N/A PCP Hammerless system

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I believe huben is the first to create a mechanical hammerless system. The system actually consists of two valves. One of them is a dump valve which has been around for a while in the pcp world. The other valve is the proprietary one. Its function is to close the dump valve.

Here is a pic of the dump valve (top). The closing valve is the one on bottom with the plastic valve.
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The closing valve is a mind bender because it never really closes. When it seals it allows a sufficient drop in pressure for the opening valve to reset. There’s a small indentation on the face of the valve that allows a small amount of air to bypass the valve and fill the opening valve completing the shot cycle.

Here’s a up close pic of the closing valve so you can see the indentation I’m talking about.

238D6517-381D-471B-96A8-DA66CDAFFEEE.jpeg
 
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Motorhead said:
SKOUT EPOCH also a hammerless design. ( Spool valve ) opened via an air solenoid that give a very small air pulse to unseat the poppet
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Apparently this first batch of Epoch work really well.

I think is just a matter of waiting for some three sessions of extreme make over on those rifles, in order to have a better looking and lighter design.
 
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Emu said:
As far as I have read, Huben has the better trigger, but Sidewinder a bigger bottle.

I choose the Sidewinders and are fantastic.
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They are fantastic…..because they copied the huben valve 🤣 However, I do give credit to the sidewinder engineer for creating the removable mag for the hammerless system.
 
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Nomadic Pirate 66 said:
So Huben was the first, right ?

Game changer in the real sense then,....for once ;)
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Yup.

It’s not often that companies can invent never before seen valve technology. Most valves are building upon designs that have been around for a while. This is hammerless system is a marvel of engineering.
 
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It's not just the valve that is a marvel on the Huben - it is the whole package. They really went outside the box in thinking on it to make a really robust compact system. The reason the magazine is not removable in use on it is because the air path flows down the center of the magazine. This makes it nice and compact and also ambidextrous. Lefties have comfortably shot my Huben, but can't do so with my Sidewinder (a lefty version would take a mirror image chassis and possibly even magazine too, as it is gear driven.

Personally, I don't have any issues with the non-removeable mag on the Huben - I was a bit worried about it when I got it but now that I am used to it I love it. I do like that the mags are removable on the Sidewinder (and that the barrel is easier to remove too) but for me it is not a great advantage; it is no faster to load the mags than the Huben as they are two part and have to be precisely fitted into the gun with gear teeth aligned (no "slop" like all the other mag guns I have that can even be inserted blindly), but it would be an advantage at a range where it would be easier to prove the gun safe.

Here is a short animation video on the Huben valve system:
 
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wimpanzee said:
Having owned and shot both the sidewinder and the huben - the huben is by far the better valve/action. The sidewinder sounded and felt so janky and lego'd together. The mechanical slapping of the sidewinder makes it sound like you shot a burst even when doing single shot.
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I agree completely . . . the Sidewinder is just so much more mechanically loud than the Huben - just the mechanical noise of the Sidewinder is louder than the full shot cycle of the Huben (both have LDCs on them). And the Huben feels more robust with a more solid build and has a MUCH better trigger, and even a better power adjuster wheel (more positive clicks, and has never been bumped off settings in years - unlike the Sidewinder in months).

That said, I'm warming up to the Sidewinder. The TJ's barrel is great (but this is somewhat offset by the lousy trigger), and it is much easier to work on than the Huben. But I do have to find a way to quiet it down to make it something that I want to shoot often. Mine currently has a Huma 40 Compact on it and it is just not enough; while I don't want the added length, I am thinking of getting a STO Sarissa for it.
 
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AlanMcD said:
It's not just the valve that is a marvel on the Huben - it is the whole package. They really went outside the box in thinking on it to make a really robust compact system. The reason the magazine is not removable in use on it is because the air path flows down the center of the magazine. This makes it nice and compact and also ambidextrous. Lefties have comfortably shot my Huben, but can't do so with my Sidewinder (a lefty version would take a mirror image chassis and possibly even magazine too, as it is gear driven.

Personally, I don't have any issues with the non-removeable mag on the Huben - I was a bit worried about it when I got it but now that I am used to it I love it. I do like that the mags are removable on the Sidewinder (and that the barrel is easier to remove too) but for me it is not a great advantage; it is no faster to load the mags than the Huben as they are two part and have to be precisely fitted into the gun with gear teeth aligned (no "slop" like all the other mag guns I have that can even be inserted blindly), but it would be an advantage at a range where it would be easier to prove the gun safe.

Here is a short animation video on the Huben valve system:
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Lol even with the video I'm confused how it works! I've never really been interested in semi auto but gotta say Huben definitely seems the best over all system.
 
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Thought I'd add something interesting on how the Huben closing valve works, and it is in contrast to the Sidewinder, which despite their similarities does not behave the same way . . .

On the Huben, for a given functional setting of the closing valve (meaning something usable between either fully open of fully closed) the amount of air released on the shot is a direct function of the resistance that the projectile provides to the air flow. This is very different than a normal valve.

I have mine set to shoot 18.1 grain pellets at about 920 fps. At the same setting, it will shoot 15.9 grain Hades pellets right about the same speed - indicating it is using less air per shot with the lighter pellets. And if I dry fire it with no pellets in the mag, it functions fine but releases very little air at all - much less than on a full shot. And at the other extreme is when the gun jams, which it has done when I tried to shoot slugs that were loose in the mag - with the slug blocking the airflow path, the closing valve does not close for a long time, and the gun can dump the reservoir on one shot. I understand how this happens as the closing valve requires a drop in air pressure in order to close - drop the pressure faster and the valve closes faster and vice versa.

The Sidewinder does not behave this way - when dry fired it lets out pretty much a full blast of air as it would with a pellet in the mag, and lighter pellets go much faster at a given setting. I have not had it apart, nor have I seen any kind of parts diagram, so I don't know what the difference is but it sure behaves differently when shot.

One of the other great things about this design is how the magazine advances - the actuator is basically a sealed piston. When the shot happens and pressure drops in the firing chamber, a spring overcomes the lower pressure pushing the piston forward, and then when the chamber represurizes after the shot, the piston returns against the spring and that advances the magazine via an internal gear. No wasted air . . . brilliant!
 
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IMO the whole of the K1 is a marvel these are ultra fantastic to shoot and when set up very accurate i don't shoot paper targets just hunt and fun shoot, Once the correct slugs are chosen they are awesome i removed my loading gate and my slugs fit snug and with the barrel and mag correctly lined they are for me as good as it gets, Im surprised there not more popular
 
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