I could agree with your theory , but only if the cheap gun displayed the exact same recoil and trigger pull / feel as your competition gun . otherwise you could just use a bar of steel the exact weight and balance as your competition gun .
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What cheap guns are actual bargains?
- Thread starter Sawney Bean
- Start date
I don't have a competition gun.
Nor would a bar of steel help develop trigger timing and offhand skills.
Thanks.
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@Bedrock Bob Sounds like your biggest reason for returns is the triggers breaking. There used to be an Ebay seller that made replacements in steel and always wondered why some enterprising member with the skills and equipment didn't try doing the same thing. Could make for a nice little sideline making hardened steel Quattro replacement triggers as long as they charged less than Hatsan wants for one of their cheap plated wonders .
Never had one break myself and I've owned or still do more than a few, the oldest now being 9 years old. Several of those are the way better looking Turk Built Webley Tomahawks. Nothing more than a prettier Model 95 but for the $100 AoA was selling them off for, they were a steal considering you got a Turkish Walnut Monte Carlo stock and a barrel already threaded for 1/2-20 UNF so you could put any moderator you might want on there.
Still made but now done in a plant in India and not by Hatsan.
To each his or her own, but I've never seen a reason to return a rifle I could easily fix myself and I own quite a few inexpensive rifles to go along with more than a few more expensive ones
Never had one break myself and I've owned or still do more than a few, the oldest now being 9 years old. Several of those are the way better looking Turk Built Webley Tomahawks. Nothing more than a prettier Model 95 but for the $100 AoA was selling them off for, they were a steal considering you got a Turkish Walnut Monte Carlo stock and a barrel already threaded for 1/2-20 UNF so you could put any moderator you might want on there.
Still made but now done in a plant in India and not by Hatsan.
To each his or her own, but I've never seen a reason to return a rifle I could easily fix myself and I own quite a few inexpensive rifles to go along with more than a few more expensive ones
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@Bedrock Bob Sounds like your biggest reason for returns is the triggers breaking. There used to be an Ebay seller that made replacements in steel and always wondered why some enterprising member with the skills and equipment didn't try doing the same thing. Could make for a nice little sideline making hardened steel Quattro replacement triggers as long as they charged less than Hatsan wants for one of their cheap plated wonders .
Never had one break myself and I've owned or still do more than a few, the oldest now being 9 years old. Several of those are the way better looking Turk Built Webley Tomahawks. Nothing more than a prettier Model 95 but for the $100 AoA was selling them off for, they were a steal considering you got a Turkish Walnut Monte Carlo stock and a barrel already threaded for 1/2-20 UNF so you could put any moderator you might want on there.
Still made but now done in a plant in India and not by Hatsan.
To each his or her own, but I've never seen a reason to return a rifle I could easily fix myself and I own quite a few inexpensive rifles to go along with more than a few more expensive ones
My reasoning for sending a broken rifle back is they fix it for free under warranty. That should be simple enough to understand.
If you can manufacture replacement triggers for $35 plus shipping then start a business. I won't buy one because Hatsan replaces mine for free. Others may feel differently. You may sell some.
Having shot so many rounds through so many Hatsans for so many years I think I'm safe in telling you that the triggers break. Part #109 has broken on EVERY ONE.
Your experience may be different. My guess is your shot count is nowhere near mine. But that is just a hunch. What isn't a hunch is the same broken trigger part in every rifle over and over again for several years running. I'm just calling them like I see them.
Some guys get a kick out of modification. If that's your gig then you can choose to work with any platform you want. I'm not trying to tell you to do anything differently. It is you that is taking exception to my choices. Ponder that for a while.
My motives are to improve my offhand shooting skills. I have a much different goal than tinkering with budget air rifles. I just shoot them. And when they break I send them back to be fixed under warranty. I don't think that concept is too difficult to understand.
If you see value in spending time and money fixing a broken Hatsan 95 thats still under warranty I salute you. I simply do not share your feelings.
They are great rifles and perform well for a budget training gun or a plinker. Thats what they were designed for and they fill that niche magnificently.
Trying to make a hotrod out of a Ford Pinto is just not my thing. I'll just use my harem of hatsans to develop my shooting skills and when the warranty is up I'll buy another. If I need accuracy I'll shoot my Diana's or HW's. For every job there is a proper tool. And using a screwdriver for a hammer has never worked for me.
Please give it a rest. This thread has gotten way off topic and I don't care to debate. If my experience and knowledge causes anyone distress I'm sorry. I just commented on my favorite budget rifle and it turned into some sort of pissing match. None of that is going to make a Hatsan trigger last longer nor will it make me spend time and money trying to fix a $129 rifle that I can get fixed for free.
You guys go on with your day and please forget that I tried to offer my opinions. I'm sure your vast experience and knowledge on the subject is so far above mine that my comments are of little concern.
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Whats wrong with a 302 in a Pinto!
I agree on your philosophy reguarding spending a lot of time and money, modifying a inexpensive gun.
At some point, it quickly, it becomes a money-loseing hobby, "money pit", and not whorthwhile.
A brand new,
Thats fine too, as long as one realizes ahead of time, that very quickly, they will end up with a $600 Notos, and it may become difficult to ever recoup the $$$.
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Bingo.
No amount of tinkering is going to make a Hatsan 95 shoot like an HW97k.
If you want a tack driver buy one. Hell buy two. I did.
If you need to shoot 100k offhand shots a year buy an inexpensive gun with a good warranty and shoot the crap out of it. If you like it and it served you well then buy another. I did. Nine times. That's how impressed I am with the Hatsan 95. It's the best darn thing since 50 cent tacos.
But just like a 50 cent taco the stuff inside is not high quality. If you are eating them by the dozen it matters very little.
It cost me $1500 bucks and thousands of hours to learn to shoot offhand like an ace. It takes pooploads of practice. I did it shooting a Hatsan 95 because I figured it was the cheapest way to my goal. After over 600,000 shots I can tell you that the Hatsans did a fine job and they are just awesome.
But with that experience I also learned their weak spots. It's a tough pill for some guys to swallow I guess. But that's just life in the big city.
I'm going to try a Norica Dragon. They are about the same price range and I hear they are pretty solid. I like the Hatsan trigger better even if they do break. But I intend to take a Norica out and brutalize it pretty soon. See what it's made of. Maybe it will equal a Hatsan. That's going to be hard to do for $160.
I have my longest lasting Hatsan ever in the repair shop now getting the TRIGGER REPLACED FOR THE THIRD TIME IN A YEAR. It will be out of warranty at the end of August. I refinished the stock (mod 65 thumbhole) for its big birthday and hope it lasts through the holidays. When it's gassed out I'm going to try the Norica for a while.
I keep 2 Hatsan 95's going at all times. Both in mod 65 thumbhole stocks. I just drop a new rifle in the stocks when they are shot out. I rotate them to spread out the work. It has worked well for me. And I'm never without an offhand gun even if I have problems. One is only a few months old but is nearing the point I'll need a new trigger. The one in repair now is a sweet shooter and should have a bunch of shots left on it when I get it back. So I'll be fixed up good for a few more months.
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Thank you very much. Guys like you are why I post. If a few guys can learn from my experiences it offsets the clamor of those who try to dispute it.
The Hatsans are a jewel for the price you pay. So don't mind the trigger. Just file off a little metal under the first stage screw and shoot the hell out of it. It's as much "bang for your buck" as you can buy in that price range. If the trigger breaks out of warranty just get a new one for $35 and slap it in there. It does not even require tools. You can push out the pins and have a new trigger in there in 3 minutes. It's a simple system that is easily repaired if you feel it is worth it. Your shot count will probably be much lower than mine so things will last longer. The rifle may still be worth repairing after a year. Mine are wasted in 4-6 months so it's not a fair comparison.
I'll break 2-3 triggers and replace 1 spring and seal in a year. So if your trigger breaks you are at half life. I get 20-25k shots a year on each gun. So expect 6-8k shots on a trigger and 10 on a spring and seal. Your mileage may vary but it's a pretty good estimate.
If it's your only gun and you enjoy shooting it by all means rebuild it! There is a lot of pride and satisfaction to be had there. The experience will help your shooting skills. And a Hatsan will last forever if you keep fixing it. My strategy is based off my shooting schedule which is probably different from yours. So have confidence that your Hatsan is a great value despite my bucket of broken triggers.
Call or email Hatsan. Speak to Kadden or Shane. Have the proper schematic downloaded and they will quote a price for any needed parts. Service is great and they turn around pretty quickly. So send it in and they will take care of you even if the gun is out of warranty. Their labor is reasonable even if you have to pay.
Shipping is the part that makes repair not worth the trouble. It's 65 bucks to ship them to Arkansas from New Mexico. You may be closer and it may be more reasonable. That changes everything. Warranty repairs get a shipping label. Otherwise you pay.
Still, a new gun is very reasonable. So even if you replace the entire gun they are worth it. You just can't go wrong either way you do it.
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He says it is NOT THE BLADE, BUT THE “middle sear ,pat#109, I’m amazed as it looks like hardened steel.. maybe bad tempering.. my Tommy might be like yours early batch with different run. Latter maybe sketchy.. either way ,they make a good garage gun or don’t care if it gets a few dings gun.. mine is much better at 12 to 13 ft lbs in .177 than anything higher. Has a distinct metal pi sound like no other gun but has no buzz or felt vibration. I do have a longer steel guide and cup seal I made@Bedrock Bob Sounds like your biggest reason for returns is the triggers breaking. There used to be an Ebay seller that made replacements in steel and always wondered why some enterprising member with the skills and equipment didn't try doing the same thing. Could make for a nice little sideline making hardened steel Quattro replacement triggers as long as they charged less than Hatsan wants for one of their cheap plated wonders .
Never had one break myself and I've owned or still do more than a few, the oldest now being 9 years old. Several of those are the way better looking Turk Built Webley Tomahawks. Nothing more than a prettier Model 95 but for the $100 AoA was selling them off for, they were a steal considering you got a Turkish Walnut Monte Carlo stock and a barrel already threaded for 1/2-20 UNF so you could put any moderator you might want on there.
Still made but now done in a plant in India and not by Hatsan.
To each his or her own, but I've never seen a reason to return a rifle I could easily fix myself and I own quite a few inexpensive rifles to go along with more than a few more expensive ones
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In my experience a pre-owned Air Arms S510 Carbine and a Daystate Air Wolf and Huntsman Regal, at half price or less of new, are some of the best values I have encountered. As for "Brand New," my BSA R10 for under $900 competes with new walnut and steel rifles costing double that. I have also had great success with a pre-owned BSA Scorpion T10 and a BSA Defiant
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All of the parts in the trigger are die cast. Part #109 has a thin cast loop. That's what breaks off.
Here is a picture of a broken one.
It's not magnetic.
Here is a photo of the broken loop and sear surface. As you can see it's thin as hell around the pin and soft on the sear surface. All the internals are non magnetic die cast metal.
I found the broken loop in my junk box and put it back together. The complete part looks like this...
FWIW I have replaced the exact same part in a T06 trigger on my Diana 34. I have been told this is a "high stress part" by a very knowledgeable airgunsmith. The triggers are very different but the same general design.
It broke the same part at about 30k shots. And it also broke the spring that puts thrust on that part 10k shots later. The Diana parts are hardened steel and they lasted much longer. But it runs parallel to the Hatsan failure.
I bet when a Rekord breaks its the same darn thing. I haven't had one fail yet but it's bound to happen someday. If you put enough shots through one sh!t is going to break.
.....
You don't need longer screws to get the Quattro to adjust. Just file down this surface so the factory screw goes down .005 further. On most of my guns only the first stage screw needs to go down. A dozen good strokes with a file and the factory screw works fine. Some of those screws have a chamfered neck. I just use a 1/4" drill bit to chamfer the threaded bore in the trigger. The original screw will be plenty long when it seats in the chamfer. No need to get longer screws and shorten them.
The Allen wrench points to the surface you need to file. The feel of the trigger is great when you take a little more first stage out. The second stage screw is meaningless unless you want to shorten travel. As long as the first stage sets the sears on the edge the second stage screw will follow nicely. I just run the second stage screw down tight and file under the first stage until the trigger is perfect. That way you can wrench them both down tight and they never move.
Please keep in mind that I am just a baby in the woods. I know very little about the subjects i post on. I learned it all on the internet and have no real experience. I need some of you guys to tell me how this stuff really works.
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i had a hatsan break barrel that had a plastic trigger housing and the cylinder was a soft steel that flexed when charging the gun. gun was not accurate was falling apart after only having it for 2 months. the hammer would not hold securely and even prematurely fired after locking the barrel forward. it put a hole in my wall next to my window. i contacted hatsan and hatsan usa did not respond to any of my emails. i learned my lesson. i do not buy hatsan. hatsan sucks.
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Model?? Not aware of a Hatsan with plastic trigger housing and have been working on their springers for years. Unless it was a PCP have no idea about them.
Sorry you had a bad experience with them. I haven't.
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A few years back they were really inexpensive, I got several of the 747's rebuilt at least 4 for myself, my son and grandson and got 3 of the full target models the 777. Put new seals and oil wiper throughout all of them.
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horrible experience with hatsan usa. this gun is dangerous
Hatsan USA if you’re in here.. you did me wrong and could have possibly hurt someone i love. you should remove this gun from your inventory
Hatsan USA if you’re in here.. you did me wrong and could have possibly hurt someone i love. you should remove this gun from your inventory
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I will always love my little daisy 880. No optics, just iron sights. Always accurate for me. I can shoot a hole in a hole with it from the time I pick it up to the time I put it down.
reliable, accurate, low maintenance, and just so much fun to pull out when others are playing with their expensive rifles and i pull out that toy, then outshoot them (not at distance obviously).
Imany squirrels, rabbits and chipmunks have met their demise from my daisy 880!
reliable, accurate, low maintenance, and just so much fun to pull out when others are playing with their expensive rifles and i pull out that toy, then outshoot them (not at distance obviously).
Imany squirrels, rabbits and chipmunks have met their demise from my daisy 880!
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