The TRUTH about glass please

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BUY THAT $650 MTC VIPER PRO BECAUSE OF ITS COST. THAT MUST BE THE ACCEPTED NORM. BECAUSE IT COST THAT MUCH IT HAS TO BE GOOD NO QUESTION AND A $200 UNKNOWN BRAND ALPHA6 SCOPE MUST BE A PIECE OF CRAP SINCE ITS NOT $650.

NOW I GET IT!!! SORRY FOR BEING TOO SLOW TO CATCH ON!!! CANT BE 100% TRUTHFUL I GUESS...

I HAVE 20/15 VISION BTW... 7 MONTHS AGO... HAD AN EYE EXAM...
 
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Get this one... I offered TO BUY THEIR ALPHA6s... WHOMEVER BUYS THEM WHO ARENT HAPPY WITH THEM JUST AS LONG AS THEY HAVE NEVER BEEN MOUNTED.

GO DO A SEARCH CHECK IT HOW CAN I BE BIASED OFFERING TO BUY ALL OF THEM IF ANYBODY TRIES THEM AND ARENT HAPPY WITH THEM?

CAN ANY OF YOU MAKE SUCH OFFERS? KINDA FORCES YOU TO TRY ONE WITH NO STRINGS ATTACHED DOESN'T IT? 

I ORDERED 21 BECAUSE NO ONE WHO BOUGHT ONE OF THEM WAS UNHAPPY SO THAT THREW ME OFF AND I BEEN WAITING TO BUY PEOPLES ALPHA6s BUT NOOOO SO I WAS FORCED TO ORDER MY OWN! TRUTH CAME OUT HAPPY NOW?
 
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Yo, we appreciate your input, I doubt anyone can touch you on ownership. It’s fair to critique when you suggest comparisons that involve scopes a third of the price. You know better. And you also know that Toric weighs a full pound more than the March. On a side note, I find myself looking more for light transmission specs, seems it’s only listed if 90% or greater.


 
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Yo, as Nathan said nobody can doubt you've owned more scopes than pretty much anyone and I think know a great deal.

Your advice is absolutely wanted.

It's just (hopefully) constructive criticism regarding how said advice is often given. Nobody that I am aware of called you biased/ a liar etc. It's just that in describing something like optics you need to give information beyond 'clear' so that people with different eyes and preferences can understand what you're getting at. Funny enough you came closer to doing just that about a couple of scopes than I've seen before in your second paragraph, mostly I think because you were mad at us 😆 but it shows you know what you're looking for.

You are one of very few people in the world who can even consider buying the variety and quantity of scopes (and guns) you do. You must understand that doing what you do is totally out of reach of the vast majority, especially nowadays. Very few (even among those who can afford it) can justify that sort of expense, especially when buying a scope for one new gun in a total collection of three. If they could they'd just buy 20 and go from there, no forums or scope reviews needed 🤷‍♂️

Anyways, just trying to add perspective to what I wrote earlier and assure you I have nothing against you or the majority of your posts. You have boatloads of experience and have the ability to add a huge amount of value to the forum.

Cheers 

Greg 
 
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Hey Yo,

I enjoy your feedback. It's great to have someone with experience contribute so much!!!! I am just curious why you buy so many scopes? Do you buy that many to re-sell and make some side money? I am just really curious. If you don't want to answer I respect that. I just never heard someone buy so many scopes, especially the same scope. How many guns do you have?
 
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YO, our eyes are all different so we "SEE" things differently as to our preference on the "POP factor". My friends and I look through different scopes almost every week and we laugh at each other because we can't believe that the others disagree about the image quality the other persons "SEE" in the various scopes. It cracks me up when you use the SWFA 3-15 as an example of glass quality because that is one of the poorest examples of glass quality for the price I'VE SEEN, lol, and it's actually one my friends agree about.

Well of course we'd need a grading system derived from the use of expensive lab grade optical comparators to "RATE" all the scopes on the market. Which would be a great side business except that the equipment needed might be the cost of a mortgage.

BUT glass is only one consideration when buying a scope. And is why that same SWFA 3-15 is a solid choice for it's better attributes. Nevertheless it has been exceeded by other brands in its price range.

I do like going to PRS type matches and looking through the other guys scopes, these are mostly $1000 to $4700 scopes. It's EYE OPENING!!! But it's been almost a year since I went last.

BTW, that Burris XTR2 8-40 is supposed to have pretty poor glass??? I haven't looked through one, just read about it. I do know the 5-25's were VERY disappointing and have looked through a couple of them, agreeing.
 
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That's why it's best to have a looksee first hand because everyone's eyes are different.

Now I will say that I have to agree with you that the $699 SWFA SS is WAY over priced especially after I looked through the $299 BUSHNELL TAC but think their glass are more than just decent for most airgunners. All scopes should be at least just as clear as them for starters IMHO.

I was bashed for stating the old Burris Rimfire Airgun 8-32x44 AO was very clear too many years ago as well when the BUSHNELL Elite 4000 and 4200 and Big NIKKO and Big BSA were favored. I STILL buy all them Burris Signature Rimfire Airgun scopes I see that show up on the used market. I really like what I see when shooting using them over the BUSHNELL Elite 4200s and new 4500s that kinda suck IMHO in comparison.

Heads up DVOR SUPER SALE!!!
 
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All you Leaper UTG fans! THIS IS DIRT CHEAP! MILKINESS PAST 24X ABOUT AS GOOD AS THE $650 MTC VIPER PRO 5-30x50 PAST 20X. REALLY!
 
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That's why it's best to have a looksee first hand because everyone's eyes are different.



The best way to do that is attend field target and benchrest matches. Also get a .22pb and attend those matches as well. You'll not have to spend 20g+ and the on hand experience is priceless.

Oh, regardless of income level there's always a group of shooters to be found.
 
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Truth of it? Optics and reticles are some what person opinions I‘ve had too many low priced and not so low priced scopes fail mechanically. Life time warrantee means nothing if they don’t honor it. I had a $750 osprey scope fail today. Elevation adjustment will not move the reticle. I’m buying leupold or nightforce from now on. Just too much trouble to deal with the cheap stuff. I’d rather have one or two that I can count on and transfer them as needed. . I hope each of you have better luck then I’ve had for the under $500 wannabes Some might be better then others but can you really count on them? I think the answer is a big maybe. That’s not good enough for me.
 
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I totally respect everyone's opinion and experience.

@bubblerboy, That stinks that they don't honor their warranty and that it failed.



I've come to this conclusion for myself on the optics. 
I can clearly see a main ring of Saturn on 18-24x through my older Japanese Bushnell's. 
With The Bushnell Engage on 10x I can see 4 of Jupiter's 79 moons. 
I was told by some folks that I would need a top tier scope to read mirage. Nah, not true. 


I'm not on a scope for hours at a time. I don't use the elevation of any scope except for my slug shooters that have SWFA SS's and at least a 75-113 yard zero.
I don't like FFP scopes as I prefer to shoot on the lowest magnification I can. I prefer a thin reticle but not a small one.

With apps like ChairGun & StrelokPro I simply zero for a given distance & magnification. If I want to shoot further I turn the power down and use holdover for plinking 12oz can size targets or bigger. 


I personally love the Hawke AMX reticle but a G3 type wouldn't be bad. 
I was going to buy one of these Bushnell's but now I don't care. So I'll share the deals.

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The 2 open box Bushnell's are at CameralandNYC.

Doug is a GREAT guy. Willing to do layaway sales. At least for me w/ $200 down he was.

Only thing I would love about the above scopes is the windage reticles. 
So I'm just going to use what I have for now.

One day a top tier scope would be nice for 2 main reasons. 
Shooting for groups from a mechanical rest. 
More importantly to me is a good scope or spotter would make a better planetary viewing optic over a telescope that views everything upside down and reversed. 
So there it is for me. My truths as I see it. 
I greatly appreciate all the feedback & experience shared in this thread. 
Thank you all.
 
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