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Twist Rates & Springers: What's the Gamo Black Bull Barrel's twist rate in .22 caliber?

Hello everyone,
I have a question regarding Gamo's barrels, specifically the twist rates in the bores of their barrels... First of all, before I start interogating folks here about the whole matter, I'd like to point out, that I do realize that a suitable twist rate for about 18 ft/lbs springers is 1:16".

Gamo's springers in their "1000 fps" category/family of airguns are nominaly built around a power plant that generates (in expansion), some 18 ft/lbs of muzzle energy (that's 24 Joules), meaning that a .22 caliber, 15.89 gr JSB Jumbo will have an output energy level of 16 ft/lbs, or a velocity of 650 fps. I have one such Gamo rifle, in this "1000fps" category, it's the Black Bear in .22cal, and I'm really satisfied with its accuracy. I guess it's got both, a healthy power plant and a good barrel (crown especially), with a corresponding twist rate.

However, I've also got a Gamo Varmint or Big Cat 1000, as it titled here in Europe, which I think would profit from a replacement of the old "pencil" barrel with a new one, which is thicker (talking about this Bull Barrel here), and that's why I've decided to look into bore twist rates as well, before actually purchsing anything, that would turn out usless afteward. I reckon these Bull Barrels dampen harmonics pretty well, since they're thick and have additional supports/shroud in them. Therefore they probably offer good accuracy too.

The reason I'm asking the question on the twist rate of this Bull Barrel, is because I've read somewhere, some time ago, that the older Gamo springers, including some of the more modern ones (not really sure about their modern guns, but this is plausible nevertheless), have a 1:25 twist rate in the bore! That's not your typical .22 cal. springer barrel twist rate, from most other manufacturers. That's a rather slow twist rate - it should be around 1:16, not 1:25. Once such Gamo model that had this kind of twist in it, was the older CFX (the one with the metal trigger - modern Gamo trigger are all plastic), and I know that for certain, but what about this Bull Barrel, what twist rate does it have?! Some people have speculated that Gamo's springers, both old and new, have a whole wide array of different twists in their barrels, everything from 1:12 on lower powered guns, 1:16 - most common, to 1:18 and all the way up to 1:25.

It makes me wonder, why they put 1:25 twist rate in the barrel of the older CFX? Would the older CFX even be accurate with heavier pellets or slugs - with slugs probably not a chance, but you never know; Physics have a strange sense of humor ;)

So, if anyone knows what twist rate does this barrel have, I'd like to know very much and thank you in advance :)
Have a nice remainder of the week folks!
 
Just measure it yourself with a cleaning rod or somthing that will hold in the rifling and turn with ot as you push or pull .. put a dot and start line on the rod pull or push it until it rolls back to its start point then measure from the start line to the end of one full rotation and thats your twist rate. So if you pull 1/2 turn in 8 inch then it's a 1 in 16 .

Anyway i posyed my guns rate a few time at gta and fuzzy brain thinking back my gamo was 1 in 24 ?

I can easy go out in a few and recheck that from said above way.
 
Hello everyone,
I have a question regarding Gamo's barrels, specifically the twist rates in the bores of their barrels... First of all, before I start interogating folks here about the whole matter, I'd like to point out, that I do realize that a suitable twist rate for about 18 ft/lbs springers is 1:16".

Gamo's springers in their "1000 fps" category/family of airguns are nominaly built around a power plant that generates (in expansion), some 18 ft/lbs of muzzle energy (that's 24 Joules), meaning that a .22 caliber, 15.89 gr JSB Jumbo will have an output energy level of 16 ft/lbs, or a velocity of 650 fps. I have one such Gamo rifle, in this "1000fps" category, it's the Black Bear in .22cal, and I'm really satisfied with its accuracy. I guess it's got both, a healthy power plant and a good barrel (crown especially), with a corresponding twist rate.

However, I've also got a Gamo Varmint or Big Cat 1000, as it titled here in Europe, which I think would profit from a replacement of the old "pencil" barrel with a new one, which is thicker (talking about this Bull Barrel here), and that's why I've decided to look into bore twist rates as well, before actually purchsing anything, that would turn out usless afteward. I reckon these Bull Barrels dampen harmonics pretty well, since they're thick and have additional supports/shroud in them. Therefore they probably offer good accuracy too.

The reason I'm asking the question on the twist rate of this Bull Barrel, is because I've read somewhere, some time ago, that the older Gamo springers, including some of the more modern ones (not really sure about their modern guns, but this is plausible nevertheless), have a 1:25 twist rate in the bore! That's not your typical .22 cal. springer barrel twist rate, from most other manufacturers. That's a rather slow twist rate - it should be around 1:16, not 1:25. Once such Gamo model that had this kind of twist in it, was the older CFX (the one with the metal trigger - modern Gamo trigger are all plastic), and I know that for certain, but what about this Bull Barrel, what twist rate does it have?! Some people have speculated that Gamo's springers, both old and new, have a whole wide array of different twists in their barrels, everything from 1:12 on lower powered guns, 1:16 - most common, to 1:18 and all the way up to 1:25.

It makes me wonder, why they put 1:25 twist rate in the barrel of the older CFX? Would the older CFX even be accurate with heavier pellets or slugs - with slugs probably not a chance, but you never know; Physics have a strange sense of humor ;)

So, if anyone knows what twist rate does this barrel have, I'd like to know very much and thank you in advance :)
Have a nice remainder of the week folks!
See.. 12 inch for 1/2 rotation.= 1-24 twist.. see i marked the rod with a start line and rotation index dot.


Anyway dont matter if it rotated a 1/4 ,1/8, 1/2. Just do the math for one whole full rotation.
gamotwist2.jpg
ganotwist.jpg


I forgot... Gamo .22 whisper fusion mach1
 
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Just measure it yourself with a cleaning rod or somthing that will hold in the rifling and turn with ot as you push or pull .. put a dot and start line on the rod pull or push it until it rolls back to its start point then measure from the start line to the end of one full rotation and thats your twist rate. So if you pull 1/2 turn in 8 inch then it's a 1 in 16 .

Anyway i posyed my guns rate a few time at gta and fuzzy brain thinking back my gamo was 1 in 24 ?

I can easy go out in a few and recheck that from said above way.
I've heard of this method of measuring before, just haven't exactly delved into it, but if you say it's feasible and can be done, then I'll buy the barrel and perform the measurement myself, thanks for the info. Now that I think about it, I've really got nothing to lose by buying the barrel, this one's compatible with my gun, doubt that other barrels would be, but this whole barrel&breech assembly is. I'll take it, install it and see what happens + I'll look this method up to see whether there's anything else I should take into account when making the measurement.

One more thing; Don't you think that a 1:18 or 1:16 twist would be a better option for stabilizing .22 cal. pellets, especially those alloyed ones?

Airgunners who shoot Gamo guns usually use alloy pellets or coated ones, because they shoot better; I remember when HardAirMagazine tested out the Gamo Swarm Maxxim in .22, and it only shot well with alloy (I think the pellets were made out of zinc) .218 H&N Field Target Trophy Green diabolos, that just barely came in at 10 grains, they were very light for .22, even for .20, but they sure yielded great results at a stunning velocity of 980 fps! I only believed the summary of that test in their article, when I saw that Steve from AEAC on YouTube got very similar results with that gun and the same type of pellets, but he also tested the FTT Power pellets and got good results with them too - note, that they are copper coated, which means that just like the FTT Green pellets, they'll travel some 15-20% faster than lead ones. So, what I'm getting at here is, that these alloy pellets travel at somewhat higher velocities than lead ones, but they're still accurate out to some 80+ yards, and that also means (at least I undestand it this way), that in order for these alloyed pellets to be stable, the twist rate of the bore must be faster, therefore lower in number, instead of 1:24 for instance, it must be closer to 1:18-19 or most likely 1:16, as that is supposedly the best twist rate for .22 caliber pellets, as it likely well stabilizes both lighter and heavier pellets. That's what I used to read on various forums back in the day anyway. And now I stand here a little confused, because I don't know why did Gamo use a 1:24 or 25 for that matter, twist rate in their barrels, when everyone else, almost every other manufacturer used from 1:14, 1:15 1/2, 1:16, or 1:19 (in example: Benjamin Trail in .25 cal), in their barrels for underlevers and break barrel airguns.

Here's HardAirMags review on the Maxxim Swarm:

Here's Steve's results, from AEAC, with that Gamo gun (and a Maxxim barrel, which is somewhat similar to this Bull barrel I'm lookin' to buy):

...And then there's this interesting piece of info on GTA that I found:

So what do you think?
 
See.. 12 inch for 1/2 rotation.= 1-24 twist.. see i marked the rod with a start line and rotation index dot.


Anyway dont matter if it rotated a 1/4 ,1/8, 1/2. Just do the math for one whole full rotation.View attachment 360039View attachment 360040

I forgot... Gamo .22 whisper fusion mach1
Thank you for this, I'll do a test/ practice check on my Black Bear .22, which has a Storm barrel on it, to see if it's got the same 1:24 twist or not. Either way, I'm going to be able to partially confirm or reject the assumption of some people, who say that Gamo's barrel models all have different twist rates, of which either the 1:16 or 24 is the most common; As I've said I don't know about that, but I'll try to find out.

Again, thanks for this, it'll come in very handy!
 
My hw/r9 are 1-16 .. i guess theres arguments , pros, cons on any of it .

All i know as long as it shoots to my satisfaction its nothing but a afterthought...lol

As far as them auto loader guns .... Just adds one more thing to maintain or get broken . Its not hard to just cock , load ,shoot a old fashioned single shot break barrel. Also in gamo go with the lasted gen3i loader. The older ones could cause pellet damage when loading a pellet and cause more unnecessary flyers or wide groupings..
 
My hw/r9 are 1-16 .. i guess theres arguments , pros, cons on any of it .

All i know as long as it shoots to my satisfaction its nothing but a afterthought...lol

As far as them auto loader guns .... Just adds one more thing to maintain or get broken . Its not hard to just cock , load ,shoot a old fashioned single shot break barrel. Also in gamo go with the lasted gen3i loader. The older ones could cause pellet damage when loading a pellet and cause more unnecessary flyers or wide groupings..
Yeah, I guess there are pros and cons to it... it probably also hangs on the kind of material the pellets are made of, and naturally on their weight too.

By the way, the only auto-loader I have is an Artemis SR-900 in .177, not the most accurate gun out there, but certainly more so than the older 1st and 2nd GEN Gamo 10x-s... And just as you've already pointed out, the downside to it is that it doesn't have iron sights, however, I've had some sort of a dampa-mount made for me by one of my friends, that actually seems to dampen vibrations quite well. The thing's been made out of the base of the Gamo's RRR and then fit onto the railed portion of the gun's receiver and topped of with a one-piece mount, into which I've had the scope tube mounted, a Gamo 4x32mm WR scope that is. The gun kicks, doesn't exactly shoot a hole through hole, but it's powerful and really fun. I'm going to make a review on this gun sometime in the future, because I haven't seen any proper reviews on this thing out there, except one time on HardAir (at least I think it was on HAM). The good thing about this rifle though is that it loads consistently and that its probe doesn't damage the skirts on pellets when going into battery, or well, when chambering the pellet if you will. Fun gun.
 
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Another tid bit ill offer up is i never biy a air gun with out sights .. especially a springer.. if or when your scooes busted your done . If its got irons you can keep on shooting it not wishing you could waiting on another scope..

Also gamo outlet has that in .177

https://gamousa.com/product/swarm-maxxim-10x-gen-2-177-manufacturer-refurbished/

Then no sights = no sale here for me...
True that, I hope that Gamo piece of glass on my Artemis will hold up... time will tell.
One more thing I completely forgot to mention is that this Artemis comes with 3 magazines (compatible with stormrider mags), in .177 one can hold up to 9 rounds. Mine's in 177.
 
True that, I hope that Gamo piece of glass on my Artemis will hold up... time will tell.
One more thing I completely forgot to mention is that this Artemis comes with 3 magazines (compatible with stormrider mags), in .177 one can hold up to 9 rounds. Mine's in 177.
I got one good gamo package scope . Lol
r9,50y,cphp.177,gamopackagescope3.jpg
r9,cphp,50y,gamopackagescope2.jpg


It does fine.
 
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I got one good gamo package scope . Lol
View attachment 360129View attachment 360130

It does fine.
Does it like JSB exacts or you're only shooting these Crosmans through it?
My Big Cat/Varmint sure does, but poorly stabilizes JSB heavies, that's why I want to replace the barrel - and I'm going with a .22 this time, because I've got a bulk of .22 ammo, which was intended for that Hatsan 125 that I got last year. But the 125 only likes pellets that seal the bore well, pellets like the Baracuda 18, Norica Prometeus, H&N 21gr slugs in .218... but JSBs just don't give much power, and so I've got a bulk of .22 JSBs left, however I am surprised that they group rather well at 30 yards. Can't wait to try out some JSB heavies in .218, when I get them from a friend.
 
All i shoot 99.4276% of the time is cphp .177&.22. You could check my gamo group posts on the wfm1 irons and scoped using cphp .22. I post for the heck of it to post somthing here. I think thete post from 10m to 100y with it. Nothing spectacular just backyard fun shooting
Oh, I see. Well I also make those out-of-box and "after this/that many years" reviews of my airguns just for fun, but as it turned out, some of these reviews also tell a tale of mods, tuning and maintenace of guns throughout the years, and whether certain components, or the guns themselves, as was the case with my Cometa 300, withstand the test of time or otherwise not - in my case, this is always meant as to the date by which the review had been written, if something else comes up with any of my guns, past the time I've posted the reviews, I'll always keep you guys up to date with what exactly has happened and I'll then make a subsequent update on the developements/fixes.

Now, here's what I think of the CPHPs, they're your ( US ) version of all around, do it all pellets. These Crosman pellets are to you Americans, what JSBs are to us Europeans, especially the visegrad folks, the French and to most of the balkans. The Germans and the scandinavians on the other hand, mostly only shoot H&Ns, RWS pellets, stuff from Umarex (mostly BBs that is), and Falke pellets... While the Russians shoot Kvintors.

I'll check those posts you've made on your Gamo groups with these CPHPs, yeah.
 
Crosman is about all here walkin local without all the mail order hassle..

Not that i won't shoot the other's just too inconvenient to..
I know, that's in essence what I meant. In my place we get the JSBs and COALs everywhere like that, so that it's not necessary to order them via some online store, but given the fact that I live in a small country, the postage isn't too expensive and the shipment gets here within 1-2 days after being ordered. I guess that one of the pros of living in a small country, that you can cross from one end to another in less than 8 hours, possibly even 6, if the traffic's cool.
 
I guess they cant hold a high price control if they made them more readly available.. i think the importers now do more to hold you hostage by limiting in store . I just find it funny that you can near buy all you want mail order but not the first tin in any local store that sells air gun / sporting goods stuff.. ..
I noticed that too with certain merchants, but just the other way around, if you go to the in person, they'll have much more in stock and perhaps also give you a discount, but if you order online they will limit the stock. Also, the current price of a tin of .22 JSB Jumbos, with a 500ct is 22.5 euros, making it cheaper to go and buy in person than to order online.
 
Ya, i guess that cornerstone of the free market / capitalism here is a history book thing. ( Non crt history book that is)
Well my country got independence and emerged from a commie country, guess we've only been experiencing "capitalism" for the last 30+ years since we became independent... Neo-liberal "capitalism" (that's now woke AF) that is, still refering in almost every manner to the former system, sadly.
 
I cant remember who said it but " we are becoming what our forefathers excaped from".

And there aint no mayflower to load up on to find better anymore ..lol

Its amazing how stupid the younger generation is here on basic civics and what there just throwing away over facebook accounts.. the amount thats been lost just in my time is unbelievable.
 
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