Vulcan 25 cal VS Wildcat 25 cal

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hsnmz

Member
Nov 11, 2015
407
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Paksitan, Pakistan
Same ranges i.e. 50 and 100 yards. Same conditions i.e. Slight wind from left. Both guns at almost same velocity. Shooting jsb kings unsorted. Here are the results, have shared the Wildcat result earlier but here are those again. Measured in cm edge to edge.

Wildcat 50 yards





Vulcan 50 yards



Wildcat 100 yards



Vulcan 100 yards



One thing that I noticed is that at 100 yards the Wildcat hits exactly where the strelock shows the drop to be. But Vulcan hits about half mildot higher than what strelock suggests. I had to slightly increase the ballistic coefficient for Vulcan in strelock to correct the drop. What could be the reason for that? Does ballistic coefficient differ from gun to gun?
 
Drunk"Scope height" parameter, if not set right, can also affect the results quite significally.
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Just rechecked. The scope height for Vulcan measures 2.4" to be precise whereas it is mentioned as 2.5" in the strelock so not any difference there. I had to use bc of 0.046 to get the correct holdover.
Wildcat scope height is also 2.5". I am using the 0.036 bc and it's working perfect.
 
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"hsnmz"Same ranges i.e. 50 and 100 yards. Same conditions i.e. Slight wind from left. Both guns at almost same velocity. Shooting jsb kings unsorted. Here are the results, have shared the Wildcat result earlier but here are those again. Measured in cm edge to edge.

Wildcat 50 yards





Vulcan 50 yards



Wildcat 100 yards



Vulcan 100 yards



One thing that I noticed is that at 100 yards the Wildcat hits exactly where the strelock shows the drop to be. But Vulcan hits about half mildot higher than what strelock suggests. I had to slightly increase the ballistic coefficient for Vulcan in strelock to correct the drop. What could be the reason for that? Does ballistic coefficient differ from gun to gun?
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Can you explain where the target horizontal well vertical
 
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Sniperqty
Can you explain where the target horizontal well vertical
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My brother, the target was a 4 x 2 feet hard paper placed vertically. I am not sure if I understood you correctly but if you are asking about the spread of both guns then at 100 yards the spread of Wildcat is more horizontal whereas the spread of Vulcan is more vertical. strelock showed a drop of 3.5 mildots at 10x magnification at 100 yards but Vulcan was hitting at 3rd mildot. Wildcat was hitting at exact 3.5 mildots. So Vulcan was hitting half mildot higher.
 
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Sniperqty
Can you explain where the target horizontal well vertical
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Yes my friend the Wildcat shots are horizontal which means they are more effected by wind. Vulcan shots are vertical which means the barrel is more sensitive to difference in pellet weight but pellets don't get much effected by wind. So I can assume that if I sort the pellets by weight then Vulcan should shoot them more accurately. Also the smooth twist barrel is more forgiving when it comes to shooting the pellets unsorted but its twist and choke is making the pellets more sensitive to wind.
Seems every gun or you can say every barrel has its strengths and weaknesses.
 
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"hsnmz"
"Sniperqty"
Can you explain where the target horizontal well vertical
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Yes my friend the Wildcat shots are horizontal which means they are more effected by wind. Vulcan shots are vertical which means the barrel is more sensitive to difference in pellet weight but pellets don't get much effected by wind. So I can assume that if I sort the pellets by weight then Vulcan should shoot them more accurately. Also the smooth twist barrel is more forgiving when it comes to shooting the pellets unsorted but its twist and choke is making the pellets more sensitive to wind.
Seems every gun or you can say every barrel has its strengths and weaknesses.
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It doesn't necessarily mean that.

It's just a few groups for a start so it could just as easily mean that a gust of wind blew when you shot the Wildcat group. Two identicle pellets flying at the same speed from two different guns would both be effected by wind... The Vulcan does not have any special wind effect minimization technology unless you invented it. If you did, please can I buy one?

It could also be that you didn't shoot as well with the Wildcat. Could be that you are more used to the Vulcan or it happens to fit you better. 

Another potential explanation is on is that the speed was wrong for the Wildcat. I have read that ST barrels sometimes do better at slightly lower velocities than LW or CZ barrels. Setting them up to shoot at the same speed might seem like a fair test but a more meaningful test would be to find the best pellet and speed combo for each rifle. 

The Wildcat I tried didn't have a horizontal spread like that and if you look at some of the groups posted by others, you find the same. It might be worth figuring out why it's happening on your one. Both guns are capable of comparable accuracy at that distance. 




 
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Read somewhere that horizontal groups (besides the wind) may be from the expansion/contraction of the air tank as it affects the barrel band/shroud. That is if there is some physical interaction between them like the same barrel band/clamp also holding the air tank, etc. I would assume that for the same reason (in some setups) the group could also be affected vertically. If the air tank when being filled starts to expand and someway affect the barrel/barrel mount at a certain pressure (let's say 200bar) it may shift POI on the way down from 250 bar when it drops below (for example) 200 bar and will no longer has any affect on the barrel mount setup. I would assume this could be noticed only during a longer string of shots, not after one 5-shot group. Just my 2 cents...
 
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"fe7565"Read somewhere that horizontal groups (besides the wind) may be from the expansion/contraction of the air tank as it affects the barrel band/shroud. That is if there is some physical interaction between them like the same barrel band/clamp also holding the air tank, etc. I would assume that for the same reason (in some setups) the group could also be affected vertically. If the air tank when being filled starts to expand and someway affect the barrel/barrel mount at a certain pressure (let's say 200bar) it may shift POI on the way down from 250 bar when it drops below (for example) 200 bar and will no longer has any affect on the barrel mount setup. I would assume this could be noticed only during a longer string of shots, not after one 5-shot group. Just my 2 cents...
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Hard to say from two groups. 

I don't know much about the issue you mentioned but, when I have accuracy issues due to a problem with the gun, my groups are usually more erratic than that (I.e. they don't stay on a neat line). I'd expect to see more flyers. 

The guns I have with metal barrel bands like that happen to be the most accurate ones I own. Not saying it's because of the bands. It's just a coincidence. They haven't casued me any issues though. 

In fact, the only time I can recall having issues with a horizontal shift of the poi, is when the scope is not mounted properly or the scope rail is loose. 
 
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zebra
It doesn't necessarily mean that.

It's just a few groups for a start so it could just as easily mean that a gust of wind blew when you shot the Wildcat group. Two identicle pellets flying at the same speed from two different guns would both be effected by wind... The Vulcan does not have any special wind effect minimization technology unless you invented it. If you did, please can I buy one?

It could also be that you didn't shoot as well with the Wildcat. Could be that you are more used to the Vulcan or it happens to fit you better. 

Another potential explanation is on is that the speed was wrong for the Wildcat. I have read that ST barrels sometimes do better at slightly lower velocities than LW or CZ barrels. Setting them up to shoot at the same speed might seem like a fair test but a more meaningful test would be to find the best pellet and speed combo for each rifle. 

The Wildcat I tried didn't have a horizontal spread like that and if you look at some of the groups posted by others, you find the same. It might be worth figuring out why it's happening on your one. Both guns are capable of comparable accuracy at that distance. 

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All of your points are valid. I have also read that st barrels shoot well at lower velocity. Ted also said somewhere that it is best to shoot at around 900 fps. Mine is at 890 at the moment. But a friend of mine has an impact and his 25 barrel shoots best at 950 fps with jsb kings.

When i was shooting both guns the wind was light and consistent from left to right. And as you know that every barrel shapes up and spins the pellet differently so that's why the thought of one getting more effected by the wind.
Will shoot again and share the results.
 
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Ok Family lets talk a little bit about ST barrels....if the smooth twist barrels are not a great barrel then why is it that at the EBR 2016 (and many years before that as well) 75 and 100 yard competition FX made up 75% of guns and Daystate and WAR made up the rest? I know it wasn’t because only FX lovers and AGN members where invited or that it TAG members and or Vulcan and Mutant lovers where not invited (whom can be extremely loyal by the way)? Even the Cricket made a showing in the speed shooting event, maybe because we all know that from best to worse barrels are the BSA, LW, CZ, then ST.... NOT. Maybe we all should stop being so judgmental. We all have the right to like what we like.
 
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Scott_MCTMy .22 WildCat shoots WAY better at higher velocity than my AirWolf and Cricket. What blows my mind is my RAW. It shoots a 28 grn JSB at 947 FPS and plants these pellets in groups as tight as my .22 guns which I need to keep under 900 FPS. Not sure who makes the barrels for RAW but they know how to stabilize a pellet.
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Exactly what I have seen. A friend of mine has a RAW HM1000X and his is shooting jsb kings at 960fps and is as accurate as any gun can be. RAW is no doubt in another league.
 
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Ginuwine1969Ok Family lets talk a little bit about ST barrels....if the smooth twist barrels are not a great barrel then why is it that at the EBR 2016 (and many years before that as well) 75 and 100 yard competition FX made up 75% of guns and Daystate and WAR made up the rest? I know it wasn’t because only FX lovers and AGN members where invited or that it TAG members and or Vulcan and Mutant lovers where not invited (whom can be extremely loyal by the way)? Even the Cricket made a showing in the speed shooting event, maybe because we all know that from best to worse barrels are the BSA, LW, CZ, then ST.... NOT. Maybe we all should stop being so judgmental. We all have the right to like what we like.
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As I always say curret Pcps are way more accurate than us shooters. Everyone has their own experience. For me my both guns are perfect shooters.
A friend has an Impact in 22 and 25 cals. His 22 cal was laser accurate but 25 wasn't shooting that well. Then he cleaned/polished the barrel with jb bore paste and now it shoots perfect. Interestingly the 25 cal is set to shoot at 940fps. Any lower than that and it looses the accuracy. 22 shoots fine at 900fps.
Another friends impact in 22 cal doesn't group well. Will give it a jb bore paste clean to see.
So the point is that you spend some serious money on a gun and still you need to work on it to shot well. For me that is not acceptable. My Wildcat wasn't also shooting good out of the box. Johan advised me to use jb bore paste. After that it's shooting fine. That was the first time I used jb bore paste. Vulcan didn't need any such treatment. RAW did not require any treatment. Edgun shot perfect out of the box. There may be some guns having issues but their percentage with respect to the total guns sold is less than that of Fx. My Wildcat has a slow leak from regulator vent hole. I have tried everything to get rid of it but it still leaks. So i have left it as is. There are several other owners having the same problem. Is it a design problem or quality issue I am not sure.
 
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I have shoot nearly every brand of barrel and we are fortunate to live in a time that barrels regardless of brand just tend to be much more capable than the shooter.

In regards to your difference in poi and strelok. The ST barrels will always produce a lower BC than a conventional rifled barrel. It is the one short coming of the ST barrels. That alone would explain why you had to increase BC for the Vulcan to match your down range performance. It is just a by product of slamming a speeding pellet from a smooth bore to the rifles section.

Please understand I am not bashing the ST barrels, just pointing out something that could explain your difference in Strelok.
 
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