Airgun Technologies On Transfer Port, Swept Volume and Piston Slam at Powerful Springers

For I think these issues cannot be considered apart
I use to have great ideas (at least till someone tells me better :))
First of all: What a name "Transfer Port" for such a humble bore, the pressure nozzle. (I'm quite sure if there was a valve acting fast enough with 3 mm full clearance it stuck there instead of that bore.
My idea about the above is that the larger the swept volume the bigger TP they accept. That schouldn't suggest that a large TP is better than a small one.
TP length is at least an issue as its width. As long as the width isn't much less than 3 mm the resistance to airflow (which might be the first concern) isn't the point but its dead volume is.
A powerful spring will easily press the complete swept volume (the air cushion) into the TP when it's too large. (before the pellet has started moving) Thus any enhancing of the TP will yield nothing but increase of dry firing.
The air cushion itself has no direct impact on pellet speed in the way: the more the higher the power. This is because the air cushion does not deliver the energy, it's the spring. The cushion is nothing but a clutch or like the string in an longbow translating the energy stored in the spring to the pellet. It does so quite efficently. Compress for example a spring and put a pellet on top of it and release. The pellet won't be nearly as fast as it is blown through the barrel. For good shooting consistency it is important to attain a high iniitial (maximum) pressure thus optimally sealing the pellet into the breech. A too large TP with respect to the swept volume might be degrading there.
Only, if the initial (maximum) pressure was too high (don't know if that ever occurs) a larger TP might flatten that pressure peak and yield a smoother action. This depends on the pellet type at what pressure it releases, too. Pretty sure hard and tight pellets need higher initial pressure thus a small TP (by volume). But when the pellet was soft and loose, only a small enough (by width) TP makes sure of a constant and good initial (maximum) pressure at all. So the small TP (by volume) is good for both pellet types the small TP (by width) is good at least for soft, lightweight and undersized pellets.
What minimum swept volume is necessary for a certain pellet energy depends surely on TP volume. But I've no idea at moment how to estimate the minimum air cushion volume for a certain pellet energy. For my calculations on pellet speed I just suppose a sufficient amount of air involved.

And then ther're those splendid combinations of a certain airgun with a certain power, certain barrel and pellet which do better than any other combination. Maybe that can never been properly calculated just tried. When the pellet is released just at the perfect moment to subdue any slam and vibration, the situation is called "aperiodischer Grenzfall" sorry, lack of proper translation.

Just how I think.

And piston weight must be considered, too. None will stand alone

The shorter the TP the wider it may possibly be. The longer it is the narrower it must be in order to avoid dead volume. but a 1 inch long TP is no aperture but a tube where diameter reduces airflow by 4th power (Hagen-Poiseulle's law), so TP length is more degrading than width (as long as resistance to airflow is an issue at all)
 
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Interesting. I've often been tempted to mess with transfer ports but to scared to attempt it. Shrinking a transfer port is a lot harder than opening one.

One thing about transfer ports is centrally locating them increases power significantly over offseting them.

I used to chamfer mine but found no notable improvement. Made me feel better at the time. That's all.

Thanks for write up.
 
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me too, about chamfering. About centering and decentering, do you know the Weihrauch ones are extremely off-centered with respect to the piston?
G. Cardew writes that such offset has little effect, till now I believe him and it feels logic.
Yes I do. It's why I mentioned it. I'm in these Weihrauchs all the time.

All respect to Cardew but I disagree with him. He primarily dealt with sub 12 lb rifles where the offset difference might have "little effect" as he suggest . On bigger guns it has a huge affect. Look at the big Dianas that have central ports. They're frigging power houses.

I've seen Weihrauch TPs that were angled down towards center to improve efficiency. That might not of help as it would increase the length, increasing lost volume and molecular friction through it. It would likely increase the disruption of flow in and out of the TP as well.

Weihrauch's star channels leading to the TP in the face of the compression tube on the HW90 is an obvious attempt to improve efficiency of the offset TP.

I used to build naturally aspirated drag race motors and everything is about volumetric efficiency. I can tell you from flow bench testing that a central TP is much more efficient.
 
Yes I do. It's why I mentioned it. I'm in these Weihrauchs all the time.

All respect to Cardew but I disagree with him. He primarily dealt with sub 12 lb rifles where the offset difference might have "little effect" as he suggest . On bigger guns it has a huge affect. Look at the big Dianas that have central ports. They're frigging power houses. Are they more effective than the Weihrauchs (except the 35)? I don't think so The high efficiency of the 52 or the AA TX200 mkIV can easily be ecplained by other means. The 350 is not too efficient, the 31 and 34....models neither with their highly inclined TPs (too long, too wide and too much inclined?) For example the HW 85 delivers more power than the Diana 34 when the very same mainspring is inserted though its swept volume is less.

I've seen Weihrauch TPs that were angled down towards center to improve efficiency. That might not of help as it would increase the length, increasing lost volume and molecular friction through it. It would likely increase the disruption of flow in and out of the TP as well.

Weihrauch's star channels leading to the TP in the face of the compression tube on the HW90 is an obvious attempt to improve efficiency of the offset TP. This again is addressed by Cardew as being pointless.

I used to build naturally aspirated drag race motors and everything is about volumetric efficiency. I can tell you from flow bench testing that a central TP is much more efficient. I still doubt that for springers till better evidence. There's not that much airflow just about 60 ccm. But I admit that a direct comparison ls not so easy as it is in the case of different TP sizes.
By the way, I'm wondering about the breech face inclination of all Diana breakbarrels. It's not vertical like the Weihrauch ones but facing down a little. What is the point? Maybe an extra momentum in the cocking link that the barrel is pressed downwards in the moment of highest pressure in order to avoid too much stress to the breech seal? Sort of self controlling action the more the slam the more the protection?

Cheers MMM
 
I don't think the edge has a considerable impact. Though I chamfer all TP entries by a mm or so, it can't hurt anyway but not hoping for any noticeable effect. A bit of superstition
A none chamfered TP is going to have a higher probability of vena contracta taking place. This phenomena constricts the usable diameter of the TP. I think this only matters in very high powered rifles, but chamfering is like boring a slightly bigger diameter. You may see an improvement after chamfering if you use of more powerful spring or increase the stroke.

-Marty
 
haha. You'll never know unless you try. Just ask about TP sizes to find opinions and uncertain quotings and little trustworthy information. Till you try for yourself.

"digging out a hole" is a good expression. Our dog used to do that all day long at the beach. And then the sea came and the big hole was gone. Work left for next day
 
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A radius at the upstream end of the transfer port will slightly reduce the depth of the turbulent boundary layer of air in the port, effectively increasing the diameter through which air flows.
Indeed, it’s the vena contracta effect I mention above. There is a thread on GTA from a few years back also talking about choked flow inside the TP which is related to this topic. At the time I had raised the idea of shaping the TP into a de Laval nozzle to improve choke conditions but there was some conflict on whether springers functioned as pop-guns or blow-guns or a mixture of both.

-Marty
 
Indeed, it’s the vena contracta effect I mention above. There is a thread on GTA from a few years back also talking about choked flow inside the TP which is related to this topic. At the time I had raised the idea of shaping the TP into a de Laval nozzle to improve choke conditions but there was some conflict on whether springers functioned as pop-guns or blow-guns or a mixture of both.

-Marty
'TP science gone MAD!' - I remember the thread well, Marty, and it was one of the most thought-provoking threads I've ever read on the spring/piston airgun shot cycle.

If I understand the concepts of the pop gun and blow gun correctly, I'd opt for the pop gun. The peak potential air PV air energy in my TX200 with 85mm stroke is insufficient to generate its muzzle energy without considerable assistance from the internal u energy of the air (peaking at something over 1,000K).

On the de Laval nozzle, Mike Wright (who I introduced in said thread) asked one of his fellow professors whether it might work in the airgun, but the answer was that the TP was too narrow to have any significant effect.
 
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