Just curious who here might have experience to share hunting waterfowl with an air shotgun
Air Venturi Waterfowl?
- Thread starter Jmoses111
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I'm not sure that a PCP 'shotgun' would produce enough pressure to push steel shot fast enough for a clean kill. Perhaps if you used a very large caliber, like .50 or .82, maybe (?). But at the weight needed, it'd be tough to attain the speed needed for longer shots.
Most powder burners push steel shot at around 1400-1500FPS as steel shot doesn't carry the necessary inertia as far as lead, or Bismuth will (since it's lighter). So, to compensate, it's pushed faster than the usual lead shot, which is normally closer to 1200-1300FPS.
Waterfowl loads are also larger size shot to help with this compensation and needed for larger birds than quail or dove.
A Magnum Duck or Goose load carries around 1.5-2.0 Ounces of shot (Volumetrically), which a load to push with air.
Maybe I'm all wet (see what I did there...."waterfowl"), but I don't think that it would be a good idea, or work very well.
My 2¢ anyway.
mike
Most powder burners push steel shot at around 1400-1500FPS as steel shot doesn't carry the necessary inertia as far as lead, or Bismuth will (since it's lighter). So, to compensate, it's pushed faster than the usual lead shot, which is normally closer to 1200-1300FPS.
Waterfowl loads are also larger size shot to help with this compensation and needed for larger birds than quail or dove.
A Magnum Duck or Goose load carries around 1.5-2.0 Ounces of shot (Volumetrically), which a load to push with air.
Maybe I'm all wet (see what I did there...."waterfowl"), but I don't think that it would be a good idea, or work very well.
My 2¢ anyway.
mike
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That's the thing. One would need a firefighters bottle on a pack frame to hope to have enough air to push an ounce or more of shot at a usable velocity. I still shoot some trap and used to load a lot of shotgun rounds for that pursuit. While it MAY be possible, practicality nixes it.
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Have you perchance seen the latest and greatest in shotgun ammo? Tungsten baby, often called TSS, Tungsten shot is a game changer. Tungsten shot is 1.7 times more dense than lead. It is also very hard and does not deform when fired, special thick shot cup type wads must be used to protect shotgun bores. Costly stuff @10 bucks a round or thereabouts. TSS has become the shizzle for turkey hunters, yup with the .410 bore shotgun. #9 TSS hits like #4 lead pellets, much greater downrange velocity thanks to that density. Yes 10 bucks a shell sounds nuts. Realistically, how much did we spend to get in to the field to chase that turkey? How many shots might we expend per day hunting turkeys? Less than one would be my guess if all hunters are considered and averaged. 10 bucks for the round that kills that turkey? Sign me up. The little .410 becomes a genuine killing machine, it is all in the ammo!
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I appreciate all of the input, I normally use a 28 gauge and shoot 5/8 to an ounce loads including tss and bismuth. I think I’ll do some load/pattern/lethality testing if I do pick up a pcp
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I too shoot a 28 gauge, amongst others, but favor the 28 and .410.
In looking at my empty hulls, I'm somewhat surprised that someone hasn't come up with a practical method to reload the empty. plastic hulls for air (using lead) gun use IF there is enough air to push said round. (28 or .410)
My thought is the empty hull can be trimmed down and a shortened wad-shot-cup used for the shot, which is then capped with a cardboard cap or even a standard crimp. The primer is of course pushed out and a probe with an O-Ring is used as the air injector to make it all work. The probe would be just long enough to assure that it doesn't touch the bottom of the wad cup and the O-Ring would seal at eh hull brass base. Of course there would be modifications to the barrel/chamber.
I'm no machinist, but it seems feasible to me.
mike
In looking at my empty hulls, I'm somewhat surprised that someone hasn't come up with a practical method to reload the empty. plastic hulls for air (using lead) gun use IF there is enough air to push said round. (28 or .410)
My thought is the empty hull can be trimmed down and a shortened wad-shot-cup used for the shot, which is then capped with a cardboard cap or even a standard crimp. The primer is of course pushed out and a probe with an O-Ring is used as the air injector to make it all work. The probe would be just long enough to assure that it doesn't touch the bottom of the wad cup and the O-Ring would seal at eh hull brass base. Of course there would be modifications to the barrel/chamber.
I'm no machinist, but it seems feasible to me.
mike
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That would be pretty awesome to be able to recycle powder burning shells into reloads for the PCP!
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I have not. The concern with Tungsten shot is the hardness of course. If experimenting shot cups are the key, or use a cheapo garden gun for testing. The major ammo manufacturer's are now loading Tungsten shotshells the focus being Turkey hunting.
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Given the power capabilities of even 'powerful' PCP shotguns, and Tungsten being so much heavier, anemic PCP shotgun velocities would be abysmal with Tungsten loads. In my opinion, no matter how creative you are with shot size and weight, unless you're within about 20 yards of small game with an air shotgun you'll do more wounding than killing. Head/neck shots on turkey at 15-20 yards? Okay.
Waterfowl on the wing? FORGET IT!
BTW, a .410 is MAGNITUDES more powerful than any PCP shotgun (you'd carry afield).
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Waterfowl on the wing? FORGET IT!
BTW, a .410 is MAGNITUDES more powerful than any PCP shotgun (you'd carry afield).
.
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Learn to shoot. When I moved to SC I was lucky enough to meet a family that had organized dove shoots on their land, big barbeque/party the whole nine yards and I was invited for years. My first time there, I was positioned to the left of an old ancient man that wasn't much more than a stick figure and looked to be about 200 years old. He sat in a chair with a shade umbrella and his iced tea. Limit was 12 that year if I remember right. Over the course of several hours he stood up 12 times, fired his single shot 410, and limited out. I fired two boxes of shells and was one short of a limit at end of day. That old man walked past me when shooting was over, said "son, too much gun, get a 410 single shot and learn how to shoot, you don't need any more to dove hunt". I wasn't the slightest bit offended, we became friends over the few years he had left before passing. It was his land we were hunting on. Turns out I was being evaluated to see if I would ever be invited again, the placing next to him was no accident. He must have approved of me as I was invited until he passed.
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Excellent story karl! Beware of the old guy with just one gun, he very likely knows how to use it. I've moved on to a gas operated semi auto for 12 gauge, not age so much the neck surgery killed my recoil tolerance.
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Definitely, his whole family were some of the best wing shooters I've ever seen in my life. It was his grandson that invited me, he apparently got in some hot water for that. I had picked up his grandson a couple weeks earlier on the side of a dirt road broke down, I was out scouting for the coming deer season. We figured out what was wrong, I drove him to an auto parts place and back, and we fixed his truck. Except me, the only non-family there could trace back their families ties to the owner's family for generations. The opening day dove shoot there was a family tradition since sometime in the 1800's.
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I know airguns are getting more and more capable but this is a lane that just isn’t for an airgun.
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I have a PBBA Pro 20. 20 Gauge shotgun powered by compressed air. None of the above applies.
There is a channel on YouTube, Sparky’s Outdoors that has quite a bit of hunting, loading tips etc. Watch and you will change your mind about air powered shotguns.
I used mine last year to shoot mallards over decoys and jump shooting. 35 yards and they drop dead if you do your part. The gun is tuned from the factory to shoot 1.25 0z loads. I fill mine to 3400 PSI and get three usable shots.
As for Tungsten, the weight of it means nothing as far as the load is concerned. You will get a lower pellet count in your load but if you load 1.25 oz of lead or 1.25 oz of tungsten the velocity will be the same you just will have a less dense pattern but the shot will retain energy better down range.
I have not seen anything that compares to these guns for power, ease of loading and lethality. If there is something out there that is on par or better I would be interested.
for the guys who posted about their 28 gauge shotguns, I too am quite fond of my 28’s. Primarily what I hunt with for quail and pheasant. I abandoned my 12 gauges about 20 years ago.
There is a channel on YouTube, Sparky’s Outdoors that has quite a bit of hunting, loading tips etc. Watch and you will change your mind about air powered shotguns.
I used mine last year to shoot mallards over decoys and jump shooting. 35 yards and they drop dead if you do your part. The gun is tuned from the factory to shoot 1.25 0z loads. I fill mine to 3400 PSI and get three usable shots.
As for Tungsten, the weight of it means nothing as far as the load is concerned. You will get a lower pellet count in your load but if you load 1.25 oz of lead or 1.25 oz of tungsten the velocity will be the same you just will have a less dense pattern but the shot will retain energy better down range.
I have not seen anything that compares to these guns for power, ease of loading and lethality. If there is something out there that is on par or better I would be interested.
for the guys who posted about their 28 gauge shotguns, I too am quite fond of my 28’s. Primarily what I hunt with for quail and pheasant. I abandoned my 12 gauges about 20 years ago.
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Watching this thread. I’ve been doing my research and interested in pbba pro, serpent arms 28 gauge, or Zeus .72
Just researching which is most capable. I really want SA 28g to be capable of ethical kills at a distance because of the amount of shots it can manage.
I got a tundra swan tag. I have a .308 Texan lss and a bow, but both of those seem like a challenge. I’m wondering how any of these three would do with such a big bird.
Just researching which is most capable. I really want SA 28g to be capable of ethical kills at a distance because of the amount of shots it can manage.
I got a tundra swan tag. I have a .308 Texan lss and a bow, but both of those seem like a challenge. I’m wondering how any of these three would do with such a big bird.
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Where are you that a 308 Texan would be legal for swan? I've tagged several swans...didn't draw a tag this year
Getting one with a 308 Texan wouldn't be tough if you have a dog that can retrieve them. I've punched a couple tags via a very long crawl and jump shooting. A Texan would have been just as effective without getting them up.
However there's nothing quite like rolling one feet up on the wing over swan decoys.
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