Slayer 357 Air Leak

[Moeibanez]

Hello All,

I have an air leak on my .357 Slayer. I’ve narrowed it down to the valve. It’s unfortunate that AAA is not respond to my request for parts after sending multiple emails over the past month. The manual and oring kit on AAA’s website has a different valve from mine. The valve on mine has two cup seals and no orings inside. We suspect the leak is coming from the sealing end of the Black rubber on the tip of the valve since we replaced all the orings twice already. I’m trying to get a new valve assembly and the cup seals but frustratingly have been unsuccessful getting a response from Tom.

Does anyone know where to get a replacement valve assembly?

I would hate to sell this Slayer only to make enemies because of the poor AAA business practice. AAA will communicate with you but once you pay it’s difficult to contact them again!

 

[davidsng]

AOA deal with selling and maintenance of the AAA now. Maybe they can help?

 

[Moeibanez]

AOA deal with selling and maintenance of the AAA now. Maybe they can help?

Thanks that’s a start to my ordeal.

 

[Moeibanez]

Thanks that’s a start to my ordeal.

Yikes AOA doesn’t support AAA PCPs. They are going to contact Tom on my behalf though. Hopefully I get a reply back soon.

 

[Ezana4CE]

Yikes AOA doesn’t support AAA PCPs. They are going to contact Tom on my behalf though. Hopefully I get a reply back soon.

@Moeibanez Also consider asking your question here https://community.hardairmagazine.com/forums/american-air-arms.54/
I hope @Airgun-hobbyist may be able to assist you. He's pretty knowledgeable when it comes to AAA airguns. That company is experiencing some growth and this may be part of the reason for the lack of prompt communication. I have not heard much of a response from Tom on an issue that I've been dealing with a leak on an Evol. Thankfully members of the airgun community have been helpful in assisting me.

 

[Airgun-hobbyist]

@Moeibanez I'd not sell just because of a leak and slow communication or lack of help from AoA. The factory did start to use AoA a year or so ago for all their warranty work, etc, so they could concentrate on producing and building new models. We'll try to get you sorted out through the forums for sure...

So, the Slayer is hard to assemble in the sense that it is easy to cut o-rings if not done carefully. The installation of the valve is one such problem area. As it is slid into place the o-rings must pass across the transfer port, where they tend to expand and can easily become pinched and cut as they travel across. To easily overcome this a curved piece of plastic pen tube can be inserted into the transfer port and used to manipulate the o-ring back down and into the sealing surface.

The o-rings on the air cylinder on the old Slayer receiver are just as hard to assemble sometimes, because they tend to cut soft o-ring materials as they travel across the threads. I've experimented with lubed and no lubes (don't do this) and use a lot of lube here to keep the o-ring from being cut. (Don't use silicone grease as it will gall and wreck those fine threads.

When initially airing up the Slayer, it takes quite a trick. I have it held butt down, plugging the barrel with my thumb while filling, sometimes tapping the buttstock to seat the valve. For whatever reason my Slayer, upon an initial re-seal and first fill, will act like it has a leak and not seal without a thousand pounds of pressure or more being applied. So, once it is partially sealed I open the air supply valve to my tank and let it eat until it seals. Once sealed I turn off the air to let the hot blast cool and then continue filling once cooler. If I try to ease in the air and try for a light psi seal, it won't do it.

Let us know if you have any issues or questions.

 

[bmwgsboy]

AOA deal with selling and maintenance of the AAA now. Maybe they can help?

They have nothing to do with the Slayer, they only deal with the evol.

 

[Moeibanez]

@Moeibanez I'd not sell just because of a leak and slow communication or lack of help from AoA. The factory did start to use AoA a year or so ago for all their warranty work, etc, so they could concentrate on producing and building new models. We'll try to get you sorted out through the forums for sure...

So, the Slayer is hard to assemble in the sense that it is easy to cut o-rings if not done carefully. The installation of the valve is one such problem area. As it is slid into place the o-rings must pass across the transfer port, where they tend to expand and can easily become pinched and cut as they travel across. To easily overcome this a curved piece of plastic pen tube can be inserted into the transfer port and used to manipulate the o-ring back down and into the sealing surface.

The o-rings on the air cylinder on the old Slayer receiver are just as hard to assemble sometimes, because they tend to cut soft o-ring materials as they travel across the threads. I've experimented with lubed and no lubes (don't do this) and use a lot of lube here to keep the o-ring from being cut. (Don't use silicone grease as it will gall and wreck those fine threads.

When initially airing up the Slayer, it takes quite a trick. I have it held butt down, plugging the barrel with my thumb while filling, sometimes tapping the buttstock to seat the valve. For whatever reason my Slayer, upon an initial re-seal and first fill, will act like it has a leak and not seal without a thousand pounds of pressure or more being applied. So, once it is partially sealed I open the air supply valve to my tank and let it eat until it seals. Once sealed I turn off the air to let the hot blast cool and then continue filling once cooler. If I try to ease in the air and try for a light psi seal, it won't do it.

Let us know if you have any issues or questions.

I no issue filling the tank and there are no orings inside the valve tube. This model uses cupped seals on both ends of the valve instead of orings. We believe the leak is coming from the backside of the valve which seats against the outter tube (see pictures) . I want to have replacement parts on hand before disassembling further.

 

[Moeibanez]

@Moeibanez Also consider asking your question here https://community.hardairmagazine.com/forums/american-air-arms.54/
I hope @Airgun-hobbyist may be able to assist you. He's pretty knowledgeable when it comes to AAA airguns. That company is experiencing some growth and this may be part of the reason for the lack of prompt communication. I have not heard much of a response from Tom on an issue that I've been dealing with a leak on an Evol. Thankfully members of the airgun community have been helpful in assisting me.

Thanks every little bit of help goes a long way towards knowing this design.

 

[Ezana4CE]

@Moeibanez No problem. I hope that you're able to get it sorted soon.

 

[Airgun-hobbyist]

I no issue filling the tank and there are no orings inside the valve tube. This model uses cupped seals on both ends of the valve instead of orings. We believe the leak is coming from the backside of the valve which seats against the outter tube (see pictures) . I want to have replacement parts on hand before disassembling further.

These pictures you posted picture only shows the new balance valve housing and poppet assembly. (If you have other pictures, please post them.) On the Slayer where your leak is coming from, there is only two areas where the air cylinder can leak down from. The first place being the poppet seal on the valve housing face, and the second place at the first o-ring on the housing (as shown by the drawn arrows in the picture.) The other o-rings on the valve housing and the cup sealing surfaces are utilized during the shot to contain and direct the air where it needs to go.

If you have it narrowed down to the valve assembly, then either the poppet isn't sealing or the first o-ring is leaking. Both will be loosing air through the barrel transfer port.

This assembly is somewhat tricky to install. It must be done carefully so the poppet isn't bent and remains sealed, and so the o-rings don't get cut on the transfer port as the valve housing is pushed into the receiver.

 

[Moeibanez]

These pictures you posted picture only shows the new balance valve housing and poppet assembly. (If you have other pictures, please post them.) On the Slayer where your leak is coming from, there is only two areas where the air cylinder can leak down from. The first place being the poppet seal on the valve housing face, and the second place at the first o-ring on the housing (as shown by the drawn arrows in the picture.) The other o-rings on the valve housing and the cup sealing surfaces are utilized during the shot to contain and direct the air where it needs to go.

If you have it narrowed down to the valve assembly, then either the poppet isn't sealing or the first o-ring is leaking. Both will be loosing air through the barrel transfer port.

This assembly is somewhat tricky to install. It must be done carefully so the poppet isn't bent and remains sealed, and so the o-rings don't get cut on the transfer port as the valve housing is pushed into the receiver.

View attachment 483237

Perfect, the back side of the

 

[Moeibanez]

Perfect, the back Face of the Poppet valve is where we suspect. We were very careful assembling it back together after replacing the orings and did not see any damaged orings each time we took it apart.

Having another set of the valve assembly and the cup seals is what we need for now.

Reseating the mating surface of the poppet face would be the next thing I plan to figure out how to do when the leak is fixed.

And also how to adjust the dwell.

 

[Airgun-hobbyist]

Perfect, the back side of the Poppet valve is where we suspect. We were very careful assembling it back together after replacing the orings and did not see any damaged orings each time we took it apart.

Having another set of the valve assembly and the cup seals is what we need for now.

Reseating the mating surface of the poppet face would be the next thing I plan to figure out how to do when the leak is fixed.

And also how to adjust the dwell.

You never said who took the picture of the valve housing and poppet assembly? It needs a different o-ring. And, is this the gun mntghost was selling last month?

 

[Moeibanez]

You never said who took the picture of the valve housing and poppet assembly? It needs a different o-ring. And, is this the gun mntghost was selling last month?

I am the original owner of the Slayer 357 purchased directly from AAA.

The picture attached is the original valve assembly and original orings. AAA was out of oring kits so I purchased two kits from Captain oring of which the orings were too big for this valve asset and did not have the cup seals. Only two orings in the pack fit and we did not remove the barrel so that oring has not bet confirmed for size. Captain Oring was also surprised that this 357 Slayer has a different design. We replaced most of the orings from a huge oring kit a PCP owner on island was kind enough to share.

 

[Airgun-hobbyist]

I am the original owner of the Slayer 357 purchased directly from AAA.

The picture attached is the original valve assembly and original orings. AAA was out of oring kits so I purchased two kits from Captain oring of which the orings were too big for this valve asset and did not have the cup seals. Only two orings in the pack fit and we did not remove the barrel so that oring has not bet confirmed for size. Captain Oring was also surprised that this 357 Slayer has a different design. We replaced most of the orings from a huge oring kit a PCP owner on island was kind enough to share.

Thanks for clarifying. So many Slayer's have traded hands between different owner's over the years it is nice to see a new one out in the wild. With regards to the o-rings kit you have, I did not have the best of luck with the Captain O-ring kit either. I ended up buying a large supply from https://www.theoringstore.com/store/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=367_454_455

If Tom placed those particular o-rings in that Slayer then you can bet he did extensive leak down testing and through feedback from owner's. Those look like urethane duro 70 o-rings. I use them in other places on the Slayer and Evol. As I stated above, I have standard black o-rings on the outside of the valve housing, but it's an old original gun.

 

[Airgun-hobbyist]

Just an FYI regarding choice of o-ring... I have been doing a lot of experimenting with different o-rings and material types in various pcp's and found that the cast urethane duro 90 are not a good choice for stationary sealing. They are pretty hard, and as such do not make the best seal. Also, though pretty cut resistant for installation purposes, the urethane seems to tend to split and fail from some type of breakdown in the material. The opaque white o-ring absorbs installation lube as evidence by it's changing colors, and then just cracks/splits. I'd bet you'll see the same the same breakdown and micro separation happened to those on that valve housing if you look at them under magnification.

 

[Moeibanez]

Just an FYI regarding choice of o-ring... I have been doing a lot of experimenting with different o-rings and material types in various pcp's and found that the cast urethane duro 90 are not a good choice for stationary sealing. They are pretty hard, and as such do not make the best seal. Also, though pretty cut resistant for installation purposes, the urethane seems to tend to split and fail from some type of breakdown in the material. The opaque white o-ring absorbs installation lube as evidence by it's changing colors, and then just cracks/splits. I'd bet you'll see the same the same breakdown and micro separation happened to those on that valve housing if you look at them under magnification.

Great info to consider, what has worked best for you?

 

[Airgun-hobbyist]

For sealing that valve housing I'd go with a standard black Buna 90 or Viton 90 duro o-ring and see how it lasts. They work in my Slayer.

This is the list of types of o-ring compound materials available.

O-Ring Compound Selections : The O-Ring Store LLC, We make getting O-Rings easy!

The O-Ring Store LLC : O-Ring Compound Selections - O-Ring Cord to Create Custom O-Rings OSK Assorted O-Ring Kits OSK™ O-Ring Repair Kits OSK™ Hydraulic Cylinder Seal Kits OSK™ Air Nailer O-Ring Kits OSK™ Sanitary & Brewery Gaskets O-Ring Lubrication Products Olypsys® O-Ring Measurement App -...

www.theoringstore.com

 

[Moeibanez]

Thanks
Buna 90 Duro is what I replaced them with. I still have a small leak which most likely is coming from the sealing surface of the poppet valve. If I can find a source to purchase this valve it would be helpful.