Pursuit of sub MOA

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Max115

Max115

Member
Jul 15, 2018
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BC, Canada
How many of you have tried to shoot sub MOA out to 100 yards? Success or failure?

For me, it wasn't easy and I am continuing to chase and get more sub MOA results with my FX Impact MK2 shooting the H&N 23gr slugs.

In this video I attempted to do just that. Obviously I failed miserably and got more fails and success. I have done so in the past and I would like to be more consistent and hit more of these tighter groups. However, it was super windy when I did this shoot but no excuses. I just wasn't too great at estimating and allowing for the windage.

Paper punching was boring so I tapped a tin can at 125 and 150 yards just to have some fun.
I ended my day and dropped a few starlings on the way home at another location.

Enjoy.

 
I shoot only standard power rifles, with pellets, and I normally shoot only out to 50 yards. Under good conditions, I have several rifles that will average very close to MOA. I might put 4 into .3", and one that opens it to over .5".
I don't shoot at 100 yards, but I've shot enough beyond 50 to have an opinion. I think 1" groups at 100 yards with a standard power rifle shooting pellets is excellent, and exceptional. I know there are reports by folks who say they do it routinely, and maybe they do.....maybe.
 
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@Max115 I haven’t tried. I just can’t seem to bring myself to sit down and shoot too often. 😅😅I try to practice from positions and setups that I would use while hunting. I just want my shots to drop my quarry. The first shot is most important to me. If I have to shoot an animal more that twice I consider that a bad harvest. When I target-shoot out to 100 yards I’m standing behind a tripod. I’ve only shot one 5-shot group with my Evol .30 that I was pleased with. I do admire competitive precision BR shooters who have the technique and discipline to shoot accurate and precise groups.
 
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Glem.Chally said:
When I first got my Royale I went to the poco range pretty often and yeah definitely got some sub-moa groups at 100m. My best ever was a 5 shot .643 at 100m with pellets lots of groups less than an inch. I enjoy punching paper.
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Yes, the Royale is an anachronism in today's adjustment-and-gimmick rich air rifle market. It is (relatively) affordable, simple, accurate, reliable. Other than replacing the original regulator that didn't work so well, I haven't touched mine in 5 years (except for rarely cleaning the barrel, which it really needed only one time, and replacing one breech seal). I wish that FX hadn't chosen its current path, but I'm glad they have kept the Royale/Boss platform in production.
 
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@Max115 Are you usually seated at a table when shooting starlings? The shot on the can with the blue tape appeared as if you shot into somewhat of a diagonal headwind. At least that’s how I recall it after watching your wind flag. That may have been a factor in hitting the bottom of the can when your POA was towards the top. Shooting diabolo pellets I have noticed a significant downward push on heavier pellets when shooting into a headwind around 4-6 mph within 50-60 yards. It’s even more pronounced at 100 yards. I’ve seen it in heavy pellets in .25 (34 grain) and lighter pellets in .30. (44 grain). I can’t speak on how wind affects slugs as confidently because I shoot pellets a lot more frequently.
 
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I recently acquired a new to me Royale in .22 and have made a few attempts at 100 yards. Even an almost undetectable breeze will push the pellet an inch or more from the POA.
So Far this is the closest I've gotten.
20220731_072412_resized.jpg
 
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@Ezana4CE. That depends if the starlings landed in the area where I was sitting on my table. Otherwise I would be either using my tripod shooting sticks or using objects around the farm as a brace.

I am still trying to understand how the wind direction would alter the path of the slug/pellet. I found a Wind Drift Chart on line and using this shot that you described where I aim high on the top portion of the tin and the impact was at the bottom. Would that be an " 10 or 11 o'clock" wind? or just a "12 o'clock" head wind? Based on the chart, there wasn't any low left POI with any wind direction which I find strange. Unless I am not reading this chart correctly.

wind drift chart.JPG
 
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Max115 said:
@Ezana4CE. That depends if the starlings landed in the area where I was sitting on my table. Otherwise I would be either using my tripod shooting sticks or using objects around the farm as a brace.

I am still trying to understand how the wind direction would alter the path of the slug/pellet. I found a Wind Drift Chart on line and using this shot that you described where I aim high on the top portion of the tin and the impact was at the bottom. Would that be an " 10 or 11 o'clock" wind? or just a "12 o'clock" head wind? Based on the chart, there wasn't any low left POI with any wind direction which I find strange. Unless I am not reading this chart correctly.

View attachment 281689
Click to expand...
This is for bullets or slugs. Pellets are the opposite...
 
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Max115 said:
@Ezana4CE. That depends if the starlings landed in the area where I was sitting on my table. Otherwise I would be either using my tripod shooting sticks or using objects around the farm as a brace.

I am still trying to understand how the wind direction would alter the path of the slug/pellet. I found a Wind Drift Chart on line and using this shot that you described where I aim high on the top portion of the tin and the impact was at the bottom. Would that be an " 10 or 11 o'clock" wind? or just a "12 o'clock" head wind? Based on the chart, there wasn't any low left POI with any wind direction which I find strange. Unless I am not reading this chart correctly.

View attachment 281689
Click to expand...
@Max115 I’ve seen this chart before and I honestly don’t quite understand wind all that well. To me the tell tale here would be how the previous and subsequent shots hit your target under similar conditions. Good thing you have video to review the shots. There should be a noticeable pattern in the way the projectiles are affected by the wind. At least this way of thinking is how I approach reading wind. I’m still learning myself. For me the challenge is in understanding that wind can and does switch directions. It can also blow in different directions at different points in the projectile’s path at longer distances. Keep in mind I’m an amateur here. Some of these bench rest guys can teach both of us some things. And just as I am composing this response @Centercut chimes in. He’s one to listen to for advice in this area.

I can say this. I was out at 55 yards on Saturday shooting 33.95 grain JSB King Heavy .25 diabolo pellets from a Brocock Bantam a sniper HR. I encountered a similar type of diagonal headwind. When it first started my shots started hitting low. The first thing I did was check my manometer to be sure I hadn’t fallen off the reg. When I saw that my reservoir pressure was fine, I shot and hit low again. Then I check the string on the end of my moderator saw it’s direction then used my kestrel to gather info on wind speed at the muzzle. It read 3.5-5 mph gusts. I then held over 0.5 MOA and that brought up my POI to an acceptable point. Remember that this is a diagonal headwind. I was shooting west to east and the wind was blowing southeast to northwest. My pellet wasn’t affected too bad on the horizontal axis. When winds got up around 6 mph they felt stronger on my body so I tried to hold right (south) slightly and three shots landed to the right. I’m pretty confident that wasn’t on me because I tend to pull the gun left causing a POI shift to the left. What I concluded was that I was overcompensating for the wind and I stopped holding for windage. Then my shots consistently hit closer to my POA. I was shooting from a standing position behind a tripod with a ball head that I keep loose in order to pan freely.
 
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@Ezana4CE. Thank you for the link to HAM. Lots of great information there. But confusing as heck, lol. These theories proved to me that we can never get it right with the wind call from our perspective and assumptions. Too many variables to consider. I guess for me to increase my odds is to correct the POA if I get a follow up shot with the missed. Still a 50/50 percent chance at any given day with tagging the target at long ranges in the wind. I will keep on sending projectiles downrange if the target stays put long enough. Cheers.
 
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@Max115 It certainly isn’t simple. I try to focus on what I can observe and understand. In time we will learn more. I think it’s fun just experimenting with target practice and learning. It’s a hobby for me. I wish I knew more to share with you. Keep at it. It seems you’ve been doing pretty well from what I’ve seen. I appreciate you sharing with us.
 
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In an average day = not picking good days or bad days - shooting at 100 meters, rings and not dots, 10x 5 shots groups, my average is about 1.5 MOA. This means the group size is 1.5" and not all the holes are inside rings. Yes, occasionally I am getting sub MOA inside rings, but that still cannot fix the average.
I am Not happy with my scoring, but obviously I am not reading the wind yet.
I was planning last year to extend to 150 and 200 meters, my Impact would be very capable to play that game, but I am not ready.
 
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@Ezana4CE. Yes we are all learning each and every day. The more we understand our gear and how things work, the more fun it will be to shoot our air guns whether it is paper punching or starlings popping, lol. As for me, I want to shoot tighter groups which would translate into more pests getting tagged when I am out in the farms having fun.

@bigHUN. We can only try to push our limits and pursuit the elusive sub MOA pass 100 yards. The reward is seeing the shots land where it is intended to be. Have fun and continue to chase that tight group(s). Cheers.
 
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