the velocity rises or falls .

 

[RabbitofCaerbannog]

micro and macro at max? that's exactly what i did yesterday... and i tried with pw at max but micro a little lower and then cranked it up- either way same results- i get around 850fps, no more with the 45gr jsb

why am i so stuck on the power when i have the zeus with its 1200fpe?

because i want to find the max and then tune it down for precision

but i did not even mount the scope yet because i got stuck on the first stage of finding the max fpe..

if only this gun was normal, like others report- 150bar, pw max, micro near max and produce 950fps then i would be done with the power confirming stage and proceed to precision tuning stage

but i am stuck on the power confirmation stage which tells me my gun is not making the power other DL 30cal are making- that's why i get mad

That's the issue. That's not what he's said. He's saying teaching them by totally cranking it up and having them solve the problem. Like you're doing now. You can tjist go to max max max and get high velocity. There is a tiny space on the hammer spring tension preload for each pressure. It's not just max max max .

 

[grzech2005]

Okay you understand the goal. He's gonna eventually figure it out. I just want him to find that spot where his hammer spring adjustments start to make. Difference. I'm curious as to why he hasn't tried working up pressure. I don't know if something is getting lost in translation.. over and over I've told him he'd have to work up pressure to find anywhere near what he's looking for. But that he can't just plug in 3 numbers that worked on the AEAC video and expect his gun to behave the exact same. Especially since he forewent the suggesting of just spending time with the gun in stock configurations before "powertune" everything. He's learning and I get the frustration. I did this too. . And yes im sorry I misunderstood your point at first. he wasn't instructed to "stay at 130" no matter what. Just to use it as a starting point.

i am working up the pressure- did so yesterday

but i keep getting 850fps no matter which pressure i set.. i will try again today

 

[grzech2005]

Honestly. I'm pretty sure you're smacking the valve WAYY too hard. You've already been up to 70fpe. Go 3 or 4 full rotations anti clockwise. Do SMALL increments. ¼ to ⅓ turns of the 1.5mm screw at Most. If you're bogging the wheel down. That's not good. Just set it at 23 and leave it (UNTIL good velocity is found). From minimum. Do incremental increase of ¼ or ⅓ turn of the screw. Shoot 3 or 4 shots into chronograph PER increment. You should reach a point where it no longer rises. It doesn't have to fall but usually does. But it will stop increasing and it shouldn't be anywhere near full .. at that point. Raise 5-10psi. Then start over. Hell you can even start the test by moving the the reg up to 140-145 and see if the velocity rises or falls .

but you do see where i get hung up right?

when i do 130bar and reach my platoe lets says with 80% of micro and then go up to 140bar- i only have 20% remaining of the micro which i then crank up to 100% and can not reach the platoe at 140bar anymore

and this has been my problem from the beginning, that i use up most of the micro to reach the platoe-

if i were to reach the platoe at 130bar with lets say 30% of the micro and went up to 140bar- i would still have 70% on the micro that i could utilize and maybe reach the platoe there and go up again to 150bar or so..

that would work but it does not work like this with this gun so something is wrong here..

but i am using up most of my micro on the first 130bar step and have nothing left for the next 140bar step... is it my doing something wrong or the gun?

 

[6gun]

micro and macro at max? that's exactly what i did yesterday... and i tried with pw at max but micro a little lower and then cranked it up- either way same results- i get around 850fps, no more with the 45gr jsb

why am i so stuck on the power when i have the zeus with its 1200fpe?

because i want to find the max and then tune it down for precision

but i did not even mount the scope yet because i got stuck on the first stage of finding the max fpe..

if only this gun was normal, like others report- 150bar, pw max, micro near max and produce 950fps then i would be done with the power confirming stage and proceed to precision tuning stage

but i am stuck on the power confirmation stage which tells me my gun is not making the power other DL 30cal are making- that's why i get mad

I don't think you're maxxed out yet.
27 gram hammer.

FX Maverick, Wildcat MKIII, Dreamline, King, Dynamic, DRS, Panthera, Tungsten Hammer FX20699

FX Maverick, Wildcat MKIII, Dreamline, Crown, Panthera, Dynamic, King, DRS Tungsten Hammer FX20699 to Achieve maximum power out of your FX Impact Airrifle

huma-air.com

 

[6gun]

but you do see where i get hung up right?

when i do 130bar and reach my platoe lets says with 80% of micro and then go up to 140bar- i only have 20% remaining of the micro which i then crank up to 100% and can not reach the platoe at 140bar anymore

and this has been my problem from the beginning, that i use up most of the micro to reach the platoe-

if i were to reach the platoe at 130bar with lets say 30% of the micro and went up to 140bar- i would still have 70% on the micro that i could utilize and maybe reach the platoe there and go up again to 150bar or so..

that would work but it does not work like this with this gun so something is wrong here..

but i am using up most of my micro on the first 130bar step and have nothing left for the next 140bar step... is it my doing something wrong or the gun?

Simplify it. Set micro and macro at their maximum values, transfer port on high and aligned. If increasing regulator pressure beyond 130 bar makes velocity decrease, you should try the heavy tungsten hammer I linked to and see if that helps.


You'll be on your way to 150 bar.

 

[6gun]

What im describing will help define the edges of the performance envolope you have for a given setup. It skips a lot of guessing, messing around and copying somebody else's recipe. If it can't do what you want at max settings you need to try another variable.

I will first adjust my hammer weight pressure and spring to find and exceed my target specs, i then walk it back to make it accurate and a "pleasant" feeling and sounding series of events.

Research on what hammer weights were available hat have assisted you. Also cross referencing which guns share parts to help you find other options that may suit your unconventional need.

 

[grzech2005]

I don't think you're maxxed out yet.
27 gram hammer.

FX Maverick, Wildcat MKIII, Dreamline, King, Dynamic, DRS, Panthera, Tungsten Hammer FX20699

FX Maverick, Wildcat MKIII, Dreamline, Crown, Panthera, Dynamic, King, DRS Tungsten Hammer FX20699 to Achieve maximum power out of your FX Impact Airrifle

huma-air.com

will that help with my fps?? i want it! i just finished testing, video comes in few minutes

 

[grzech2005]

Ok

i did some testing- pleased with it!

-i took out the shimms from the spring

-i cranked it up to 150bar, PW 23, micro 80% (sweet spot, more micro fps drop)

-5 degrees Celsius in the back room, behind the shop

-hammer heavy 14.5gram from huma, spring from huma

-around 870fps with 45gr jsb hades 30cal

-using 6x24-50 scope from vector optics

here is vid with approximately 50 yards practice shots

 

[6gun]

Ok

i did some testing- pleased with it!

-i took out the shimms from the spring

-i cranked it up to 150bar, PW 23, micro 80% (sweet spot, more micro fps drop)

-5 degrees Celsius in the back room, behind the shop

-hammer heavy 14.5gram from huma, spring from huma

-around 870fps with 45gr jsb hades 30cal

-using 6x24-50 scope from vector optics

here is vid with approximately 50 yards practice shots

It's the last option for hammer weight unless you have a surface grinder and make one out of a carbide end mill shank.

 

[6gun]

Ok

i did some testing- pleased with it!

-i took out the shimms from the spring

-i cranked it up to 150bar, PW 23, micro 80% (sweet spot, more micro fps drop)

-5 degrees Celsius in the back room, behind the shop

-hammer heavy 14.5gram from huma, spring from huma

-around 870fps with 45gr jsb hades 30cal

-using 6x24-50 scope from vector optics

here is vid with approximately 50 yards practice shots

I like that you're happy with the power level. You have enough to keep you interested and really dial in that tune.

 

[grzech2005]

I like that you're happy with the power level. You have enough to keep you interested and really dial in that tune.

but i need more energy- so should i get that heavy hammer 27gram?

i am bottoming out at 150/155bar reg with micro at 70-80%, more micro reduces my fps.. so that's all i can get.. next would be 160/165bar but that's not recommended for fx reg although i would still close that valve i thing if i went max on the micro and that would maybe yield 880-890fps..

but that would be the limit for this reg and for my hammer..

so i am thinking of getting the extra high pressure huma reg 100-200bar

then i could go up to 180/190bar and easily reach the 900/920fps but would need that super heavy hammer to open the valve with that much pressure

what do you think about getting that reg??

 

[6gun]

but i need more energy- so should i get that heavy hammer 27gram?

i am bottoming out at 150/155bar reg with micro at 70-80%, more micro reduces my fps.. so that's all i can get.. next would be 160/165bar but that's not recommended for fx reg although i would still close that valve i thing if i went max on the micro and that would maybe yield 880-890fps..

but that would be the limit for this reg and for my hammer..

so i am thinking of getting the extra high pressure huma reg 100-200bar

then i could go up to 180/190bar and easily reach the 900/920fps but would need that super heavy hammer to open the valve with that much pressure

what do you think about getting that reg??

Mess with what you have in the gun a little more and find the hammer limit. Pretend that the micro screw and macro wheel do not exist and leave them as they are, only adjusting the regulator(as directed in the manual do you don't ruin the piston)

You would need to get the high pressure reg and the tungsten hammer if you want to exceed the factory specified pressure limit. If your micro isnt helping anymore, have you found the point where increasing regulator pressure starts to lose velocity(a repeatable 10 fps) ?

The linked hammer is basically the end of the road and you will then be capable of over gassing the gun making it loud and often less accurate due to the air disturbances behind the exiting projectile. You could try it with your power spring eventually. I would carefully experiment with increasing pressure gradually over the chronograph to find where the pressure increase starts to help close the valve and shorten you valve open time.

At least on my 22 I was able to find that limit, and then turn it down using the tungsten hammer to make my shot sequence a smoother one at more realistic pressures and velocities. More force is more wear too on the hammer and valve components.