PCP myths, truths and lies

[blackdiesel]

I learned a long time ago it's the shooter and not the gun. I shoot pretty much the same size groups whether I'm shooting my FXs, RAWs, EDguns, Hatsans, Brococks, Daystates or Krals. The good stuff does make it easier to be consistent. Steve at AEAC proves it every time when he reviews a mid-priced gun and high-end gun. Even though he gushes over the fit and finish of the high priced guns, his groups are pretty similar for all the PCPs he reviews.

 

[JCD]

Agree for the most part, if you receive a good shooting gun... A couple of those you mentioned have earned their mid/low price (ie not as good) reputation for a variety of reasons. But still none are ever perfect. Just the odds of getting a better shooting gun are higher with some guns vs others. But the bigger one for me when I'm shopping... really is fit/finish/feel there is no comparison between a couple of those and a couple others, even if it just comes down to how I feel when shooting it. No dig, but a Hatsan in my hands does not provide the same enjoyment as say an FX (or at least some of them). Still doesn't mean results on target would be better. 

Kinda like buy a car, they all do the same thing. Depends what the buyer values most (or is limited by).

 

[JW652]

The main difference is not how they shoot new, but, rather, repair records and how long they will last. Until the new crop has withstood ( or not ) the test of time, we won't know.

 

[mtnGhost]

@blackdiesel - there’s truth to that statement, I would only add that in my experience thus far this is true asserting the barrel lengths are within the same ballpark - IF the notion is that they all shoot the same at something like 100y. 

The other day edosan thought I was joking when I said his initial 150y slug groups out of his MK2 looked like my 18gr groups at 150 out of my Leshiy. Fact is, I have shot close to if not more than 15K pellets out of it, I know how (and when) it can shoot those groups, but it’s a “75y” gun in my book due to the shorter barrel.

 

[DeutschKSK]

I’ve owned a Redwolf, RAW HM1000x, S410, and a ton of other good rifles and they all shot the same.. my first pcp was a marauder and it didn’t shoot good past 60 yards or so. 

 

[stoti]

Yes and no.... the shooter is an extremely important factor, definitely a huge piece in the accuracy puzzle and there are many guns, at almost every price point that are capable of astounding accuracy. 

In most cases, not all, what you get with the more expensive guns, besides sublime fit and finish, is that extra bit of consistency, tune-ability and the extreme accuracy so many of us are searching for. We’ve all had expensive guns that don’t meet our expectations and cheap guns that surpass them. What I’m talking about here are the expensive air guns that shoot 3/8”, 5 shot groups at 50yds vs. a less expensive gun that’s capable of 5/8” groups at 50yds. Or, expensive guns that shoot .775” groups at 100yds with slugs vs. a less expensive gun that’s not anywhere that capable, maybe 3” at best. Or expensive air guns that you can tune with a computer or by using the HS preload, HS dial, regulator or the valve adjustment vs. a less expensive gun that has one transfer port adjustment. 

I’m not arguing that the shooter’s ability is of utmost importance, I’m just saying that when it comes to extremely long range shooting or competitions, where 1/8” can be the difference between winning and losing, the extra amount you are willing to pay for an expensive air gun can make a difference.

Some people are not willing to pay for that extra 1/8” of accuracy, some are more than happy to and still others simply think it’s ludicrous to spend that kind of money on an air gun. To each his own. Buy what you can afford and what makes you happy! I’m OCD and am not happy until I know the gun I’m shooting is capable of shooting better than me. I also get excited by a well made, extremely accurate gun that is beautiful, sexy and feels great to hold!

Stoti

 

[blackdiesel]

I’ve owned a Redwolf, RAW HM1000x, S410, and a ton of other good rifles and they all shot the same.. my first pcp was a marauder and it didn’t shoot good past 60 yards or so. 

Was it a 25 cal with the Green Mountain barrel? I'm willing to bet money that if you get another Mrod now that you are versed in shooting PCPs you will find it just as accurate as the high end guns. I have a couple of modded Hatsan Novas that makes me smile everytime I shoot it.

 

[DeutschKSK]

It was a stock .22 marauder when they first came out years ago. It was a great starter rifle, I later put a gaska barrel on her and she shot great. But from a stock rifle it was so, so. 

Great rifles, just needs a little love! I’d imagine the newer models with LW barrels shoot great. 

Matt

 

[PerkyVal]

My experience doesnt support that entirely.

I had a .25 gen 2 Marauder that I had invested in a Hillair kit, fancy laminate stock, Hawke Sidewinder. Shot many thousands of rounds tuning it. It was accurate enough for hunting, but I wanted more. I bought a .25 Crown and the very first mag I shot for groups, after sighting it in resulted in half the group size with twice as many pellets in that group.

I would agree that rifles in the same "class" probably shoot close to the same, but you just cannot make a $500 gun shoot like a $2000 gun. I tried.

 

[Saltlake58]

My own experience is that the gun is a full partner in the shooting. If the gun can't shoot straight or consistently, the shooter can't either. Same other way round. I have a Marauder and an Impact. Marauder is great to a point, but there's no way I can shoot the same groups with a Marauder as the Impact at 75 yards or further out. The adage that you can't make a $500 gun shoot like a $2000 gun is largely true. So much so, I've de-tuned the Marauder so it's a good 50 yard gun and quit trying longer distances with it. just not worth the time and effort.

I can buy a cheap hand drill and try to drill vertical holes at 90 degrees to the board. Or, I can use a drill press. Which do you think will do a better job? Same for guns. Right gun for the intended purpose.

 

[elh0102]

With air rifles, where ignition and the other cartridge variables are not present, and assuming good pellets and consistent air, it's all in the barrel. Put the same barrel on a crappy rifle and a high end rifle, lock them both in a fixture, and the groups will be comparable. Problem is, most crappy rifles are extremely hard to shoot well, not to mention maintenance issues. The way I see it, you can spend the money and enjoy shooting well, or, save money on the rifle and be frustrated in trying to shoot well. 

 

[bubblerboy64]

Not mentioned is a good trigger. The cheap guns typically have terrible triggers. Mid priced guns can have decent or at least triggers that can be made decent. Once you cross a certain price point it’s fit finish and refinement. I like nice guns and my shooting abilities don’t justify what I’ve invested but it’s nice to know that I can count on the rifle if not the guy behind the scope. Sight picture and trigger control. Isn’t that the basis for accuracy? 

 

[blackdiesel]

I say again - look at the various reviews on AEAC and Shooter 1721 then compare the accuracy. Once a shooter learns a gun's nuances the shooter should be able to place the pellet on target. Of course, this depends on the gun working properly and having no malfunctions.

 

[tor47]

Well, if one shoot of a bench, it is the bench, and the gun, not the shooter. The shooter would wave to much around without the bench

 

[blackdiesel]

Don't get me wrong I like high-end PCPs and have a few. But I remember as a kid we didn't have any fancy bb/pellet guns. I had a Daisy 880 (I think) with open sights and any squirrel or rabbit that got within 25 - 30 yards were dead meat almost every time.

 

[rwsmike]

I really agree from what I have seen...at 100 yards your floating a pellet with a huge drop . I never have used any bigger ags than 25 so maybe better with a 30 cal. 

.

 

[oldsparky]

I like nice stuff. Most more expensive guns look finished. However I have been having fun playing with inexpensive pistols. I have a FAS 6004. It will shoot with the best. Then I picked up a crosman 1701 that pistol will shoot good groups. This afternoon out shooting targets when I see a cottontail that has been knocking over my wife corn plants. One shot, he won’t be knocking over any more corn. Grips will move a little it feels cheap to me. But it is defiantly a neat little pistol to play with. I ask myself this question today out shooting the 1701 should I have one 2000 dollar pistol or a half dozen to play around with.

 

[T3PRanch]

I can take any PCP I own and hit a Turtles head at 50 yards with minimal rest available (tree limb, stump or knee). Good enough for my needs whether cost is $300 or $2000.

 

[OscarDawg]

The most accurate gun I own is a tricked out SPA P12 and yes i own quite a few high end guns including the $2000 impact. If there is no wind my p12 with jsb 18gr doesn't miss. I went 7 for 7 on starlings one evening at 120-135 yards.

 

[kkarmical]

Airguns to me are real similar to golf. Many people are constantly looking for that magic driver or special putter that is supposed to take strokes off their game.

Just like many an airgunner keeps on buying better and better guns and scopes trying to shrink their groups at 100yrds+, it becomes an obsession.

I personally shoot airguns for the enjoyment of shooting airguns, and the critters I knock off can't seem to tell if they're being hit by a Mrod or an Impact, spotted by a centrepoint scope from wallyworld, or a hawke.

High end airguns have better materials and are put together by professionals that really stand behind their products. But no amount of money paid for a gun will make a subpar shooter into an expert. If that's the case then why doesn't everyone that owns a impact shoot against the best and prove their skills, instead of posting online forums and bragging about groups.

Price paid doesn't replace practice with, and it may take 5000+ pellets to understand that mrod vs 100 slugs used to dial in that RAW, I'd have more fun shooting 5000 pellets and figuring out a way to make them effective, rather than just write a check.

Just like anyone with $80K and go out and buy a Hellcat, doesn't turn them into a racing phenom, they can just go faster than the guy driving a Honda that's all.