i would like to find a bore camera that fits .177 . Just can't find a small enough one . .20 is smallest i can find
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Tuning Sub half MOA air rifle
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This may help with the scoring.
One MOA Calculation (Note, MOA = minute of angle).
This is how you can determine the one MOA for any target.
Example:
A trivia note, one MOA on the moon is about 69.5 miles, 111.85 Kilometers! (238,900 miles, 384,472.28 Kilometers to the moon).
One MOA Calculation (Note, MOA = minute of angle).
This is how you can determine the one MOA for any target.
- Determine the distance or range to this target.
- Convert this number to inches or centimeters for metric.
- Double this number. (Diameter of a circle at this target distance or range).
- Use Pi, 3.14159 times the number in step 3. (Circumference of a circle is Pi x D).
- Divide this number by 21,600. (Note 21,600 is the number of minutes in a circle, 360 degrees times 60 minutes in one degree).
Example:
- 100 yards to target.
- 100 times 3’ times 12” equal 3600” to the 100 yard target.
- 3600” x 2 equal 7200”. (Diameter of 100 yard circle in inches).
- Pi 3.14159 times 7200” equal 22,619.448”. (Circumference of 100 yard circle).
- 22,619.448” divided by 21,600 = 1.04719”. (One MOA at 100 yards in inches).
A trivia note, one MOA on the moon is about 69.5 miles, 111.85 Kilometers! (238,900 miles, 384,472.28 Kilometers to the moon).
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Perfect example of 1/2 MOA gun requires a 1/2 MOA shooter.
IMHO most quality guns with quality ammo and proper tuning can easily shoot sub MOA at the least at very close ranges. Thanks to effect of condition/wind, shooting sub MOA groups at 100 yards or further with airguns is mostly based on skills of the shooter.
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What he said.
Except it’s probably more like a 1/4 MOA gun needs a 1/4 MOA wind-reading wizard to produce a 1/2 MOA outcome.
Except it’s probably more like a 1/4 MOA gun needs a 1/4 MOA wind-reading wizard to produce a 1/2 MOA outcome.
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terrible at math is a gross understatement in my case ! Attention Math wizards : what would .5 MOA be @ 10 yards and @ 30 yards ?
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The reality is this goal can't be realized at 100y with mass produced pellets of .05 G1 BC in the outdoors.
Mike N's 38Ggr slugs are around .12 G1 BC, are swaged one just like the rest, and look how well these do. Albeit shot out the best airgun made, the best barrels, and one of the top BR shooters in the world.
Double that BC while maintaining lower barrel friction and ??!!
Mike N's 38Ggr slugs are around .12 G1 BC, are swaged one just like the rest, and look how well these do. Albeit shot out the best airgun made, the best barrels, and one of the top BR shooters in the world.
Double that BC while maintaining lower barrel friction and ??!!
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There is no clear definition of how many shots are "required" to come to a MOA conclusion. In a scientific way you want the same conditions and forces imparted on the rifle. So put it on a machine.
To determine a rifle capability you have to eliminate the human element to determine what the rifle is capable of. Then with that data you have the minimum it can shoot, then you can determine what the shooter is capable of, And like mentioned have identical projectiles.
To determine a rifle capability you have to eliminate the human element to determine what the rifle is capable of. Then with that data you have the minimum it can shoot, then you can determine what the shooter is capable of, And like mentioned have identical projectiles.
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Half minute of angle at 10 yards is .05 inches (.5 inches divided by 10). At 30 yards it would be .15 inches. (I am not doing this the most precise way but I think this is close enough)
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3.81 mm! My eyes can't measure that even with my cheaters and digital calipers hahaha. At that point it just looks like a hole.
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Yes, it would be one hole groups. I believe the benchrest guys measure the outside of the hole and subtract the diameter of the bullet they are using. I've shot a couple 3 shot groups at least this small with my P35-22 but I can't do it consistently.
While PCP pressures deserve respect they are hugely below powder burners. Rimfires get to about 25,000 psi and centerfire can be 60,000 psi or even more. The skirts on our pellets expand out into the rifling with our much smaller pressures. With slugs, we need a tight fit that also is not too tight because our relatively low pressure will not expand the body of the slug. If the slugs are too big they may get stuck.
While PCP pressures deserve respect they are hugely below powder burners. Rimfires get to about 25,000 psi and centerfire can be 60,000 psi or even more. The skirts on our pellets expand out into the rifling with our much smaller pressures. With slugs, we need a tight fit that also is not too tight because our relatively low pressure will not expand the body of the slug. If the slugs are too big they may get stuck.
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I believe that 30 yards for 1/2 MOA = .157" C to C & 10 yards = .052".
How you measure or determine that is WAY beyond me!
Math for ½ MOA at 30 & 10 yards.
30 x 3 x 12 x 2 x 3.14159 = 6785.8344
6785.8344/21600 = 0.314159
0.314159/2 = 0.1570795” This is ½ MOA at 30 yards.
0.1570795/3 = 0.0523598333” This is ½ MOA at 10 yards.
How you measure or determine that is WAY beyond me!
Math for ½ MOA at 30 & 10 yards.
30 x 3 x 12 x 2 x 3.14159 = 6785.8344
6785.8344/21600 = 0.314159
0.314159/2 = 0.1570795” This is ½ MOA at 30 yards.
0.1570795/3 = 0.0523598333” This is ½ MOA at 10 yards.
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One MOA at 10 yards would span 0.1047". As this is linear with distance and for small angles, half a MOA at 10 yards would span 0.0524".
For Half MOA at 30 yards, multiply by three: 0.157"
If you can measure that finely
For Half MOA at 30 yards, multiply by three: 0.157"
If you can measure that finely
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Good video editing software can also greatly increase your odds of shooting sub moa groups at 100 yards.
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Steve, that BC is good, but certainly not state of the art. Probably not that much of a difference out to shorter 50 or 100 yards, but a big difference once out past that to 200 or 300 yards.
Great shooter plus great equipment equals great results. Weren’t the World BR Championships held in Czech Republic not too long ago? 25M and 50M.
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With no wind at all and a good scope I am of the idea that that is achievable with my Red Wolf .22 and the H&N Baracudas.
That rifle has a combination of three really important elements needed to get super good groups:
A) Accuracy on the rifle;
B) Perfect trigger; and
C) An easy to control rifle.
With this Red Wolf I learned that there’s a big difference among what you would like from an air rifle and what a really good rifle can make you achieve.
That rifle has a combination of three really important elements needed to get super good groups:
A) Accuracy on the rifle;
B) Perfect trigger; and
C) An easy to control rifle.
With this Red Wolf I learned that there’s a big difference among what you would like from an air rifle and what a really good rifle can make you achieve.
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I don't know the specifics of what happened at the Worlds, but I'm guessing many of the USA's top BR shooters weren't there. And my statement isn't meant to take away from the other top shooters that were there.
I meant doubling that .12 BC to .24 BC while retaining Mike N's precision capability in equipment, slugs, and shooter. Half or almost half the wind drift so I assume it'd dominate in 50Y and 100Y benchrest and farther out as well??
At 50y my 42gr slugs out of SURELY show in my ballistic app .4 mil for a 10mph wind from 9 oclock, while the Altaros 60gr Queens shows .2 mil in the same wind.
Then .7 mil vs .4 mil at 100Y in the same wind.
The .24 BC slug has the same wind drift at 100Y as my .142 BC slug has at 50Y!
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1/2moa can be shot easily with my Sinner .223 airgun with lothar walther .22lr barrel with a twist off 16 inch. Last Sunday i shot the smallest 5 shot group off 12mm at 100 meters during the 100 meter match using the RWS 41.5 grain slugs. This gun has proven many times to be the best 100m benchrest airgun.
Grtz Bert
Grtz Bert
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I’d love to but at nearly 76 I‘m not sure if I would live long enough to get one or still be able to shot it when it showed up.
Long lead times are common for any top of the line weapon, air or powder. (My friend Hamilton Bowen, the premier custom revolver builder, is years out on new orders.) The current wait time for a new Thomas is a tribute to the fact that these rifles are the pinnacle of the Airgun world.David
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