Thermal Optics for Hunting

@cmatera Is that with a 384 or 640 thermal sensor? As far as image quality is concerned, what is the IQ comparable to that you've used? Have you used it in high humidity yet? I assume that Pard thermal sensors would be on par with AGM components.
It's a 640. It punches way above its price point. FWIW, I've owned both an Nvision NOX 35 and an Nvision Halo XRF, the latter which many consider to have a better view than than the Trijicon with the 60mm lens. The Pard SA-62 also has the ballistic calculator with the holdover for the distance you want to shoot to. One of the most difficult aspects of shooting at night is judging distance, and is even more difficult when using an air gun.
 
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Humidity is a pointless measure when talking about thermal scopes, without the temperature included that is. Dew point tells you what is what with thermal scopes and degradation of image. You can calculate exactly how much water is in a volume of air with dew point, or just use the web. With a decent thermal, any dewpoint around 50F and less won't degrade your image that much unless you are looking really long range(>200 yards). I just ran a quick example with humidity at 80% for both 80 degrees F temp and 50 degrees F temp. There is just about 2.7 times the water your scope is looking through at 80F vs 50F when the humidity is identical.... Humidity without temp is meaningless.

Absolute humidity is defined as the mass of water in a given volume, there is no percentage, just mass contained in a specific volume of air.

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@karl_h I don’t know about all of those details, but I’ll look into it. Thanks for sharing. I know what I’ve experienced with thermal and night vision regarding humidity (separate issues). For my needs I believe that I can trust what ETX Hans and Jason on the Late Night Vision Show discuss, record, and post. We’re in the same region.
 
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of course not sure what your ultimately after, but after using a thor4 384 and and xsight4k pro i can tell you without hesitation id trade that thor4 for 2 more 4k pros ... the thermal isnt all that and the resolution on anything you can afford is pretty sad compared to the 4k's HD resolution ... yes the illuminator is an extra chore keeping batteries in it mainly, but its not thar big a deal to me .. does a thermal have its place, hmm, id say it may be an advantage if your going to be taking longer shots, like past 80, or picking small stuff out of cover in some situations .. pretty much though for most situations the infrared wins, i wouldnt miss the thor around here, but im not trying to nail a yote at 400 either .. just my 25 cents lol .. inflation .. nevermind lol ..
 
It's a 640. It punches way above its price point. FWIW, I've owned both an Nvision NOX 35 and an Nvision Halo XRF, the latter which many consider to have a better view than than the Trijicon with the 60mm lens. The Pard SA-62 also has the ballistic calculator with the holdover for the distance you want to shoot to. One of the most difficult aspects of shooting at night is judging distance, and is even more difficult when using an air gun.
@cmatera I recalled tht you had the N-Vision Halo. I have a buddy with one and he’s shared good things about it with me. From recordings I’ve seen, the IQ doesn’t look too superior to some other 640 units out there (Pulsar and Infiray), but I’m told in person the images look good in the Halo scopes.

I’m a big proponent of using LRFs with thermal and night vision riflescopes for airgunners. As a hunter who doesn’t typically bait animals, it doesn’t make much sense to not have one. @delooper discusses his situation where using an LRF with a thermal scope isn’t necessary. When you have some time, can you post photos of animals taken with your Pard SA? Maybe post them in the “All Things Pard” thread as well. I think that would be helpful to others who may be considering a Pard thermal unit.
 
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@dizzums I’m not trying to shoot beyond 100 yards at night with an air rifle if I can help it. For me yotes will linger just inside of the timber. So to have a thermal unit that can pickup their heat signatures amongst plant material in high humidity helps when tracking them and calling them. I don’t know what YouTubers are doing or what’s happening in their footage that doesn’t get posted, but my stands have been more complicated than what can be seen on film. There’s significantly more to it than is shown and having adequate tools makes the job easier for me.

Look at the change in IQ in this video around the 15:13 mark. The ability of the unit to continue to read the heat signature of the yote when it ran into the woods is important to me.
 
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@cmatera I recalled tht you had the N-Vision Halo. I have a buddy with one and he’s shared good things about it with me. From recordings I’ve seen, the IQ doesn’t look too superior to some other 640 units out there (Pulsar and Infiray), but I’m told in person the images look good in the Halo scopes.

I’m a big proponent of using LRFs with thermal and night vision riflescopes for airgunners. As a hunter who doesn’t typically bait animals, it doesn’t make much sense to not have one. @delooper discusses his situation where using an LRF with a thermal scope isn’t necessary. When you have some time, can you post photos of animals taken with your Pard SA? Maybe post them in the “All Things Pard” thread as well. I think that would be helpful to others who may be considering a Pard thermal unit.
Like many, I use a handheld thermal monocular for detection and the scope only to shoot when they are close. The scanner quality is far more important than the scope. The scanner is used for hours, the scope for minutes. Guys who need to save $$ will buy a 640 scanner and a 384 thermal scope. If money is really tight, some use a handheld thermal scanner and regular night vision or even digital night vision. My scanner is a Pulsar Helion XP 50 Pro. When I use my PB's the LRF is not as important. They shoot much flatter in trajectory than air rifles.
 
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@Ezana4CE What is IQ?

Seriously considering a PARD thermal unit but the narrow FOV has me vasilating. FWIW- when looking at FOV, each degree works out to a hair over 5.7 feet at 100 yards.

ETA- mK is sensitivity to variation of the heat signature. A lower number is better.
Hz is the refresh rate or similar to frames to second. A higher number is better.
 
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@Ezana4CE What is IQ?

Seriously considering a PARD thermal unit but the narrow FOV has me vasilating. FWIW- when looking at FOV, each degree works out to a hair over 5' at 100 yards.
@Hal4son "IQ" means image quality. If you grab a Pard thermal scope, I'm interested in the image quality of the optic. Please post pics.
 
Thanks delooper. Did you have a chance to try the TH 50 C Bolt before you chose the Rico RH 50? Or were there features on the Rico that you helped you decide?
I do like how the bolt can pass for a “regular” scope, other than that, I’m wondering how one would choose between the two. The Rico may be a little more expensive, but not by much… 3.5x vs 3x base..
I looked at both, I really liked the bolt better. I don’t know if it was the screen or what but I felt it was better. We had(all640) 2agm,2 Bering optics,2 Rico, and 2 pulsar set out. Then he brought out the bolt as me and the wife were handing them back and forth setting them in order. She pretty much said buy the bolt, it was by far my favorite in my price range. I got a quick glimps through a halo, but still liked the bolt. I think pulsar makes the best scanners, but this is just all my opinions. Everyone’s eyes are different and technology is alway evolving. Fusion and thermtec are two other brands to look at. It’s hard to beat comparing scopes back to back. I wish my bolt had the red monochromatic like pulsar, it’s easier on your nightvision. I really like the button layout on the bolt.
 
If anyone has had an opportunity to use a Pulsar Talion XG35 (640) or the XQ35 Pro let us know about your experience with it. The Talion XG35 at $4299, is not bad for a compact 640 unit (29.5oz). I like that it has a removable rechargeable battery (I wish they'd ditch the proprietary batteries). BUT I haven't seen them with the LRF feature. Same thing with their Thermion Duo models. If either had the LRF feature or an option to add an LRF module that would be great. For the size compared to other thermal riflescopes, the Talion looks promising for airguns.
 
Opinion on a Pard TA32-25 (640 384) Thermal Handheld Monocular (Spotter). I can appreciate this man's critique - metal housing, uses a removable 18650, IQ leaves something to be desired. Recorded clips of thermal images are included.


Edit: i mixed up units. I’ll fix this post later. It’s been a helluva day.
 
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I thought the video from the PARD and those old Brits was pretty good. The 18650 battery is a big plus.

Earlier when I said the PARD had a small FOV, I should have specified that I was looking hard at the TD32 multispectral (combo thermal/night vision) scope. I'd been hoping to find something like that but 5.7/2.6 FOV or 32'/15' feet @ 100 yards. (thermal/NV) IMHO that FOV is too narrow to gamble $4k on.

In the past, I had a PARD 008 mounted in conjuntion with a PULSAR thermal on one rifle meant for sorting possums/raccoons from the barn cats (I have one cat that looks more like a raccoon than a raccoon does in the thermal.) But the 008 would turn off during recoil. Odd since it does just fine on a 243 running it solo.
 
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Has anyone run any Burris clip-ons or dedicated thermal riflescopes? If so, what's your experience been with those units?
The Burris hasn't seemed to grab any real traction. When they first came out I was enquiring about them on other platforms and caught a lot of snears and jeers without substance relating to their merits (or lack of).

I've watched a lot of videos like the one you posted from Outdoor Legacy. Notice that they do not carry Burris at their store. I do not think that is a negative regarding the quality of Burris but I do think it shows some hesitancy from a well respected retailer. Alternately there was no delay in putting the new thermal from Sightmark on that store shelf.
 
The Burris hasn't seemed to grab any real traction. When they first came out I was enquiring about them on other platforms and caught a lot of snears and jeers without substance relating to their merits (or lack of).

I've watched a lot of videos like the one you posted from Outdoor Legacy. Notice that they do not carry Burris at their store. I do not think that is a negative regarding the quality of Burris but I do think it shows some hesitancy from a well respected retailer. Alternately there was no delay in putting the new thermal from Sightmark on that store shelf.
@Hal4son There are other products that they Legacy do not carry like Arken NV, and Pard NV, Pard thermal units. I like the Pard NV those having owned a couple and folks seem to like the Arkens. I've also used a couple of Burris thermal products and they seem comparable to what their competitors offer.

Here's a Burris gen2 hand scanner review.


Imagery from what appears to have been a gen1 Burris BTH hand held thermal scanner
 
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