N/A One piece mount vs traditional two rings

[Mycapt65]

I’ve got many sets of Sportsmatch and BKL mounts as well as their Chinese knock offs and you’d be hard pressed to detect any difference. Do you somehow think that the Chinese can make $1000 scopes, $5000 drones and airguns like the Hubens but that they can’t produce a simple piece of aluminum properly? In all likelihood the scope you have mounted on your rifle is Chinese.

These are a few of the mounts I have lying around.
View attachment 553131

It's not an anti Chinese manufacturing thing. You're right about many things but you're just plain wrong about the knock off rings. You can't tell the difference in a picture. Most people can't tell the difference in quality machining and materials in person. Just thread a screw in a Chinese knock off. They're so roughly cut it almost feels like sand in three threads. The threads are cut loose and the material of the rings and screws are soft they won't hold much torque. Try torquing a their dovetail clamps to Sportsmatch's 55inlbs. I GUARANTEE the knockoff strips the body or snaps the screw before reaching 55. If it does, it won't do it twice. I have the same sportsmatch rings on scopes for years that have been moved around alot and they hold 55 repeatedly with no signs of softening.

Don't take my information as an attack on you. Most people can't tell the difference. As a retired high end automotive technician and railroad machinist I can. The knock offs can work but they wont be centered in the the dovetail. They're are often tilted and the dovetail angles are usually cut wrong. The scope bores are sometimes offset kinking the scope tubes even at proper torque.

Between my own guns and the others I work on, I've been down this road too many times to let this go. Again it's not personal but there's factual reasons I posted these differences. I don't want people wasting their money or damaging their guns and scopes because they heard they could save twenty dollars.

Be well
Ron

 

[KWK]

Why did they stop making these? I have a few laying around I took off used guns I've bought. They fit the holes in a Weirdrock and didn't hack up the receiver like stop pins do. That's why I don't ever use those stop pins. There's other ways to skin that cat.

 

[Motorhead]

Given the choice and able to be fitted without interference issues on Springer / Ram or PCP's will go 1 piece with most applications also cantilevered forward.

 

[Peghead]

My preference is single piece for high shock guns, when possible.

For your application i recommend the most stout rings you care to afford. After being cheap on rings and optics for 15 years I learned not to skimp there, especially rings/mounting.

Yes so far this has worked best for me as well.

 

[Peghead]

Optics and mounts are two things that have improved immensely over what they were in the old days. I remember when I was a teenager in the 80's and I got one of the very early model RWS34s. I couldn't get a scope to stay put on it. It seemed that over the course of 100 shots or so that it would always migrate across the rail, People were already talking about how springers would eat up scopes, but the real issue was that 90% of the rings that were available back then were pure dog sh!t. Rimfires weren't regarded as much more than toys either and to get any mount made for an 11mm dovetail that wasn't absolute garbage you had to mail order from some place like Beeman and mail ordering was a real PITA. These days I can go to Amazon and get a good copy of Sports Match rings delivered in a day for $9 or a one piece mount for $15.

If your scope keeps moving on you, what I recommend is to grab a bunch of Q-tips, some paper towels, rubbing alcohol and a knife and clean out your dovetails until there is no more dirt, grime or grease left in them, then apply a little blue Loctite to the dovetail and re-attach your scope.

That's sound info. Ty!

 

[Peghead]

I’ve got many sets of Sportsmatch and BKL mounts as well as their Chinese knock offs and you’d be hard pressed to detect any difference. Do you somehow think that the Chinese can make $1000 scopes, $5000 drones and airguns like the Hubens but that they can’t produce a simple piece of aluminum properly? In all likelihood the scope you have mounted on your rifle is Chinese.

These are a few of the mounts I have lying around.
View attachment 553131

And the screws they use are soft and strip very easily!

 

[Bedrock Bob]

And the screws they use are soft and strip very easily!

Tha fasteners and the threaded bores are the difference in my limited experience.

I've had good luck making almost any mount behave. Even the cheapest ones will work. I have a 1" lapping bar I can lay in the saddles to check the alignment. Ill grind a bit if they arent too far off. If you get the screws on the straps to an even torque most of them hold pretty good. A dab of hot pink nail polish keeps the ring from slipping. I'm sure VibraTite (or some other secret sauce) is "better"... if it's free and dosent slip it's as good as it gets IMHO.

I'm really picky about eye relief and cheek weld. For me having the perfect scope placement and riser height is more important than the brand or style of rings.

I like quality rings. On a quality gun I'll always buy quality rings and mounts. That dosent mean a cheap set of rings won't work. Most work just dandy as long as you are careful with torque and crappy fasteners.

 

[Bedrock Bob]

Bob you give a lot of good advice. But not all. Couple things we differ on. As I shoot mostly benchrest free recoil or offhand I use high rings and mounts to help keep my face off the stock. No problem with scopes slipping by using Burris rings with inserts or in Sportsmatch rings. With conventional rings like Sportsmatch simply put 1 layer of masking tape in each bottom half, torque to 17 inch pound and your scope will not slip within the rings and this includes heavy 34mm tube scopes. I enjoy your posts Bob, we are mostly on the same page.

My point was that the higher the scope and the more mass it has the more likely it is to slip. I wasnt implying you couldnt have success with a big high scope. Especially a Burris ring with the cool inserts. Those will hold any scope.

The new finishes on the scopes (nitride etc.) are a big reason rings slip. A polished tube is MUCH easier for a ring to hold. The inserts on the burris mounts grab the profile great and will secure any scope at any height. So will many others. Still, the higher and heavier the scope the more force it gets from recoil.

I don't like tape. I live in the Chihuahuan desert. The glue migrates out in the heat/cold cycles and makes a mess. Even painters tape gets chalky and weird around the rings. Yes it holds great. It does that by filling in the profile on the scope finish and creating an interface with the ring.

I get a little lacquer on my finger and smear it in the saddles. Very thin. Let it sit until it's almost dry (or it wont dry). Then mount the scope. It's not affected by the temp swings and it wipes off easily with acetone. You can't see it at all.

It does the same thing as the tape. It "fills" the profile on the finish and allows full contact with the ring.

Casting epoxy works great too. CA glue. Molasses. Anything to create an interface will stop it from slipping provided the screws are torqued properly and the mounts are aligned "pretty close".

 

[jkingrph]

It's not an anti Chinese manufacturing thing. You're right about many things but you're just plain wrong about the knock off rings. You can't tell the difference in a picture. Most people can't tell the difference in quality machining and materials in person. Just thread a screw in a Chinese knock off. They're so roughly cut it almost feels like sand in three threads. The threads are cut loose and the material of the rings and screws are soft they won't hold much torque. Try torquing a their dovetail clamps to Sportsmatch's 55inlbs. I GUARANTEE the knockoff strips the body or snaps the screw before reaching 55. If it does, it won't do it twice. I have the same sportsmatch rings on scopes for years that have been moved around alot and they hold 55 repeatedly with no signs of softening.

Don't take my information as an attack on you. Most people can't tell the difference. As a retired high end automotive technician and railroad machinist I can. The knock offs can work but they wont be centered in the the dovetail. They're are often tilted and the dovetail angles are usually cut wrong. The scope bores are sometimes offset kinking the scope tubes even at proper torque.

Between my own guns and the others I work on, I've been down this road too many times to let this go. Again it's not personal but there's factual reasons I posted these differences. I don't want people wasting their money or damaging their guns and scopes because they heard they could save twenty dollars.

Be well
Ron

Gives more meaning to the old saying "you get what you pay for"! Personally I look for something made in the US, Canada, Europe, Japan or Israel. Quality components are made other places but are more hard to find.

 

[Mycapt65]

Why did they stop making these? I have a few laying around I took off used guns I've bought. They fit the holes in a Weirdrock and didn't hack up the receiver like stop pins do. That's why I don't ever use those stop pins. There's other ways to skin that cat.

View attachment 553135

Those were great. I just sold one with the Blue Ribbon scope and mount that came on my 77. I didn't need it. My Sportsmatch rings never slide and the pins never mar my receivers. They use an infinitely adjustable smooth rolled spring steel pin that's centered. If they ever slid it would be installer error. And no I have no financial interest in Sportsmatch. I just never understood why they're not more popular. They make for a nice clean installation. No need to stack ugly adaptors and additional stops. They're just an elegant solution.

 

[TG59]

UTG makes very sturdy two piece rings that I used on HW95 with 30mm scope. They have set screw stops and very positive claw mount for dovetail.

 

[Mycapt65]

UTG makes very sturdy two piece rings that I used on HW95 with 30mm scope. They have set screw stops and very positive claw mount for dovetail.
View attachment 553355View attachment 553356View attachment 553357View attachment 553358

They're much nicer looking rings than their cheaper stuff. They're still using the smaller threaded stop pin. Can you take a picture of the ring on the rifle directly from behind? I'm curious if they fixed the tilt and finally centered the stop pin. Their other cheaper rings sit tilted with the pin offset.

Thanks
Ron

 

[TG59]

Hello Ron,
Does this photo show what you are looking for? The light direction from right and shadow may be an issue.
FWIW when I mounted a new scope with these rings windage was nearly spot on at 25 yards.

 

[maxtrouble]

Another vote for BKL or Sportsmatch rings. They always work correctly. I had some cheap knock off adjustable rings and I got what I paid for. So many issues and loose screws, ugh. Never again.

The BKL 260 droop mount with a Hawke Airmax 2-7x32 is perfect for a magnum springer like the HW30 or HW50.

 

[Rondo]

Sportsmatch TO84
All you’ll ever need.

@TG59 I know it doesn’t touch anything, but that’s one jagged ring base there.