Pellet selection for tuning

[6gun]

I really want a professional to tune my AA s510 to shoot 25 gr pellets, but I'm scared of shipping it. UPS has broken things before.

Looking up some cursory info on your gun. There's nothing but the transfer port to adjust other than full spring swaps. So my best advice is shoot the 25 gr pellet you would like to use, with the transfer wide open over the chrono. You can even shoot a group at this time to see what potential it shows. If its shooting 950 fps for example, I would close your transfer port very gradually and watch the groupings and how they correlate to speed. I'm not giving a concrete number to you, but in my environment 865 was as fast as I could go before my new short barrel 25 cal got too noisey and wasteful, so 865 it stayed and im able to put kings thru any pellet hole on the target at will or shoot 100 yards.

Your gun has the tuning provisions of my aea hp and that's how I tuned mine down for precision and quality of shooting experience. It also looks like you can aftermarket regulate your gun which would be a game changer for consistency.

I do NOT claim to be an expert or that my way is superior, it just works for me and my pals. I get to mess with a lot of different air guns in a lot of different states of tune and make parts for people, so I'm only passing along the knowledge that I've acquired along the way. As I said, im happy to help where I can and people are more than welcome to dm me if they'd like my perspective on something. If i dont know or feel it could cost you a mi$take I WILL SPEAK UP. Best of luck, and I don't think you should pay somebody to turn your transfer port and tell you it's tuned.

-rob- (another one)

Edit, if your un is powder burnt we may speak some of the same language and I can explain it in reloading terms too

 

[PowderBurnt]

Looking up some cursory info on your gun. There's nothing but the transfer port to adjust other than full spring swaps. So my best advice is shoot the 25 gr pellet you would like to use, with the transfer wide open over the chrono. You can even shoot a group at this time to see what potential it shows. If its shooting 950 fps for example, I would close your transfer port very gradually and watch the groupings and how they correlate to speed. I'm not giving a concrete number to you, but in my environment 865 was as fast as I could go before my new short barrel 25 cal got too noisey and wasteful, so 865 it stayed and im able to put kings thru any pellet hole on the target at will or shoot 100 yards.

Your gun has the tuning provisions of my aea hp and that's how I tuned mine down for precision and quality of shooting experience. It also looks like you can aftermarket regulate your gun which would be a game changer for consistency.

I do NOT claim to be an expert or that my way is superior, it just works for me and my pals. I get to mess with a lot of different air guns in a lot of different states of tune and make parts for people, so I'm only passing along the knowledge that I've acquired along the way. As I said, im happy to help where I can and people are more than welcome to dm me if they'd like my perspective on something. If i dont know or feel it could cost you a mi$take I WILL SPEAK UP. Best of luck, and I don't think you should pay somebody to turn your transfer port and tell you it's tuned.

-rob- (another one)

Edit, if your un is powder burnt we may speak some of the same language and I can explain it in reloading terms too

Good info. Thank. My name is in reference to my early FPS gaming days. Always got my butt kicked.

 

[Motorhead]

Test for ACCURACY first & once finding a pellet barrel likes and fits what style pellet you wishing to shoot .... Tune speed/s and further accuracy test via CHRONY confirmation after that.

 

[6gun]

Test for ACCURACY first & once finding a pellet barrel likes and fits what style pellet you wishing to shoot .... Tune speed/s and further accuracy test via CHRONY confirmation after that.

I recommend this method as well. Marrying yourself to one projectile, untested, is usually counter productive for me.

If you want to get into the weeds-

The weight is 1 factor, the general construction of a pellet changes stuff too(thick or thin skirt, bearing surface touching the bore causing drag, bore fit, and alloy hardness vs choke). Then theres the Lego gun variables that are for another time

 

[Bedrock Bob]

The most accurate pellets I've found are within the appropriate weight range for my gun. Any brand within that weight range shoots better than any brand thats too heavy or light.

The brands that shoot best for me are H&N and JSB. But the Crosmans do whatever I need them to do. Norma golden trophy shoots good. FX shoot good.

If your shooting paper for accuracy a better pellet matters. If your plinking it dosent. I see no difference in my accuracy with Crosmans versus JSB in that scenario. Even shooting paper the difference is not much. They will both consistently hit a shotgun shell at 50 yards out of any gun i own.

My shooting makes a much bigger difference in my hit ratio than the pellets do. When I can shoot better than a $7 tin of crosmans I'll start buying a more accurate pellet. Unless I'm rested on a bag with a scope shooting at paper there is virtually no difference between them.

All my springers shoot Crosmans just fine. If you sorted them by weight and diameter I think they would shoot as well as any of them. And in my limited experience the proper weight pellet makes more difference than the specific brand in a springer.

A PCP is probably a completely different story...

 

[6gun]

The most accurate pellets I've found are within the appropriate weight range for my gun. Any brand within that weight range shoots better than any brand thats too heavy or light.

The brands that shoot best for me are H&N and JSB. But the Crosmans do whatever I need them to do. Norma golden trophy shoots good. FX shoot good.

If your shooting paper for accuracy a better pellet matters. If your plinking it dosent. I see no difference in my accuracy with Crosmans versus JSB in that scenario. Even shooting paper the difference is not much. They will both consistently hit a shotgun shell at 50 yards out of any gun i own.

My shooting makes a much bigger difference in my hit ratio than the pellets do. When I can shoot better than a $7 tin of crosmans I'll start buying a more accurate pellet. Unless I'm rested on a bag with a scope shooting at paper there is virtually no difference between them.

All my springers shoot Crosmans just fine. If you sorted them by weight and diameter I think they would shoot as well as any of them. And in my limited experience the proper weight pellet makes more difference than the specific brand in a springer.

A PCP is probably a completely different story...

I agree with you on most all of that for physics reasons. The very important point I neglected to address, you brought up. Intended use and range. Not everybody is trying to do what I am trying to do and I forget that regularly.

 

[Bedrock Bob]

I agree with you on most all of that for physics reasons. The very important point I neglected to address, you brought up. Intended use and range. Not everybody is trying to do what I am trying to do and I forget that regularly.

In a firearm shooting extreme range your projectile is really important. Cheap bullets just won't cut it. Anything works at 100 yards. The difference between a Berger VLD and a Speer bulk bullet is VAST at 500 yards.

I think it's the same with pellets only moreso. The biggest differences I see in pellets isn't group size but the range they start flying out of pattern (1 inch). The JSB pellets are longer and they seem to hang in there farther. They probably are less accurate than the H&N at 25 yards. But are more accurate at 65. Past 40 the crosmans will scatter a bit. Still 2 out of 3 go where they are supposed to.

Pellets suck at range. They are designed to shoot about 50 yards. They all do that fairly well. Past that point my solution is not a more expensive pellet. It's a bigger target. That works for how I shoot. Others may demand much more accuracy than that.

 

[6gun]

In a firearm shooting extreme range your projectile is really important. Cheap bullets just won't cut it. Anything works at 100 yards. The difference between a Berger VLD and a Speer bulk bullet is VAST at 500 yards.

I think it's the same with pellets only moreso. The biggest differences I see in pellets isn't group size but the range they start flying out of pattern (1 inch). The JSB pellets are longer and they seem to hang in there farther. They probably are less accurate than the H&N at 25 yards. But are more accurate at 65. Past 40 the crosmans will scatter a bit. Still 2 out of 3 go where they are supposed to.

Pellets suck at range. They are designed to shoot about 50 yards. They all do that fairly well. Past that point my solution is not a more expensive pellet. It's a bigger target. That works for how I shoot. Others may demand much more accuracy than that.

I came from friendly club competitions in rimfire and moving target centerfire 20 years ago. My general wishes these days are 100 yards+ with air rifles, and anything inside 100 id like to be hitting the 209 primer only. So ive got a slug shooter in 22 and a pellet shooter in 25 I lean on for precision and being the best machine I can afford to tune up. My others are for fun an hunting. The slug gun isnt as good as the pellet shooter yet.

This is where I forget to slow my roll, not everybody is incessantly tinkering to improve arguably trivial aspects of their airgun and skills. Every little trivial step forward is progress to me tho. For what purpose, im not sure. It's been a master course in re tuning an fx impact every week when I change stuff tho im the guy that cast bullets and hand loaded everything and tightened up headspace on a 1022, that compulsion.

 

[Bedrock Bob]

I came from friendly club competitions in rimfire and moving target centerfire 20 years ago. My general wishes these days are 100 yards+ with air rifles, and anything inside 100 id like to be hitting the 209 primer only. So ive got a slug shooter in 22 and a pellet shooter in 25 I lean on for precision and being the best machine I can afford to tune up. My others are for fun an hunting. The slug gun isnt as good as the pellet shooter yet.

This is where I forget to slow my roll, not everybody is incessantly tinkering to improve arguably trivial aspects of their airgun and skills. Every little trivial step forward is progress to me tho. For what purpose, im not sure. It's been a master course in re tuning an fx impact every week when I change stuff tho im the guy that cast bullets and hand loaded everything and tightened up headspace on a 1022, that compulsion.

I hear you brother. I fiddled with precision firearms for years. Every detail was an obsession. It still is.

The pellet gun set me free from all that. I'm not obligated to precision when shooting it. I shoot offhand open sights from 80 yards and under and work on the rifleman rather than the rifle.

I still obsess about details like foot positioning, trigger timing and sight picture but precision is not an objective. Only accuracy. It's a relief not having to deal with it.

I honestly don't care how big the spread is as long as the rifle shoots better than I do and the target is sized/ranged within the rifles capability. A good rifle with cheap pellets will shoot better than I can unless I'm rested with a scope. As long as I am the weak link in the chain the Crosmans will be plopping in the dirt.

 

[6gun]

I hear you brother. I fiddled with precision firearms for years. Every detail was an obsession. It still is.

The pellet gun set me free from all that. I'm not obligated to precision when shooting it. I shoot offhand open sights from 80 yards and under and work on the rifleman rather than the rifle.

I still obsess about details like foot positioning, trigger timing and sight picture but pinpoint accuracy is not an objective. It's a relief not having to deal with it.

I honestly don't care how big the spread is as long as the rifle shoots better than I do and the target is sized/ranged within the rifles capability. A good rifle with cheap pellets will shoot better than I can unless I'm rested with a scope. As long as I am the weak link in the chain the Crosmans will be plopping in the dirt.

I'm keeping some crosman pistols and cphp for just that reason.

 

[Trucker3573]

The notos isn’t exactly a tuners dream. Most don’t want to tear apart a gun to adjust the reg. Given the power level I would stick with 15.89 and under in weight. JSB would be a great start in 14 gr and 16 gr. Basically saying don’t get too worried. I bet you will find both shoot great. Probably will with the gun right out of the box not touching anything.

 

[6gun]

Just playing around with some concepts discussed here before I start work this morning. My dreamline doesn't seem to care too much about pellet profile or make. It shoots jsb the best, but it's shooting h&n silver bears/polymags/king heavies lights out. It even shoots some trash eunjin 35. 8 gr well enough and the 43. 2 even better that don't fit the magazine. So i suppose find the weight range that gives you the trajectory(velocity) you want and find the shape/construction that offers the most precision at that gun tune? If you want the ez way.... Find the weight range and hover around there.

 

[JimD]

I do not own a Zelos but I have 3 P35s which are also made by SPA. I test new guns to see what weight pellet will fly 800 to 900 fps with the hammer spring at 3 to 5 % under peak velocity. If that pellet weight is OK for what I want to do with the gun I don't initially tweak the regulator. I test pellets of similar weight from multiple suppliers. My P35s have all come tuned for heavy for caliber pellets except the 25 which likes 34 grains but couldn't shoot them very fast without an after market plenum. Anyway, my guess is you should start with 18 grain pellets and you may want 21 grain H&Ns and 25 grain JSB, possibly. If the velocity is OK with the 18s but the accuracy is not try another vendors 18. My Caiman prefers H&N 18s but my P35-22 likes 21 grain Baracuda Match much better. The Caiman is better designed for even a 25 grain pellet but it does not like them. I've tried retuning a gun to like a pellet but it didn't work for me. What Scott said is right IMHO. Find a pellet then try fine tuning the tune for a little more accuracy. Two of my 3 P35s prefer H&N baracuda march pellets but the 25 likes JSBs. I've tested other brands but no others have been the best in my 6 guns.