The history of FT rules?

[SqrlHntr]

This all brings me back to my point of the original rules. Why cant we just shoot targets with an airgun, sling and a normal hunting scope? Limit the scope magnification and only allow a sling and a bag. Thats kinda how NRA teaches and competes. Keeps it simple and allows for many shooters to compete with what they already have and naturally follows the NRA stuff so its suited for a slew of new and younger shooters. Maybe just morph into a Limited Hunter class, same hunter scope rules but no sticks? Still poses stability challenges like Open and ranging challenges, but blends the two for easy crosssover too. Im now shooting this way, FT and Textreme. I’ve ditched the sticks and using a sling only. Taking a lead from the Bandito class I guess. But thats also what I do love about the FT rules! You can shoot well within the rules to compete in a class but also make it your own personal challenge or fit your shooting style.

The only rule i have contention with is the prone rule and target sight. Since attached bipods are no longer allowed but the rules say any position, it would follow that prone rains viable position provisions are made for. But if targets are allowed to be hidden from prone since the 15” rule was also removed then prone is not really an option and thus restrictive to a shooter who wishes to shoot prone. IMO prone should always be an option as it is the most basic of positions.

 

[thomasair]

Back when the 15” rule was on the books….there was no guarantee that match directors were going to follow it. It was extremely common for the rule to be ignored because it didn’t apply to most shooters.

 

[Scotchmo]

SqrlHntr,
Not sure about the different EFT rules, but at least in AAFTA Hunter Division, you are not required to use a bipod or sticks. We don’t need any new rules to shoot that way.

The latest AAFTA rules say that targets must be visible from all shooting positions, however, once the match is under way, there is no recourse if you encounter a target that does not comply. So even though I prefer to sit on the ground (no seat, no sticks), I still carry at least a 6” seat for Open and a higher seat for Hunter, and usually sticks (though I rarely use them).

 

[L.Leon]

Kdog hit the nail(s) squarely on the head!

I've been beating the shooting and airgun bushes for decades to bring folks into shooting, airgunning, silhouette, and field target. Often it felt more like beating my head against the wall as potential victims made excuses not to compete; a sure sign of competition anxiety (fear of being embarrassed). Didn't take long to realize it's a waste of time to continue trying to recruit those individuals.

I know it’s “tongue in cheek” but, excuses not to compete? Fear of being embarrassed? Why so, there are myriad reasons some can’t or won’t participate. The main constraints for us all being “having the time”. I participated in the action shooting sports, lots of fun, all day affairs. I’ve run out of that kind of time. i did not pay attention to the other shooting classes, other than the scores at the matches end. Yes there were individual “class winners”. But I would look for the highest overall score and pay that person “props” in my mind as the “best shooter” that day. I was always there to compete “against the COFs” and see how I improved from match to match and how I stacked up against my shooting buddies. If and when I come out to shoot field target it will be strictly for fun, because I already have a job. A Knocking them down for fun class”?

 

[AirNGasman]

When I'm match directing, and although I seldom mention it, if someone wants to shoot my matches outside the rules boundaries (other than power limits) I accept their entry fee and allow it. No problem; their score just doesn't count in the match results. That way I accommodate all comers.

And if someone inadvertently violates a rule, probably better to tell them their score is disqualified from the match results, rather than "you're disqualified". Not to say I'm beyond telling a shooter he's disqualified, mind you.

BTW, I've disqualified myself (more than once). That's my writing in red below; added after the MD and three other AAFTA governors met and denied my protest of my own equipment. So I had to DQ myself.

 

[Therealld]

I have shot FT since it started in the USA, which was (I think) 1984. It was intro’d by some fine Brit shooters, first in Florida with Rodney Boyce’s help, then here in Calif by the same Brits in Ojai, Ca. During the same intercontinental visit, as facilitated by Airgun writer Dennis O’Flarhity in comcert with Rodney.

At first there was just one class, which was airguns of .22 or less caliber. No special rules other than safety considerations. Conventional Knockover type targets from around 10-50 yards, 2 shots per target fired from any position the lane position could accomodate. The range was in an avocado orchard, and some shots afforded bracing on tree trunks or resting from low rock walls. Nearly all guns were springers except the odd co2 or pump-up rifle.

Within a few years, rifles were split into spring or pneumatic classes.

A few years later, USA rules included a restriction on power related to target damage, And later still, when portable chronos were more common, the 20fpe limit was established. By then it was considered poor form to use “undue support” for the rifle. There were no official forced position lane, but course setters could get pretty creative in target placement to encourage non-preferred shooting positions.

A rift occured between uk and us style shooting rules due to the unwillingness of most shooters and organizers UK to consider FAC equipment, vs the ready availability unrestricted airguns here in US with no compulsion to limit power to one unsuitable for small game hunting. More US shooters were hunting oriented as a percentage than in UK.

I competed regularly in Field Target out here for several decades, and have enjoyed it immensely, though I shoot much less often nowadays due to health considerations.

I think lots of us seniors curtail shooting that might continue if open class rules allowed stools and bipods as well as the current regular open allowances.

Sincerely,


LD

 

[Greg5850]

This all brings me back to my point of the original rules. Why cant we just shoot targets with an airgun, sling and a normal hunting scope? Limit the scope magnification and only allow a sling and a bag. Thats kinda how NRA teaches and competes. Keeps it simple and allows for many shooters to compete with what they already have and naturally follows the NRA stuff so its suited for a slew of new and younger shooters. Maybe just morph into a Limited Hunter class, same hunter scope rules but no sticks? Still poses stability challenges like Open and ranging challenges, but blends the two for easy crosssover too. Im now shooting this way, FT and Textreme. I’ve ditched the sticks and using a sling only. Taking a lead from the Bandito class I guess. But thats also what I do love about the FT rules! You can shoot well within the rules to compete in a class but also make it your own personal challenge or fit your shooting style.

The only rule i have contention with is the prone rule and target sight. Since attached bipods are no longer allowed but the rules say any position, it would follow that prone rains viable position provisions are made for. But if targets are allowed to be hidden from prone since the 15” rule was also removed then prone is not really an option and thus restrictive to a shooter who wishes to shoot prone. IMO prone should always be an option as it is the most basic of positions.

The 15" rule was removed because it was difficult to determine where and how to measure. The rule now simply says that the KZ must be visible from all positions, including prone. But keep in mind visibility does not always equal shootability. This is something to keep in mind when developing your shooting positions. A course with several very high and low shots will present challenges to a prone shooter.

 

[Scotchmo]

The 15" rule was removed because it was difficult to determine where and how to measure. The rule now simply says that the KZ must be visible from all positions, including prone. But keep in mind visibility does not always equal shootability. This is something to keep in mind when developing your shooting positions. A course with several very high and low shots will present challenges to a prone shooter.

1) 2009 15" rule written
2) 2014 15" rule removed
3) 2018 15" rule reinstated for GP matches
4) 2021 15" rule removed from GP matches

I used to carry a piece of yardstick cut at the 15" mark. Hold it on end touching ground at the shooting pad and sight down the top of it to the target. Not difficult.

These days, most match directors are pretty good about having the targets be made visible if asked. However, current rules do indicate that the match director may allow visibility obstructions to remain at their discretion, so they can over-ride the "visible from any position" rule.

Prone is not really an issue anymore (no more prone shooters at AAFTA matches). Though one of our club shooters still shoots that way at our small monthly club matches (which are purposely non-AAFTA compliant).

Shootability:
Low shots are fairly easy for prone shooters (as long as they are visible). High angle shots can be difficult but are doable if the shooter is prepared. When I was shooting prone at AAFTA matches (pre-2015), I still carried sticks and in the picture below, a longer unattached bipod for those instances. It was cumbersome, but was a fun challenge when match directors thought they were thwarting the prone shooters. These days I prefer no support aids, but I will still use sticks occasionally on severe targets (when shooting in Hunter Division).

2013 Oregon state match:

 

[AirNGasman]

I recall watching you shoot prone at Yegua, Scott; probably when we hosted FT Nats in 2013. On the one hand I was repulsed by the turns Hunter Class had taken (prone shooters dominating, your BOOK of information, bracketing, etc.). But on the other hand, after witnessing your shooting SKILLS...

I WANTED TO BEAR YOUR CHILDREN! (Insert pregnant male emoji here)

For y'alls' information, Scott won a Springer Division National Champion title in 2009 using a CHINESE made springer! The man has superhuman shooting and airgunsmithing skills. But perhaps just as impressive (or more-so), he's a gentleman of the highest order.

But don't hold it against him that it's ME heaping the praise. NORMAL folks think just as highly of The Man.

 

[SteveV]

This all brings me back to my point of the original rules. Why cant we just shoot targets with an airgun, sling and a normal hunting scope? Limit the scope magnification and only allow a sling and a bag. Thats kinda how NRA teaches and competes. Keeps it simple and allows for many shooters to compete with what they already have and naturally follows the NRA stuff so its suited for a slew of new and younger shooters. Maybe just morph into a Limited Hunter class, same hunter scope rules but no sticks? Still poses stability challenges like Open and ranging challenges, but blends the two for easy crosssover too. Im now shooting this way, FT and Textreme. I’ve ditched the sticks and using a sling only. Taking a lead from the Bandito class I guess. But thats also what I do love about the FT rules! You can shoot well within the rules to compete in a class but also make it your own personal challenge or fit your shooting style.

The only rule i have contention with is the prone rule and target sight. Since attached bipods are no longer allowed but the rules say any position, it would follow that prone rains viable position provisions are made for. But if targets are allowed to be hidden from prone since the 15” rule was also removed then prone is not really an option and thus restrictive to a shooter who wishes to shoot prone. IMO prone should always be an option as it is the most basic of positions.

You can shoot that way, it's called Hunter Class. Just consider your un-attached bipod an option. But when your fellow competitors are kicking your butt, you may want to re-think that approach.

 

[MikeAndrews]

Well I can only go back as far as 1989. That is when I started running FT matches at Delran junior Marksman Club in Delran, NJ. At that time I knew very little about Ft but had run various other matches at our club The only other groups that were running FT were Delaware County Field and Stream, in Brookhaven, PA., Tampa Bay Airgunners in Tampa FL., and Capitol Area Field Target Association in the Maryland, DC area. There may have been others in Central US and the West Coast. The Tampa Bay guys ( Rodnet Boyce, et al) shot sitting down like the English. The rest of us shot mostly standing ( a lot of us were silhouette shooters so we were use to standing). There were no positional shots. The Tampa guys hated standing and we kinda liked it because we did it in silhouette. The guns were all springers and a 12 or 18X scope was considered high power. Target distance was 10 to around 45 yards which was considered a pretty long shot ( offhand). We typically did not case our guns on the course. We just walked around with them and a lot of us used slings to carry them. Some carried a stool to sit on. Rules were simple and match attendance was high by todays standards.

Along came the 1990s and we started to see PCP rifles like the Shamal and others. Scopes were changing as well and even in silhouette. By 1995 some of us were using scopes of 40 power.. The PCP guns were easier to shoot so the classes became springer and PCP to keep it more fair. More and more shooters got involved that were not silhouette shooters so the English sitting style gained some traction and became the norm. When we went to sitting I would always include a couple of shots that were not actually forced positional shots but I set them up so that they pretty much had to be shot standing( in order to see them). This was a good way to break ties. Since the PCP guns and the high power scopes made FT easier the match directors started to make the courses more difficult. The scores kept getting better so forced or positional targets/lanes started to be used to make it a bit harder. Target distances started to increase and reduced kill zones became more common. PCP guns were a little more delicate than the spring guns so shooters started to carry their more delicate and more expensive guns in cases on the courses and just took them out to shoot.

Time passed and PCP guns became more specialized and pricey with their high powered scopes. Shooters complained and wanted a division that would accommodate them using a rifle that they would use for hunting which would also use a lower power scope. They also wanted to use support and did NOT want to have to get up and down off the ground. Hence the Hunter Division was born allowing the use of a bipod ( detached) and a seat and a scope of limited power. This is easier than sitting with no support so restrictions are used to make this Division less easy like not being able to adjust the scope and limiting its power. Please note that this is a Division in an AAFTA Match and not anything like Hunter Field Target in the rest of the world.

The last major change was the introduction of a WFTF Division which again is not following the rules in the rest of the world but does create a separate Division within AAFTA for the use of the same guns that are used in WFTF competition. The major requirement is that he gun must be 12 foot pound energy or less.

That's the Readers digest version. Probably left some stuff out but this is just from MY memory. Good or bad? I don't know. I guess it's more fair but seems like it used to be more fun in the beginning.

Respectfully submitted,
Rick Bassett

Hi Rich, I remember those days as I was a member of the capitol area field target group. We all very much enjoyed the travel around the US to different matches.

 

[K]

How about we hold GPs that require everyone to shoot each of the 3 classes?

Could allow buckets and sticks in every class.

Open would be truly unlimited…,wftf would be unlimited at 12 fpe….and Hunter would be no coats and 16x scopes.

That would be a really good way to see who the best shooters are.

Mike

If I had to do that I'd go shoot all the courses WFTF style and happily come in last.

 

[coldfield]

I started in 1990. So a little later than some of you. Just wanted to say I think this sport will die because of all the changes people want. I recall when the hunter class was started it was to get new shooter involved in the sport with simple and inexpensive guns and scope. Something you could hunt with. (12x scopes, no range finding etc..) very inexpensive rigs. Same as the Stand piston class. (limited price of equipment and 20x scopes) Now new shooter come out to watch and WFTF is the only class that's affordable, which is fine for me. It's the only real class the way I see it. Hunter class people are shooting 4k plus rigs....including 20 ftpds guns just so they don't have to learn to read wind....that's pretty funny.... what even better is that wftf shooters most of the time are the higher scores in the match......sitting on their bags, under 12ftpds, using there brain not there wallets to shoot high score in the wind. To keep FT alive we also need younger and newer shooters involve. They have to be able to afford to shoot. If all the guns were 12ftpds, the cost of putting a good rig together would be 1/3 of what it is now. I remember hearing Rodney saying several times, "Any gun that can shoot 1/2 groups at 50yds can win a match" Still believe that is true. I don't think I'm the only one that thinks the sport was better in the 1990's.. at least then if you heard someone crying on the course it was a child not a grown man Ha Ha!

 

[Centercut]

I started in 1990. So a little later than some of you. Just wanted to say I think this sport will die because of all the changes people want. I recall when the hunter class was started it was to get new shooter involved in the sport with simple and inexpensive guns and scope. Something you could hunt with. (12x scopes, no range finding etc..) very inexpensive rigs. Same as the Stand piston class. (limited price of equipment and 20x scopes) Now new shooter come out to watch and WFTF is the only class that's affordable, which is fine for me. It's the only real class the way I see it. Hunter class people are shooting 4k plus rigs....including 20 ftpds guns just so they don't have to learn to read wind....that's pretty funny.... what even better is that wftf shooters most of the time are the higher scores in the match......sitting on their bags, under 12ftpds, using there brain not there wallets to shoot high score in the wind. To keep FT alive we also need younger and newer shooters involve. They have to be able to afford to shoot. If all the guns were 12ftpds, the cost of putting a good rig together would be 1/3 of what it is now. I remember hearing Rodney saying several times, "Any gun that can shoot 1/2 groups at 50yds can win a match" Still believe that is true. I don't think I'm the only one that thinks the sport was better in the 1990's.. at least then if you heard someone crying on the course it was a child not a grown man Ha Ha!

Do you shoot in the USA recently (past 5 years)? The WFTF guns/scopes are MUCH more expensive than the average Hunter class gun/scope, usually by a factor or 2 to1 or even higher. Most top WFTF shooters have $4K Thomas guns with $3K Kahles scopes. The top Hunter shooters are 1/2 that or much less. What makes WFTF affordable and Hunter expensive? Your statements confuse me... Please explain? Out here in the West USA area, Hunter and WFTF usually shoot high score on an equal basis, with Open usually trailing...

 

[Kdog]

The dollar amount for a WFTF setup and hunter setup is a moot point. I see just as many Hunter shooters with $3000 Daystate Red Wolfs and Thomas's as WFTF shooters. Top those rifles with $1500 Sightron scopes and other high end scopes and what's the difference? 2 of my WFTF setups are used RAW rifles and scopes that I have less than 2k in the whole rifle/scope combo.

As people progress in any sport there trend is a path upward in more expensive gear. New shooters will likely have cheaper equipment and more seasoned shooters will have already climbed the ladder of more expensive guns and scopes.

It's not how much the equipment is....it's the shooter pulling the trigger who most likely has been around awhile that makes the difference.

 

[oldsparky]

I read a firing position rule somewhere in the past few days but now I can't find it. Something like your muzzle must be past the firing line but the trigger must be behind the line? If that is close to how it is written. I have broke that one a lot. I wouldn't think my muzzle has ever been past a line of fire on purpose.

 

[Centercut]

All I can surmise by all of this History of AAFTA rules is that they REALLY don’t want shooters going prone. It’s not that attached bipod being disallowed, that can easily be overcome with a shorty bipod like we normally use but with 6 or 8 inch legs. It’s the gun not being able to be rested on a part “nebulous” of the body that touches the ground. Most would rest the butt on their fist, and the common interpretation is the entire “hand” is a part of the body. Using Sea Lawyer logic, I could rest the gun in my “fingers” with the “heel” of the hand on the ground…. I guess it’s up to the MD but the reality is that prone was deleted because too many shooters were winning from that position and lots of old fat guys couldn’t go prone? Or am I mistaken?

 

[AirNGasman]

"the reality is that prone was deleted because too many shooters were winning from that position and lots of old fat guys couldn’t go prone? Or am I mistaken?"

That's about the gist of it, Mike. True confessions, I'm glad!

Not just because guys started beating me than never could before, or because I'm an old fat guy, but because I don't think it's a good idea to allow something that renders everyone not able to use (or afford) it uncompetitive.

Especially when/if it violates the sprit of the game (think such competition-specific equipment as has no practical use outside the confines of competition being used in hunting simulation sports), or abominates practical equipment. Like this "pistol"... that would be allowed in PISTOL field target had I not defeated the lobby-

 

[Scotchmo]

"the reality is that prone was deleted because too many shooters were winning from that position and lots of old fat guys couldn’t go prone? Or am I mistaken?"

That's about the gist of it, Mike. True confessions, I'm glad!

…that could be one reason. Then you said:

Especially when/if it violates the sprit of the game (think such competition-specific equipment as has no practical use outside the confines of competition being used in hunting simulation sports), or abominates practical equipment….

Except that last part is a “red herring” as it does not really apply to attached bipods, which I find immensely practical. In fact, my only rifle that that does not have an attached bipod is my Hunter FT “competition” rifle. Google “Hunter bipod” and see what is being used outside of FT bucket and sticks.

 

[d3vnull]

"the reality is that prone was deleted because too many shooters were winning from that position and lots of old fat guys couldn’t go prone? Or am I mistaken?"

…that could be one reason. Then you said:

@Scotchmo notice the quote marks around @AirNGasman remark. He was quoting @Centercut . I believe he has some sarcasm (tongue and cheek or self-depricating humor) after that before he states his opinion which you called the "red herring". At least that is how I interpreted it since they are good friends.

Your second point I 'll leave to him to expound more on the history of.