Hatsan Opinions on buying a cheap Hatsan springer and modifying it vs buying higher end Hatsan.

[Josh1973]

Exactly. They are an excellent rifle poorly executed.

With a little more attention to detail and some machined steel trigger parts they would be a fine gun. I've praised every one of mine. They shot beautifully after I corrected the usual complaints.

All of mine have been scrapped because of part #109 in the trigger breaking that little loop off. A new trigger is $35 plus shipping. By the time you add a spring and seal to that you are only a few bucks short of a new rifle. The warranty work is good but they don't pay shipping anymore. So it's half the cost of a new one to ship it for repairs. Once that warranty expires they are virtually disposable.

I've sent a bunch back for replacement. Crooked front shrouds, barrels with ripped up rifling (like they used a broken button or something), triggers not locking... all just QC problems. But the ones I haven't returned are pretty solid rifles despite their obvious shortcomings. Sometimes you just have to shuffle through crappy ones before you get a good one.

The last one I bought was $99 shipped to my door. It's hard not to get your money's worth out of a deal like that.

Thanks for sharing. I will keep one as a project and invest $300 to $400 in a mid range break barrel.

 

[Sawney Bean]

Right now I ordered a cheap Hatsan Zada. I did .25 caliber.
My primary reason is I been spotting critters in my urban full of rabies or suffering.
And I need something by tomorrow on Amazon. My area is not exactly friendly to even air guns.
Thankfully it is tolorated as long as you go a bit in a secluded wooded area to practice.

I spotted a pretty rare solid albino large male skunk with rabies. I seen it alive and it was gone mad and eating it's own hair and foaming at the mouth.
I found him dead today and full of flies. I bagged him up from the walk trail in four kitchen bags.
Carried him about a quarter of a mile to the 10 foot tall construction site bin.
I won't have to worry about peoples pets or kids getting near it and spreading ravies or other illness to humans.
I am going to save up or finance a mid grade break barrel in the $300 to $500 range at some point in the next few months.
Perhaps find a used higher end air rifle for sale.

You’ll probably love it. There’s something about spring guns that I find entertaining and the more powerful they are the more entertaining I find them.

The thing about hunting with springers though is that it’s 90% about shot placement and maybe 10% about power. With a good headshot a 20 fpe gun will reliably take down anything raccoon sized or smaller. Sure, a more powerful gun will do it better and might give you the option of a chest shot on smaller game, but with spring guns you’re trading accuracy for power as the more powerful guns are harder to shoot accurately. With practice you can get good with most guns, but even the best shooters are more accurate with lower powered guns.

It has to do with the fact that the pellet is still in the barrel while you are experiencing the recoil and the more a gun recoils the more potential it has to throw your shot off during that fraction of a second before the pellet clears the barrel. I find it’s most apparent when you’re shooting off a bench or a rest and less apparent when you’re shooting offhand, kneeling or sitting.

Another thing about spring guns is that they can sometimes shoot to different points of impact depending on how you hold them.

 

[Bedrock Bob]

The suggestion about a Cometa is solid. I bought one to replace my H@t$an. I can't say enough good about it. It's a real shooter.

.22 cal gas ram Cometa Fenix 400. It hits hard, shoots smooth and will hold a great pattern. It's a big step up from H@t$an quality and (almost) HW accuracy. It's a simple rifle that anyone can work on too.

 

[Josh1973]

You’ll probably love it. There’s something about spring guns that I find entertaining and the more powerful they are the more entertaining I find them.

The thing about hunting with springers though is that it’s 90% about shot placement and maybe 10% about power. With a good headshot a 20 fpe gun will reliably take down anything raccoon sized or smaller. Sure, a more powerful gun will do it better and might give you the option of a chest shot on smaller game, but with spring guns you’re trading accuracy for power as the more powerful guns are harder to shoot accurately. With practice you can get good with most guns, but even the best shooters are more accurate with lower powered guns.

It has to do with the fact that the pellet is still in the barrel while you are experiencing the recoil and the more a gun recoils the more potential it has to throw your shot off during that fraction of a second before the pellet clears the barrel. I find it’s most apparent when you’re shooting off a bench or a rest and less apparent when you’re shooting offhand, kneeling or sitting.

Another thing about spring guns is that they can sometimes shoot to different points of impact depending on how you hold them.

I was taught by my father on how to hold a pellet gun. I mean I make bad shots sometimes. Happens to even the olympic level shooters.
Which is why I chose a .25 ober the .117 and .22 variants.
If I don't make a clean head shot on the critter. Maybe the extra FPE knockdown of the .25 should theoretically have a larger shock area affect. Which I assume better chance of an insta or quick kill. on a rabid critter.
I am pretty much thinking only small game. For ethical reasons. I don't even consider turkey medium game.
Head shot on turkey = Done,toasted, see you in the afterlife, sionora, bye buddy.
1 shot = 1 kill. Anything bigger than a Coyote head shot.
I am grabbing my Excaliber Wolverine 370. $1,100 of @ss beating machine.
I am tempted on a hatsan .30 cal but would like to fine a single shot pcp.
This is what I want someday if I ever get lucky or rich.

 

[SpiralGroove]

Hatsan’s are powerful Airguns best used for hunting. They look nice, are somewhat over sprung, but are very capable hunters.

Build quality is not the best, they’re a bit bulky, have excessive recoil and OK trigger, but a good value for the money.

It’s best if you can work on the gun yourself and not rely on Hatsan for the warranty.

 

[Josh1973]

The suggestion about a Cometa is solid. I bought one to replace my H@t$an. I can't say enough good about it. It's a real shooter.

.22 cal gas ram Cometa Fenix 400. It hits hard, shoots smooth and will hold a great pattern. It's a big step up from H@t$an quality and (almost) HW accuracy. It's a simple rifle that anyone can work on too.

Could you show me a buyer link please? I tried to look up Fenix and could not find a USA seller. Or price range.

Simplicity is what won me over. In a SHTF scenario. I could stock pile a dozen pellet tins.
This would work well for small game. And even a cheaper model for like a $120 Hatsan Zada will cure my itch and practice on until I can find something better.
I am going to look at second hand online or refurbished/discontinued deals.
In good time. I will gwt a bargain.

 

[Josh1973]

Hatsan’s are powerful Airguns best used for hunting. They look nice, are somewhat over sprung, but are very capable hunters.

Build quality is not the best, they’re a bit bulky, have excessive recoil and OK trigger, but a good value for the money.

It’s best if you can work on the gun yourself and not rely on Hatsan for the warranty.

That's my plan. Learning as I go.
I find it worth investing another $200 in the Hatsan Zada down the road just in rebuild parts.
The more I think about it.The more determined I am to pull this off. And buy about 4-6 cheap rebuild kits or second hand Hatsans I can gut on Ebay.
This would be a good investment for a SHTF, self reliance, or wilderness challenge.
I also plan on investing in a $250 to $350 range for a mid grade break barrel.

 

[Bedrock Bob]

Could you show me a buyer link please? I tried to look up Fenix and could not find a USA seller. Or price range.

Simplicity is what won me over. In a SHTF scenario. I could stock pile a dozen pellet tins.
This would work well for small game. And even a cheaper model for like a $120 Hatsan Zada will cure my itch and practice on until I can find something better.
I am going to look at second hand online or refurbished/discontinued deals.
In good time. I will gwt a bargain.

Welcome to Keystone Airguns

We sell and service the Cometa line of air rifles. These airguns range in power from indoor recreational shooting to outdoor plinking and small pest control. They are all very competitively priced and you will be hard pressed to find a better shooting, more reliable gun for the money!

keystoneairguns.com

 

[Sawney Bean]

I just looked up the Zada and damn that is an inexpensive rifle. $85 for a refurb on the Hatsan website! $130 new at Airgun Depot! And that price includes a scope. You can't go wrong with that!

 

[Bedrock Bob]

I just looked up the Zada and damn that is an inexpensive rifle. $85 for a refurb on the Hatsan website! $130 new at Airgun Depot! And that price includes a scope. You can't go wrong with that!

They used to have a rifle called the "Air Tact". They sold them everywhere. My buddy got one at Big 8 for $89. It's a rough hard shooting rifle with a gritty trigger. (Not a quattro). It's accurate though. Just tough to shoot.

It's got a dovetail/picatinny combo rail. It's a neat design. I'm not sure if a dovetail mount would hold on it. But the picatinny works good.

They had a recall on them. The composite barrels from the air tact got put on a 95 comp tube with a little different safety. They put it in a nice thumbhole stock and called it a model 65. I bought a couple. The Air Tact barrels were actually very accurate. The stocks were great. Walnut thumbhole with an adjustable cheekpiece.

The model 65 thumbhole stock is what kept me buying H@t$ans. When the mod 65 rifles broke I bought mod 95 actions to go in them. The cycle repeated itself.

Now the "Zada" is pretty much the "Air Tact" in a different stock. It may have a better trigger (still not a quattro). It's probably not a bad rifle. The same price as a 95 new. The specs on them are pretty much the same.

 

[Josh1973]

They used to have a rifle called the "Air Tact". They sold them everywhere. My buddy got one at Big 8 for $89. It's a rough hard shooting rifle with a gritty trigger. (Not a quattro). It's accurate though. Just tough to shoot.

It's got a dovetail/picatinny combo rail. It's a neat design. I'm not sure if a dovetail mount would hold on it. But the picatinny works good.

They had a recall on them. The composite barrels from the air tact got put on a 95 comp tube with a little different safety. They put it in a nice thumbhole stock and called it a model 65. I bought a couple. The Air Tact barrels were actually very accurate. The stocks were great. Walnut thumbhole with an adjustable cheekpiece.

The model 65 thumbhole stock is what kept me buying H@t$ans. When the mod 65 rifles broke I bought mod 95 actions to go in them. The cycle repeated itself.

Now the "Zada" is pretty much the "Air Tact" in a different stock. It may have a better trigger (still not a quattro). It's probably not a bad rifle. The same price as a 95 new. The specs on them are pretty much the same.


I may even do a second Zada and keep one to work and tinker on to learn the mechanics. And have 2 working models.
I get the feeling my Hatsan Zada will grow on me. I just may need to look into extending the stock another inch.
As I have a long draw at 31 inches each arm. I modify my stocks on my Excalibur, Barnett, and possibly the Hatsan Zada.
I will look into a light slip on recoil pad extension if necessary.
You wanna play? Sometimes you got to pay $$$

A better built modded backup air rifle you just wanted to tinker with.
Being able to do basic work on my hunting and shtf situations ranks very important to me.
Replacement parts are life

 

[Josh1973]

Welcome to Keystone Airguns

We sell and service the Cometa line of air rifles. These airguns range in power from indoor recreational shooting to outdoor plinking and small pest control. They are all very competitively priced and you will be hard pressed to find a better shooting, more reliable gun for the money!

keystoneairguns.com

I really love the link intro page. Those stocks on the intro page are really nice.

 

[Shuggoth]

The price on those refurb Hatsan rifles is pretty low, especially the Air Tact and the Zada, those are a real cheap way to get i to airgunning for sure.

 

[A.G.R]

Ok, not selling bratwurst or having any “ high arching urination” issues [BB]

Lets be strait. I have built guns from the ground up. HW,Diana, Or AIR ARMS.
EVERY ONE OF THEM HAS HAD INPUT FROM THE JANITORS ENGINEERING ..

HATSAN has had a big push when they BAUGHT the rights to Webley and their tooling.
That being said, they made Turkish assembled Uk leftover parts guns at first.. Not bad as they had a lot of leftover UK METAL.

Some had compression tubes that were original with welded on brackets , some had trigger cages and leftover springs..
THOSE WERE known as the bastard guns. THESE WERE few. Soon as they ran out of old product and lost all contracts or didn’t want to pay for the sintered sears and trigger guards as well as the expensive breech lock and hardened washers set up ..
They went to their own copy of Webley with a severely cheap breech shim design and round rod lock up as well as steel that if you needed a lug nut you could squeeze one out from your HATSAN Guns.

Whom ever designed the Quattro trigger should get a raise. Who ever is in control of their heat treating and tempering of sears and springs Should be fired. Their polish is at best 220 grit blued.
I haven’t had the sear issue as BEDROCK BOB has had , but I don’t shoot mine ne’er as much. Many of the Hatsans I had were from ten plus years back. Maybe ,they fired that good guy who knew heat treating..
I have had several QuatroPatriots that were basicly a 135 … Now I have a Turkish Tommy , it’s a 95 in a nicer stock with rounded breech and bee hive brake.

They definitely are built to a price point. As it’s known. That being said ,a hardened washer and a hardened bolt wouldn’t run the cost up that much. Fix the breech block with machined washers and new bolts and put a new guide in that as long as Dave Winfields bat and slip a new aftermarket seal in and pray you don’t get the feared BEDROCK BOB sear break ,it’s a damn good gun .. All that being said I can do it. To have it done is at least $300 plus’s cost of gun . With the caviat , YOU WILL NEVER RECOUP ANY OF IT , BECAUSE ITS A HATSAN.
I’m not that snobbish ,I’ve got one as stated .. I may try ramming it as I don’t care for the extremely heavy piston and spring set up.. piston bounce and for a 47 coil spring ,it should be making better power.
just my .02¢

 

[Bedrock Bob]

The price on those refurb Hatsan rifles is pretty low, especially the Air Tact and the Zada, those are a real cheap way to get i to airgunning for sure.

I think these two are basically the same gun in a different stock. $85 refurb.

I'd get a refurb. The scopes are basically worthless. And a refurb has already been gone over and (some) problems identified and (hopefully) fixed. A new gun in the box is a surprise package that no one has tried to shoot.

The triggers on these guns are iffy. They are rough. I've never worked on one and they could probably be made better. But out of the box they are pretty bad.

The polymer shrouded barrels are pretty good. My 65's had the same setup and they shot well. I like a solid steel barrel but the "Air Tact" barrels may be more accurate. They shoot as good if not better than the barrels on the 95.

They are all about the same price new as well as refurb. The new ones come with a (very crappy) scope and very little QC. A refurb has no scope and someone has at least identified the main problems.

I think the 95 is the better gun for the same price. The wood stock and the Quattro trigger being the big difference. Just my opinion.

Like A.G.R. alluded to I shoot a lot. Sometimes 200 or more shots daily. I can really rack up some shots on a rifle in a few weeks. I can wear anything out. Some guys may never have trigger problems for many years if at all. I expect about 8000 shots from a Quattro based on past experience. And 4-5000 on a spring. Some last longer. All are short lived (IMO). A guy who tinkers with air rifles could probably make one last forever given enough time and TLC.

I have been able to get the H@t$ans to shoot well and make excellent plinkers. It hasn't been simple and it hasn't been trouble free. But they all have been a value due to the low initial cost.

This rifle is my longest lived Hatsan 95 ever. It's about 15 months old and has about 25k shots through it. It's been rebuilt 3 times and has had 2 replacement triggers. It shoots under 3/4" @ 25 and shoots 725 fps. It's in a Mod 65 stock that has held at least 4 different rifles. It's a $99 refurb gun.

 

[Keene]

You can't polish a turd.

I reckon a dull shine might be possible. Bedrock has the right idea.

 

[Bedrock Bob]

You may notice from the photo I didn't polish this turd. Didn't even try. I just shot it and enjoyed it. It performs better than expected for a very low price.

The only polish it has is on the receiver and barrel where the bluing is rubbed off. No sh!t on my hands at all. There is more pellets through that rifle in the last year than most guys shoot in a lifetime.

It cost me less than a chicken dinner for the family. Sooner or later that investment will be a turd too. I just don't see the rub with the H@t$an.

I know you can polish a turd because I have one. It's a $600 HW95 that needs a new spring every 3k shots. Thats one beautifully polished turd. Its never shot well for more than a couple months of light use at a time. The kit to rebuild it will cost more than a new H@t$an. By the time I get it reliable and shooting right I will have over $1000 into it. So "buying quality" is not always the bed of roses it's cracked up to be.

 

[A.G.R]

You may notice from the photo I didn't polish this turd. Didn't even try. I just shot it and enjoyed it. It performs better than expected for a very low price.

The only polish it has is on the receiver and barrel where the bluing is rubbed off. No sh!t on my hands at all. There is more pellets through that rifle in the last year than most guys shoot in a lifetime.

It cost me less than a chicken dinner for the family. Sooner or later that investment will be a turd too. I just don't see the rub with the H@t$an.

I know you can polish a turd because I have one. It's a $600 HW95 that needs a new spring every 3k shots. Thats one beautifully polished turd. Its never shot well for more than a couple months of light use. The kit to rebuild it will cost more than a new H@t$an. By the time I get it reliable and shooting right I will have over $1000 into it. So "buying quality" is not always the bed of roses it's cracked up to be.

Lying in a bed of roses ,waking up in a field of of dandelions. .. finding a lottery ticket and scratching it off to a winner only to look at the date and it’s expired.
like I said. The JANITOR has had input on all of them.

 

[Bedrock Bob]

Every airgun I have ever had needed work at some point. Most have had faults that needed warranty repair or replacement. Just QC issues.

There is a lot going on inside a springer. It's a bear trap in a pipe. It's juggling all that force back and forth. Lots of moving parts. The parts that don't move shake. It's difficult engineering to begin with.

Mix that with staffing and facilities issues, international supply lines, retailers... A lot can go wrong. It's a wonder any airgun will shoot.

I don't know how H@t$an can sell a gun for $129. I don't know why HW can't make a good one for $600. There is a huge disparity there. Some middle ground would be nice.

So far the Cometa is groovy. I like it. It shoots dandy. I have shot it almost 5000 shots and zero problems. I think it fits in that halfway point between a Hatsan and an HW very nicely.

Those Dianese "two fiftys" look interesting too. I'm going to give gas rams a try for a while. I've got plenty of springs to play with.

 

[A.G.R]

Every airgun I have ever had needed work at some point. Most have had faults that needed warranty repair or replacement. Just QC issues.

There is a lot going on inside a springer. It's a bear trap in a pipe. It's juggling all that force back and forth. Lots of moving parts. The parts that don't move shake. It's difficult engineering to begin with.

Mix that with staffing and facilities issues, international supply lines, retailers... A lot can go wrong. It's a wonder any airgun will shoot.

I don't know how H@t$an can sell a gun for $129. I don't know why HW can't make a good one for $600. There is a huge disparity there. Some middle ground would be nice.

So far the Cometa is groovy. I like it. It shoots dandy. I have shot it almost 5000 shots and zero problems. I think it fits in that halfway point between a Hatsan and an HW very nicely.

Those Dianese "two fiftys" look interesting too. I'm going to give gas rams a try for a while. I've got plenty of springs to play with.

I’ve wondered myself about the gas ram 250. Trigger is my concern