According to the state of California, everything is hazardous to our health. We are doomed.
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Real life lead poisoning from airgunning
- Thread starter TheShooter (aka Seeker)
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Until it hits him really hard. Laughing is a defense mechanism. It is hard to accept for that guy that he harmed himself. But facts are facts and the lab tests do not lie. Lead in his body does not care if he cares or not.
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Not the best take in a thread proposing harm reduction to mitigate effects from lead exposure that can have adverse effects on quality of life. We shoot airguns and the concentration / build up of lead particulate should not be swiftly dismissed due to California seeing, as you put, everything as hazardous. California's oversight may be extreme, but so are peoples interpretation of it. If California says this product MAY cause x,y,z...it's due to concentration levels, not just any exposure. Even water is dangerous at high levels of concentration, but that doesn't mean "since water can kill you in excess, why should I bother worrying about lead"...
-Matt
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Geesh some are being real %===D holes to the guy just trying to bring health awareness. I mean F a gun forum is a place the awareness is needed and if it isn’t important you don’t have to click. Sorry sometimes weird things just tick me off more than they should. Anyway Our local gun club has a very expensive air movement and filtration system on their indoor pistol range for this very reason. Some people shoot a lot so it is a true concern.
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On my pcp's they are an LDC, no matter the label that one puts on them. Does it have another function, sure; as does many thongs in life.
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If I were to purchase something to do something, I would like to know how effective it is at doing that something and for how long.
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Well said. I don’t understand the reason for all the Smart Azzed remarks in here.
He’s simply trying to enlighten those that may not be aware
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I'm terrified.
No wonder I'm so retarded, well not really that much but my friends would happily tend to agree that I am, lol. Yuh know it must be from scraping and grinding lead paint off houses in the 90's being a house painter as well as shooting guns for 50 years.
I wonder if I could get my lead levels up if I would qualify for disability, hmmm, grin. Then I could afford more lead for shooting airguns. Gosh what a viscous circle that would be
No wonder I'm so retarded, well not really that much but my friends would happily tend to agree that I am, lol. Yuh know it must be from scraping and grinding lead paint off houses in the 90's being a house painter as well as shooting guns for 50 years.
I wonder if I could get my lead levels up if I would qualify for disability, hmmm, grin. Then I could afford more lead for shooting airguns. Gosh what a viscous circle that would be
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It's a bunch of denial from guys who see the point but refuse to acknowledge it.
We have seen this same denial and heard these same excuses from the same guys during covid. They are the same guys that refuse to wear a hard hat, safety glasses and respirators on the job. They pretend that caring about hazards and addressing them are less masculine than their "devil may care" attitude.
It's an expression of fear. They deny the hazard instead of accepting it and addressing it. They belittle those who respond to a hazard because they can't bring themselves to act. It's human nature they simply can't control.
They would rather risk damaging their heath than admit their health could be damaged. It's classic denial in response to fear. Just like pretending to be asleep as a thief robs their house.
Common sense dictates that a person address potential hazards. If a person is too wrapped up in his masculinity to do that then he puts himself in a very vulnerable position.
I know a hundred men who insisted covid was a Chinese biological attack. Those same men refused to wear a mask in public. On one hand they believed that covid was a weapon unleashed by our enemies. On the other they refused to protect themselves from it. This is precisely the same scenario using precisely the same flawed logic.
You don't have to protect yourself from hazards if you feel like a sissy doing it. Just don't diminish others to compensate for your own insecurities.
If I shot inside I would definitely get some surface swabs to see if it was an issue. If it was an issue I would address it by cleaning up the area and changing my routine to make it safer. I'm secure enough in my manhood not to have to pretend the hazard does not exist.
We have seen this same denial and heard these same excuses from the same guys during covid. They are the same guys that refuse to wear a hard hat, safety glasses and respirators on the job. They pretend that caring about hazards and addressing them are less masculine than their "devil may care" attitude.
It's an expression of fear. They deny the hazard instead of accepting it and addressing it. They belittle those who respond to a hazard because they can't bring themselves to act. It's human nature they simply can't control.
They would rather risk damaging their heath than admit their health could be damaged. It's classic denial in response to fear. Just like pretending to be asleep as a thief robs their house.
Common sense dictates that a person address potential hazards. If a person is too wrapped up in his masculinity to do that then he puts himself in a very vulnerable position.
I know a hundred men who insisted covid was a Chinese biological attack. Those same men refused to wear a mask in public. On one hand they believed that covid was a weapon unleashed by our enemies. On the other they refused to protect themselves from it. This is precisely the same scenario using precisely the same flawed logic.
You don't have to protect yourself from hazards if you feel like a sissy doing it. Just don't diminish others to compensate for your own insecurities.
If I shot inside I would definitely get some surface swabs to see if it was an issue. If it was an issue I would address it by cleaning up the area and changing my routine to make it safer. I'm secure enough in my manhood not to have to pretend the hazard does not exist.
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- Is lead a neurotoxin? Yes.
- Is any exposure of lead 100% safe? No
Therefore, deduced from the above, its best to minimize exposure and take steps when possible to avoid exposure all together. We're all in the hobby together. Doesn't mean I suggest using latex gloves whenever handling lead, but handling its by-products produced by airguns, particulates...is where I absolutely recommend minimizing your exposure by using damp material to wipe/clean and if getting really down and dirty, gloves as well.
If you're old, and subjectively think, "I don't have enough time left on Earth for any of this to matter", that doesn't make your opinion valid, and it certainly doesn't contribute to the premise of this thread or the value of knowledge being shared.
"I've made it this far, why should I change what I do" is an easy scapegoat for taking steps towards harm reduction. It's like having hearing damage induced by shooting guns without protection, and saying, well heck with it, damage is already done, might as well keep on keeping on...doubling down causing further damage doesn't make you right, and it certainly only makes a fool to say "what good would using protection do for me now?". Sure, some damage is irreversible, but those harmful effects should be approached with the utmost caution even after life altering exposure has already occurred...
-Matt
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Lead, well the subject is appropo, allow me to drift the thread a touch. Back in the day the saying was, Do not Californicate Oregon. A dig of course toward all those Cali transplants. What is it about folks leaving a place, then trying to make their new place more like the place they hated and moved away from? California transplants did their darndest to get my trap club shut down. Hey dummy don't buy a house near a range that has been operating since 1952. Thanks to range protection laws their legal effort to shut down our club just cost them a bunch of money. Sore losers, their next tact was to go after the Lead. That cost us a few thousand bucks but again they were unsuccessful in their efforts to close our range. Be aware of people with money! It was all about the noise, never mind their real agenda. We air gunners mostly dodge those guys. Be aware concerns and complaints about Lead MAY have a hidden agenda. That is not the case with this thread at all.
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Our Place we bought has Train Tracks about an 1/8 the mile behind us. We were fully aware of what we purchased. We aren't calling the RR! LOL Then think of how many bought homes in an airports Flight Path and then tried to sue the airlines, LOL If you know the Hazard and don't change course, you accept it. That goes for everything in life.
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Well put Chief, I know we could be friends! Unfortunately the death of personal responsibility is getting closer each passing day. It is always someone else's fault. We shoot Sundays and Thursdays, care to bet what days the real estate agent did not show that property? We opened the rifle range to .50 BMG after spending a few thousand on the bullet trap. Some idiot non member put an AP round through it. The Californians got MORE noise for their money, perhaps as it should be.
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Those that are content to accept exposure should not minimize it to those who are not.
The whole point of the thread was to discuss the hazard. Not deny it or lobby others to accept it.
There is a whole chorus of guys that don't feel the topic is worth discussing yet insist on expressing their lack of concern. It's not about accepting the risk for themselves. It's about minimizing those who are trying to address it.
Breathe it in Chief! Thats your choice! Just don't rub on the guy who chooses not to!
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Been following this thread from the beginning. I shoot a lot indoors.
I think I'm going to test some of my surfaces and also get a lead test for myself - I'd like to be educated on my level of risk.
I think I'm going to test some of my surfaces and also get a lead test for myself - I'd like to be educated on my level of risk.
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Full stop with the conspiracies about "Doctors don't want you cured, a cured patient is a lost patient"...they cure cancer. Many other issues going untreated or uncured is what can kill a patient. Suggesting doctors have ulterior motives other than proper courses of treatment is obnoxious even if it were true with a percentage of doctors. Medicine is not an easy practice for any human to work within, with so many overlapping symptoms/conditions.
Great article on lead toxicity at depth.
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
Few worthy excerpts:
"Lead toxicity is an important environmental disease and its effects on the human body are devastating."
"Blood lead levels from 25 and 60 μg/dL give rise to neuropsychiatric effects such as delayed reaction times, irritability, and difficulty in concentrating, as well as slowed down motor nerve conduction and headache (Merill et al., 2007). Anaemia may appear at blood lead levels higher than 50 μg/dL (Merill et al., 2007). In adults, abdominal colic, involving paroxysms of pain, may appear at blood lead levels higher than 80 μg/dL (Kosnett, 2005). High blood lead levels which exceed 100 μg/dL cause very severe manifestations, like signs of encephalopathy (condition characterized by brain swelling) accompanied by increased pressure within the skull, delirium, coma, seizures, and headache (Henritig, 2006). However such manifestations appear in children at lead levels of 70 μg/dL and more.
Central nervous system and neuromuscular manifestations usually result from intense exposure, while gastrointestinal features usually result from exposure over longer periods (Brunton et al., 2007). Signs and symptoms of chronic exposure include loss of short-term memory or concentration, depression, nausea, abdominal pain, loss of coordination, and numbness and tingling in the extremities (Patrick, 2006). Fatigue, problems with sleep, headaches, stupor, slurred speech, and anaemia are also found in chronic lead poisoning (Pearce, 2007). Children with chronic poisoning generally show aggressive behaviour and refuse to play."
"The hippocampus is a part of the brain involved in learning and memory. The main reasons for lead interfering with learning particularly in children is that it damages the cells within the hippocampus. In rats exposed to lead, structural damage such as irregular nuclei and denaturation of myelin were reported (Mycyk et al., 2005)."
-Matt
Great article on lead toxicity at depth.
Lead toxicity: a review - PMC
Lead toxicity is an important environmental disease and its effects on the human body are devastating. There is almost no function in the human body which is not affected by lead toxicity. Though in countries like US and Canada the use of lead has ...
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov Few worthy excerpts:
"Lead toxicity is an important environmental disease and its effects on the human body are devastating."
"Blood lead levels from 25 and 60 μg/dL give rise to neuropsychiatric effects such as delayed reaction times, irritability, and difficulty in concentrating, as well as slowed down motor nerve conduction and headache (Merill et al., 2007). Anaemia may appear at blood lead levels higher than 50 μg/dL (Merill et al., 2007). In adults, abdominal colic, involving paroxysms of pain, may appear at blood lead levels higher than 80 μg/dL (Kosnett, 2005). High blood lead levels which exceed 100 μg/dL cause very severe manifestations, like signs of encephalopathy (condition characterized by brain swelling) accompanied by increased pressure within the skull, delirium, coma, seizures, and headache (Henritig, 2006). However such manifestations appear in children at lead levels of 70 μg/dL and more.
Central nervous system and neuromuscular manifestations usually result from intense exposure, while gastrointestinal features usually result from exposure over longer periods (Brunton et al., 2007). Signs and symptoms of chronic exposure include loss of short-term memory or concentration, depression, nausea, abdominal pain, loss of coordination, and numbness and tingling in the extremities (Patrick, 2006). Fatigue, problems with sleep, headaches, stupor, slurred speech, and anaemia are also found in chronic lead poisoning (Pearce, 2007). Children with chronic poisoning generally show aggressive behaviour and refuse to play."
"The hippocampus is a part of the brain involved in learning and memory. The main reasons for lead interfering with learning particularly in children is that it damages the cells within the hippocampus. In rats exposed to lead, structural damage such as irregular nuclei and denaturation of myelin were reported (Mycyk et al., 2005)."
-Matt
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Full stop with the conspiracies about "Doctors don't want you cured, a cured patient is a lost patient"...they cure cancer. Many other issues going untreated or uncured is what can kill a patient. Suggesting doctors have ulterior motives other than proper courses of treatment is obnoxious even if it were true with a percentage of doctors. Medicine is not an easy practice for any human to work within, with so many overlapping symptoms/conditions.
Great article on lead toxicity at depth.
Lead toxicity: a review - PMC
Lead toxicity is an important environmental disease and its effects on the human body are devastating. There is almost no function in the human body which is not affected by lead toxicity. Though in countries like US and Canada the use of lead has ...
Few worthy excerpts:
"Lead toxicity is an important environmental disease and its effects on the human body are devastating."
"Blood lead levels from 25 and 60 μg/dL give rise to neuropsychiatric effects such as delayed reaction times, irritability, and difficulty in concentrating, as well as slowed down motor nerve conduction and headache (Merill et al., 2007). Anaemia may appear at blood lead levels higher than 50 μg/dL (Merill et al., 2007). In adults, abdominal colic, involving paroxysms of pain, may appear at blood lead levels higher than 80 μg/dL (Kosnett, 2005). High blood lead levels which exceed 100 μg/dL cause very severe manifestations, like signs of encephalopathy (condition characterized by brain swelling) accompanied by increased pressure within the skull, delirium, coma, seizures, and headache (Henritig, 2006). However such manifestations appear in children at lead levels of 70 μg/dL and more.
Central nervous system and neuromuscular manifestations usually result from intense exposure, while gastrointestinal features usually result from exposure over longer periods (Brunton et al., 2007). Signs and symptoms of chronic exposure include loss of short-term memory or concentration, depression, nausea, abdominal pain, loss of coordination, and numbness and tingling in the extremities (Patrick, 2006). Fatigue, problems with sleep, headaches, stupor, slurred speech, and anaemia are also found in chronic lead poisoning (Pearce, 2007). Children with chronic poisoning generally show aggressive behaviour and refuse to play."
"The hippocampus is a part of the brain involved in learning and memory. The main reasons for lead interfering with learning particularly in children is that it damages the cells within the hippocampus. In rats exposed to lead, structural damage such as irregular nuclei and denaturation of myelin were reported (Mycyk et al., 2005)."
-Matt
Snorting springer dust will damage your hippocampus. Whoda thunk it?
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It's easy to be naive to the effects of over-exposure to lead, more-so if you've already been over-exposed.
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