Tuning RAW HM1000xLRT Pellet Proble

[bucketboy]

Best you solicit your proboscis to Air Force and retire... At least swap your idea for a new HM1000X of your choice...

Ha ha, I wish 


Bb

 

[nomojo65]

Edit

 

[SpiralGroove]

Here is the pellet probe on the New RAW HM1000xLRT I received on October 6th, 2020. Air Force has changed the probe system. What's pictured is all you get...

 

[nomojo65]

Edit

 

[bucketboy]

Can I ask what I’m mission here? I’ve owned two hmX RAW’s and the two grub screws in the large black sleeve just retract the the main probe or outer larger sealing portion of the of the probe via the rear flange Those grub screw’s should not even contact the probe! The larger single grub screw on the threaded portion of the probe is to allow for adjustment And locking of the seal tension between probe and barrel when side lever is cammed over, the inner pin probe seats the pellet past the transfer port, now with the spring removed from the pin probe that sets between the sealing probe and large flange Of pin probe would mean the pin probe would not retract into sealing probe which is not Necessary for the function of this design, as long as the pin probe Not Retracting doesn’t hamper the indexing of the next pellet in the magazine all is good? Now the pin or seating portion may appear to be out of alignment because now there is no tension on it but will center itself as it moves forward (if I totally misunderstood this design than apologize for this long response)

Exactly, it works without the spring but it’s all floppy and doesn’t align properly, it operates so much smoother with a 10c spring than without !



Bb

 

[SpiralGroove]

Hey Momojo65,

I don't want to sound like your English teacher, but could you please use periods or some punctuation between sentences. It's hard to read and understand a one sentence paragraph.

When I first received this gun the pellet probe functioned properly, albeit a little fussy. You had to retract the cocking lever completely (holding it) to get a magazine to load. Now, since I bumped the pellet probe loose, I'm trying to fix/re-center ... there is seeminly no way to support the pellet probe for smooth operation.

If I insert a spring behind the pellet probe, it becomes too long and the cocking lever cannot fully close. Right now, the solution is to heat the pellet probe (loosening the Loctite) and retracting the screw tip enough for closure (if possible). Still, there maybe some magazine interference with the probe?



This is seemingly the only Major issue, hard to fix on the new Air Force - RAW.

 

[bucketboy]

The spring doesn’t go behind the probes, it goes between the inner and outer, 



Bb

 

[SpiralGroove]

Hey Bb,

The problem now, there is no inner probe, just one probe. The old design had two probes and a spring between. This no longer exists.

 

[bucketboy]

Hey Bb,

The problem now, there is no inner probe, just one probe. The old design had two probes and a spring between. This no longer exists.

Well that’s a rubbish, the tip of the probe will try to drag the next pellet in the mag out backwards, I tried this years ago and it is still preferred probe for single loading but hopeless for mags. It begs the question, why isn’t it “fixed” in the bolt, it still moves back far enough to clear the mag

Bb

 

[SpiralGroove]

Hey Bb,

I feel were mis-communicating on this, it's probably my bad as I've only had the HM100x for 2 weeks.

Here is what the gun came with:

If You can explain to me, how to attach/fix the pellet probe system, so it consistently aligns with the bore and allows the Lever to completely cock ... I'm ALL Ears.

Thanks,

Kirk

 

[Odoyle]

NONE on my RAWS have that probe. It must be a brand new design (rather crappy one obviously) why don't you try totally removing both grubscrews and manually installing that probe and close the lever all the way as if loading a pellet then add both screws? You probably have to tighten them just by looking at that new design tighten each a little at a time alternating back and fourth to center the tension on both grubscrews.

 

[Odoyle]

I would also try to push that needle tip on a hard surface to see if it pushes in just don't bend or break it and stop if it doesn't give without bending it.

That inner needle part goes in and out on the older guns. Like anteater nose and tongue proboscis. Or uncircumcised... Never mind...

 

[SpiralGroove]

Hey Odoyle,

Please don't paint any pictures for me, but I'll try out your idea on the probe ...

Thanks

 

[Chuck-in-Ohio]

That is a 2 piece probe.



The inner pin probe part is jammed in the larger outer part. It probably got bent when you had your negligent discharge and is wedged in due to the pin probe being bent out of concentricity. 



Try what Odoyle recommended and you should be able to separate the pieces. You will possibly need to purchase a new inner probe.

 

[SpiralGroove]

Hey Chuck,

I hope you're right, it's to bad a HM100xLRT owner hasn't posted pics of an actual probe assembly?

Because I'm new to this gun and there is no schematic available ... I thought it was 1 piece? Yes, what you're suggesting maybe right on. My foolish discharge of the air from the plenum, with no barrel or bottle attached, may have blown the two probes together ... and they're simply stuck?

I will check tonight.

 

[SpiralGroove]

Hey Guys,

My probe IS made up of two pieces with a spring inside.

Sorry, I've completely missed the "boat" on this one...

I was able to push the tip out as the inner/outer bolts were seemingly fused together. Yes, the inner bolt is bent too. I straightened it on the lathe and got it to work. Just in case, I ordered another one from RAW.

Getting a little blow back upon firing from the bolt and will need to adjust it out.

I feel somewhat of an Azz for putting everyone through my ordeal ... but it's solved now .

Thanks for everyone's help,

Kirk

 

[Odoyle]

Send me 35 of that SSGs I'll pay for them just for my own personal Rapids and RAWs not for resale and don't need to copy your design unless I buy more RAWS or used Rapids (make it 50 just in case). 160+ shots eh? Send me a PM.

Never ever used anything like that in any of my Rapids and RAWs and just refill often as needed.

 

[bucketboy]

Hey Chuck,

I hope you're right, it's to bad a HM100xLRT owner hasn't posted pics of an actual probe assembly?

Because I'm new to this gun and there is no schematic available ... I thought it was 1 piece? Yes, what you're suggesting maybe right on. My foolish discharge of the air from the plenum, with no barrel or bottle attached, may have blown the two probes together ... and they're simply stuck?

I will check tonight

.

Do not dry fire the gun with no air in the system, it is likely to damage your firing valve, cause the hammer to override the trigger sear and clatter into to cocking dog pin....bad....bad....bad


Firing the gun with no barrel will not harm it in any way but will make your ears bleed.

You probe most likely got bent as you tried to pull out the magazine, ensure the cocking lever is fully back before talking out the mag.

you probe is now popping because the barrel is to far forwards, or you adjusted the out probe while freeing the inner probe or you have lost the belville compression washer that sits between inner and out probe. (It’s possible you never had one fitted) ignore the side grubscrew but it should look like this

Bb

 

[Chuck-in-Ohio]

I was thinking that the transfer port sleeve blowing out bent the tip of the pin probe. Refer back to page 1 where Spiral relates what happened uipon discharging the rifle with the barrel removed.

Of course I could be 180 degrees ass out on that assumption BB, you have dealt with more RAWs and Rapids than I have. 



Anyways, crisis averted and all appears to be well after some minor tweaking!

Good job all on working through the issue!

 

[bucketboy]

I was thinking that the transfer port sleeve blowing out bent the tip of the pin probe. Refer back to page 1 where Spiral relates what happened uipon discharging the rifle with the barrel removed.

Of course I could be 180 degrees ass out on that assumption BB, you have dealt with more RAWs and Rapids than I have. 



Anyways, crisis averted and all appears to be well after some minor tweaking!

Good job all on working through the issue!

Your correct, I missed the bit about the TP sleeve causing the damage. Personally, I don’t see the benefits, it is really difficult to get perfect transition from sleeve to barrel bore, this can and does cause the pellet to become damaged. I always remove the thimble from the TM and BM 1000, then machine the barrel with a new tp, I have always had an improvement in accuracy/ consistency.

Another thing that may seem counterintuitive, a slightly under sized barrel will seal better in the block than one made to a tighter fit. This is because the 3 barrel location screws push the barrel down when the barrel is under sized but just take up slack with a more tightly fitted barrel. Barrels are seldom 100% round, the bore in the block is almost never completely round.

if the pellet are spiralling I would check these in this order.

Mag not working correctly, hand load pellets into the breech to see what accuracy is like

Burr on the TP casing pellet damage, 

Probe not pushing the pellet completely past the TP

Poor crown

Speed too fast for lighter pellets or too slow for heavy pellets 





Bb