Seeking Gun Suggestions and info

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Lost in the Redwoods

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Oct 31, 2023
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Los Gatos, CA, Santa Clara
Hi Airgun Nation community. I've been lurking here a while and gleaning lots of useful info, but have come to a point that I could use some pointed feedback.

My situation is that I live in a forest area on a couple acres with neighbors on similar sized lots. There are coyotes in the area becoming more aggressive. A few weeks ago 4 of my chickens become a coyote's lunch. Several neighbors cats have "disappeared". My dogs have had to square off against them a few times over the last couple years, and I have two small children that like to play outside. So...the coyotes have to go.

I live in California. There are lots of "rules" here about hunting and firearms in general. I was able to speak to the CA Dept of Fish and Wildlife whose local warden gave me permission to take the coyotes using methods ouside laws pertaining specifally to hunting, under certain conditions, and provided I follow some specific guidelines (my question below are with respect to these guidlines). Also, I am an experienced hunter, and have several cartridge rifles, but am not interested in shooting off a bullet in this neighborhood. It is rural but there are houses around and ricochets are a thing. So exploring modern airguns as a solution.

Separately, I also have rats and voles here that need constant population control. For those who don't know, a vole is like a gopher, but they tend to pop their heads up out of the holes a lot more often. I have a crossman springer pistol that's okay for this work, but less than ideal (slow, inaccurate).

I'm looking for a doubel duty gun: opportunistic coyote dispatching with frequest rodent control inbetween. In all liklihood the shot on the coyote would be made from around 30 yards. Rodents more like 10-20 yards.

So, seeking education and suggestions for a PCP rifle with the following characteristics:

  • Mag fed repeater (not single shot)
  • $1000-$1500 (or less of course).
    • Any suggestions for sites with used guns at descent prices?
  • This is the big one: Variable energy, ranging from high enough to drop a coyote to low enough to not go all the way through 3/4" plywood when ratting (with the right ammo). So a regulated gun, or a gun with very wide ranging hammer spring adjustments. Honestly, I imagine it will probably will need both features working together.
  • Ammo
    • For coyotes: Any suggestions for lead-free slugs/hybrids? Do they even exist? (I am aware of tin pellets).
    • For rodents: Any suggestions or general info around 'soft' lead pellets that deform on impact easily (reducing ricochet range) and will not blast right through the back of my barn's plywood walls at the gun's lower power tuning?
  • Caliber
    • Any well placed pellet caliber will dispatch a rat or vole. So, this is specifically around coyotes. I have read a lot of good advise around here discussing quickly killing coyotes with pellets, and fp/e suggestions at various ranges and calibers. I have also read a lot of virtue signalling condemnation of shooting a coyote with anything less than a 5.56 AR - please refrain from those comments here. These coyotes are a threat and will be treated as such. They will not be hunted or baited, but when they come onto this property they will be shot.
      • When suggesting guns, with respect to their power ranges, please consider if a .22 slug would be viable with headshot or if a .25 or .30+ is needed?
  • Handling
    • Will be shot off hand, and must handle accordingly. Ideally <7 lbs, must be <9 lbs. Compact, <30" (w/o moderator)
  • Reliable and easy maintenance (standard size screws, easy to source replacement grommets/gaskets, etc)
Reading and watching some vids, something like a compact Brocock Ghost in .22 or .25 would be ideal, except for its $2k+ asking price. Recent FX guns with their barrles that can shoot slugs and pellets may be a good fit, but have read they designed for bench shooting (somewhat fragile?) and have uncomfortably frequent quality issues out of the box. Taipan look to be of exceptional engineering and quality standards, but are they unregulated? How valiable is power control with their hammerspring adjustments?

Or am i chasing a unicorn and there is no single gun this versatile?
 
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I've taken 3 red fox at 50yds using a .25 Dreamline pushing the 25.39gr Kings to 47fpe. I know coyote are bigger than fox but I can't imagine that a .25 won't do the job especially if you're throwing the 34gr closer to 60fpe.

On top of your coyote issue, the .25 isn't too overkill for mice sized targets or squirrels, rabbits, groundhogs, etc. Its a very versatile caliber that gets the job done while maintaining a pretty decent shot count.
 
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A coyote is a dog. Don’t want to urinate on any parades here, but I would say a powder burner is your only ethical option. As much as I love air I’m not shooting anything bigger than a rabbit.
‘Kay, some guys are shooting huge calibres at huge power - well capable of taking down a hog, just not a sensible cost / performance ratio if you just want dead compared to a .22 LR.
 
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In all honesty your most ethical and effective solutions, in my opinion are something like a Gauntlet or a good break barrel for rodents and a 12 gauge with buck shot for coyotes. The shotgun makes a lot of noise but you don’t have as much problem with ricochet. It will dispatch the animal quickly. I have a Gauntlet in .25 and there is no doubt in my mind it will take out rodents at thirty yards. It does quite a number on unopened soft drink cans.

Rick H.
 
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EncoreUneFois said:
A coyote is a dog. Don’t want to urinate on any parades here, but I would say a powder burner is your only ethical option. As much as I love air I’m not shooting anything bigger than a rabbit.
‘Kay, some guys are shooting huge calibres at huge power - well capable of taking down a hog, just not a sensible cost / performance ratio if you just want dead compared to a .22 LR.
Click to expand...
I don't know man. My little .25 was passing straight through fox skulls. You can't get much more ethical than "dead before the body hit the floor". Even on something as big as a coyote, their skull isn't stopping a 34gr pellet at 875fps.

If OP is planning on heart/lung shots, stepping up to a 30 would probably be a better choice. he's very specifically saying rimfire is a no go and 30 is really starting to push rimfire power though.
 
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I like the Huben k1 .25 suggestion, although a tad outside your spending range, those can really put out some power when dialed up with a slug, and you'd have access to quick follow ups being its semi auto action is well made. Could be dialed up to 80+ fpe if I recall correctly with the right ammo/slugs, and then dialed down to 40-50 fpe for rodents.

Although ricochet is just as much an issue with a 100 fpe airgun as it would be with a 100 fpe .22lr, so that point is rather moot, you should be weary of anything in the background shooting high power slug no differently than you would .22lr's at around the same energy, or stick to pellets and keep power below 60-70 fpe, as they dissipate energy much faster than slugs over the same distance.

You'd be hard pressed to find a sub 30" airgun making gobs of power, but the k1 does come in at 32.4".

Best of luck on your search and reading upon all the recommendations.

-Matt
 
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dizzums said:
its an easy pick for me ... id use the benjamin bulldog with an atn xsight4k pro .. its alittle much for rodents but its accurate, ive blown a couple of rats in half with it .. you dont need to get special ammo for it, a standard pellet works fine .. distance id keep under 60, for rodents under 30 id say ..
Click to expand...
I like this suggestion,...the gun is a good gun, it can be had pretty cheap nowadays, no need special ammo the 44gr JSB will do.
 
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The animals you’re going after are very different. A 25 cal 60 FPE is good for the coyote. The rodents can be done with 10 FPE at 20 yards. Can one rifle do both, yeah, but I’d suggest two rifles. Or rifle and a Carbine.

Your size and price restrictions really narrow the field of what’s available. I have a compact bullpup, a Snowpeak P35, in stock form is putting out 47 fpe. It also groups Varmit Knocker 34gr slugs well.

Maybe the Stoeger Bullshark in 25 cal. It has a longer barrel than the P35 so you’ll be getting a little more FPE potential.
 
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I would go AGT Uragan 2 or V3 in .25 or .30. They don't externaly adjust. Reason I suggest this is the likely hood of getting a good one is very very high. They handle like a dream & can shoot slugs or pellets with accuracy out of the box. Shooting off hand I would put it in the lungs. I'm a bow hunter & have never taken a head shot in 45 years of doing it. I take that back.... I have shot 2 coyotes in the head with 125gr muzzy's. I don't like coyotes & really don't care how they die as long as they do. ...Call em or bait em if allowed & take care of them 1 by 1. also you can use 1913 ring sets with AGT. My Uragan .22 compact would kill a coyote without problem under 50 yards & also a dream to handle. anything over 50 I would go .25 or .30 & then max 100 yards for me
Some people in my area live trap them then kill em..whatever works for ya. Ghost will do what ya want as I had one in .30 but it's nice having a dedicated rig ready to go at all times for yotes.
Joe
 
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The two gun solution makes more sense here. Consider your POI at various ranges. You state the primary purpose will be rodents and you will have it dialed down for such... so what happens when a coyote presents itself? Will you have the time to go get your gun, make the necessary scope adjustments (and hope they are right)?

At the distance you are describing, most any decent PCP will do the trick on the coyotes. I would suggest .25 or .30. I assume you've taken into account a means to fill your PCP; you may as well invest in another gun to do the specific task of rodent removal. Something along the lines of a Notos would be great for in close pest removal and would set you back a couple hundred. Then have a dedicated gun for larger pests. Even keeping within your budget, this is entirely possible.

This comes up often where that folks want a small game/plinking/etc gun with the ability to nail the 'occasional' coyote. I've used the same justification myself. The reality is logistically, this is just not the best route to go. Get another gun.
 
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Lost in the Redwoods said:
Hi Airgun Nation community. I've been lurking here a while and gleaning lots of useful info, but have come to a point that I could use some pointed feedback.

My situation is that I live in a forest area on a couple acres with neighbors on similar sized lots. There are coyotes in the area becoming more aggressive. A few weeks ago 4 of my chickens become a coyote's lunch. Several neighbors cats have "disappeared". My dogs have had to square off against them a few times over the last couple years, and I have two small children that like to play outside. So...the coyotes have to go.

I live in California. There are lots of "rules" here about hunting and firearms in general. I was able to speak to the CA Dept of Fish and Wildlife whose local warden gave me permission to take the coyotes using methods ouside laws pertaining specifally to hunting, under certain conditions, and provided I follow some specific guidelines (my question below are with respect to these guidlines). Also, I am an experienced hunter, and have several cartridge rifles, but am not interested in shooting off a bullet in this neighborhood. It is rural but there are houses around and ricochets are a thing. So exploring modern airguns as a solution.

Separately, I also have rats and voles here that need constant population control. For those who don't know, a vole is like a gopher, but they tend to pop their heads up out of the holes a lot more often. I have a crossman springer pistol that's okay for this work, but less than ideal (slow, inaccurate).

I'm looking for a doubel duty gun: opportunistic coyote dispatching with frequest rodent control inbetween. In all liklihood the shot on the coyote would be made from around 30 yards. Rodents more like 10-20 yards.

So, seeking education and suggestions for a PCP rifle with the following characteristics:

  • Mag fed repeater (not single shot)
  • $1000-$1500 (or less of course).
    • Any suggestions for sites with used guns at descent prices?
  • This is the big one: Variable energy, ranging from high enough to drop a coyote to low enough to not go all the way through 3/4" plywood when ratting (with the right ammo). So a regulated gun, or a gun with very wide ranging hammer spring adjustments. Honestly, I imagine it will probably will need both features working together.
  • Ammo
    • For coyotes: Any suggestions for lead-free slugs/hybrids? Do they even exist? (I am aware of tin pellets).
    • For rodents: Any suggestions or general info around 'soft' lead pellets that deform on impact easily (reducing ricochet range) and will not blast right through the back of my barn's plywood walls at the gun's lower power tuning?
  • Caliber
    • Any well placed pellet caliber will dispatch a rat or vole. So, this is specifically around coyotes. I have read a lot of good advise around here discussing quickly killing coyotes with pellets, and fp/e suggestions at various ranges and calibers. I have also read a lot of virtue signalling condemnation of shooting a coyote with anything less than a 5.56 AR - please refrain from those comments here. These coyotes are a threat and will be treated as such. They will not be hunted or baited, but when they come onto this property they will be shot.
      • When suggesting guns, with respect to their power ranges, please consider if a .22 slug would be viable with headshot or if a .25 or .30+ is needed?
  • Handling
    • Will be shot off hand, and must handle accordingly. Ideally <7 lbs, must be <9 lbs. Compact, <30" (w/o moderator)
  • Reliable and easy maintenance (standard size screws, easy to source replacement grommets/gaskets, etc)
Reading and watching some vids, something like a compact Brocock Ghost in .22 or .25 would be ideal, except for its $2k+ asking price. Recent FX guns with their barrles that can shoot slugs and pellets may be a good fit, but have read they designed for bench shooting (somewhat fragile?) and have uncomfortably frequent quality issues out of the box. Taipan look to be of exceptional engineering and quality standards, but are they unregulated? How valiable is power control with their hammerspring adjustments?

Or am i chasing a unicorn and there is no single gun this versatile?
Click to expand...
For the coyotes, have you considered a Crossbow with a telescopic sight?

For the rats and voles (30-35 yards)....HW 50 or a R9. I would suggest 0.177 to keep the cost down and you get more pellet choices.
 
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Lost in the Redwoods, here is a scenario for you to think about.

You take your "double duty" airgun and set it up for the rats in the barn and you got a couple of them. You go back in the house and told the children to go out in the back yard because it is safe for them to do so because "Daddy got the rats".

A half hour later, you see the coyote and he's looking at the children. Are you going to fiddle around with your "double duty" airgun to bring up the power. He** no. You want to grab an airgun and shoot instead of fiddling around.

Your children are priceless. Spend the $$$$ and get a dedicated airgun that will take care of the coyote. A .25 cal. at 30-40 yards will do the trick.

For the rodents, a .117 cal., sub 12 fpe at 10-20 yards should be more than enough.

For recommending two airguns, I will leave that up to the many suggestions from the members here. Do your homework.

Take care, Bernie.
 
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