HW/Weihrauch Surprisingly Disappointing & Confused

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KRich

KRich

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Jun 17, 2017
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Rosenberg,Texas,USA
For Christmas I finally broke down and bought a Competition Electronics ProChrono DLX. I wanted to see exactly where my 3 Weihrauch's stood. performance wise.
The oldest of the bunch, the HW95 (with a new Vortek PG4 Tune kit) perfomed as expected with an average 765fps shooting H&N Baracuda Match 10.65g pellets.
The HW90, after pumping a tad more air into it, is shooting 905fps average using the same pellets.

This is where Im totally confused and a bit peeved. My HW80 with very little pellets ran throught it (probably less than 250), is averaging a mere 425fps using the same 10.65g H&N's. This rifle is supposed to be a "Magnum" springer or so I thought, yet my Benji & Sheridan's blow it out of the water as far as power goes.

Any idea why Im getting such lackluster performance out of this HW80? Its NEVER been stored cocked, thats for sure. Do I need to break down and buy a Vortek kit for this one as well ? The Vortek kits are smooth as silk and I love how it tamed the HW95, but I read somewhere that power may suffer if I treid putting the kit in the HW80. It seems at this point I have nothing to loose. Geeze.
 
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jccams said:
The other kit that is popular is made by Jim Maccari at ARH. I have more of these than Vorteks. I do prefer the Vortek piston seals.

airguns, HW, Beeman, Weihrauch,tunes, springs,, tuning,

Weihrauch rifles and related accessories for spring piston airguns. Official US importer of Weihrauch airguns.
www.airrifleheadquarters.com
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Ohh...Yea..James. I was looking at his springs...Roger that. I'll investigate.....thanx !
 
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From my years of dealing with the Hw80, I have always heard that it was designed to shooting .22 due to its swept air volume. Think about it, why have a "magnum springer" pushing at .177 caliber pellet.
Steve Pope of Venom Airguns in the UK made some wonder kits for the Hw80. Unfortunately, Steve is no longer with us. PhonePics163.jpg
 
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MEC17670 said:
From my years of dealing with the Hw80, I have always heard that it was designed to shooting .22 due to its swept air volume. Think about it, why have a "magnum springer" pushing at .177 caliber pellet.
Steve Pope of Venom Airguns in the UK made some wonder kits for the Hw80. Unfortunately, Steve is no longer with us.View attachment 427202
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Yes the HW80S is best suited to .20 or .22 calibers .... with me preferring .20 cal. w/13.73 JSB's.
 
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KRich said:
For Christmas I finally broke down and bought a Competition Electronics ProChrono DLX. I wanted to see exactly where my 3 Weihrauch's stood. performance wise.
The oldest of the bunch, the HW95 (with a new Vortek PG4 Tune kit) perfomed as expected with an average 765fps shooting H&N Baracuda Match 10.65g pellets.
The HW90, after pumping a tad more air into it, is shooting 905fps average using the same pellets.

This is where Im totally confused and a bit peeved. My HW80 with very little pellets ran throught it (probably less than 250), is averaging a mere 425fps using the same 10.65g H&N's. This rifle is supposed to be a "Magnum" springer or so I thought, yet my Benji & Sheridan's blow it out of the water as far as power goes.

Any idea why Im getting such lackluster performance out of this HW80? Its NEVER been stored cocked, thats for sure. Do I need to break down and buy a Vortek kit for this one as well ? The Vortek kits are smooth as silk and I love how it tamed the HW95, but I read somewhere that power may suffer if I treid putting the kit in the HW80. It seems at this point I have nothing to loose. Geeze.
Click to expand...
I noted rather strange results in the Hard Air Mag test on the HW80. The term "magnum" hardly applied from what I saw.
 
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New (replacement) Spring kit installed. MUCH BETTER. I decided to test an assortment of H&N pellets including the Baracuda Match 10.65gr that I used in my intial evaluation. Testing was done a few min. ago at a Temp of 66. 10 shots were fired before recording shots to clear out any remaining solvents and or lube in the compression chamber. All are 5 shot groups:

1st: Baracuda Match 10.65gr: Average FPS=771 / Extreme Spread=24 FPS / Standard Deviation=10 FPS / Average FPE=13.23
2nd: Baracuda Match 10.65gr BUT 4.52 Head diameter : Average FPS=777 / Extreme Spread=10 FPS / Standard Deviation= 7 FPS / Average FPE 13.41
3rd: Terminator 7.25gr: Average FPS=1031 / Extreme Spread=43 FPS / Standard Deviation=16 FPS / Average FPE=16.52
4th: Field Target Trophy 8.64gr: Average FPS=940 / Extreme Spread=8 FPS / Standard Deviation=3 FPS / Average FPE=15.70

All in all, It was worth the wait I suppose. Not only is the power back in line where it should be, it shoots much, much smoother.

NOTE: In addition to the spring kit, a new piston and breech seal were also installed. Life is good.......again.
 
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KRich said:
I'm 105' above sea level, and the day had 30in HG of Barometric Pressure. Installed Thomas' Vac Seal 30 (piston seal) as well as a new breech seal. In other words, I installed the complete kit. Yes, Its a Weihrauch HW80
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There's something a little off. I've tuned quite a few 177 R1s. With both Vortek and JM kits. The R1 is just a beeman rebranded Hw80. In good stock form they should both make about 17fpe with mid weight pellets. With a full power tune kit about the same or a little more.

The VAC seals start off tight. Try checking the velocity after again after a couple hundred rounds. In the past Vortek breech seals are a little hard and thick. No power issues there but they can cause barrel droop and lock up issues.
 
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Mycapt65 said:
There's something a little off. I've tuned quite a few 177 R1s. With both Vortek and JM kits. The R1 is just a beeman rebranded Hw80. In good stock form they should both make about 17fpe with mid weight pellets. With a full power tune kit about the same or a little more.

The VAC seals start off tight. Try checking the velocity after again after a couple hundred rounds. In the past Vortek breech seals are a little hard and thick. No power issues there but they can cause barrel droop and lock up issues.
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Im not having any lockup issues, but the piston seal is brand new for sure. The Field Target Trophy @ 8.64gr is what I would comsider a mid weight pellet.. The Chrony numbers I quoted above were taken right off of the Digital link app used with my Chrony. If my average FPS was 940 using that 8.65gr pelletre, then my Ft of Energy woukd be right in line with your Quoted 17. As soon as this freeking rain subsides, I'll get out and throw some more led=allot more. What I found suprising, is the performance difference between the 4.5mm and 4.52mm Baracuda Match. I think the 4.52 Match is my new "go to" pellet. Im assuming the slightly larger head size is providing a better seal in the bore, resulting in better numbers across the board.
 
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KRich said:
Im not having any lockup issues, but the piston seal is brand new for sure. The Field Target Trophy @ 8.64gr is what I would comsider a mid weight pellet.. The Chrony numbers I quoted above were taken right off of the Digital link app used with my Chrony. If my average FPS was 940 using that 8.65gr pelletre, then my Ft of Energy woukd be right in line with your Quoted 17. As soon as this freeking rain subsides, I'll get out and throw some more led=allot more. What I found suprising, is the performance difference between the 4.5mm and 4.52mm Baracuda Match. I think the 4.52 Match is my new "go to" pellet. Im assuming the slightly larger head size is providing a better seal in the bore, resulting in better numbers across the board.
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I didn't check your calculations in this post. Here you list the FTTs as 15.7 fpe. That math is incorrect and why I thought the gun was down on power. My calculations are 16.95 fpe which is fine.

Screenshot_20240127_070053_DuckDuckGo.jpg
 
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Mycapt65 said:
What's better performance about the 4.52 BM? Accuracy? They usually produce less energy that lighter pellets.
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Baracuda Match 10.65gr: Average FPS=771 / Extreme Spread=24 FPS / Standard Deviation=10 FPS / Average FPE=13.23
Baracuda Match 10.65gr (4.52 Head diameter) : Average FPS=777 / Extreme Spread=10 FPS / Standard Deviation= 7 FPS / Average FPE 13.41
 
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Mycapt65 said:
I didn't check your calculations in this post. Here you list the FTTs as 15.7 fpe. That math is incorrect and why I thought the gun was down on power. My calculations are 16.95 fpe which is fine.

View attachment 429375
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Yes, thats what the app says......but if you take the average FPS and do the math, it comes up with what you and me stated.....strange.
 
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Mycapt65 said:
Thanks. I was considering getting another chrono for that app. Now I'm not. Thanks
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There is nothiing wrong with the App. The problem is me. The App however WILL NOT allow entry of bullet grains to the 2nd decimal point. Looking over my data entry, I found that I did not enter ANY decimal places for bullet grain weight. After adjusting the data for the above example Field Target Trophy, if I add .6 then the FPE changers (of course) to better reflect actual numbers. MY BAD for not realizing this. It would be great to have bullet gr weight entered to the hundredths obviously......I was just on the phone with Competition Electronics who make he Chrony, And begged them to update the app to allow grain weight to be entered to the 2nd decimal point, and they told me it couldnt be done....according to the app development team. I explained how important that is to our sport, as our projectiles are rather small compaired to our firearms counterpart. It probably fell on def ears.
 
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