What's the fascination with "slugs"?

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Triggernosis said:
Forgive my ignorance, but I'm just wondering why so many folks discuss shooting/tuning slugs. What's the appeal over plain-ol' pellets?
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I shoot FX Hybrid Slugs out of my Maverick .30 cal, and they carry 85 fpe at the muzzle and 60 fpe at 100 yards. Instead JSB Hades has 85 fpe at the muzzle, but only 30 fpe at 100 yards.

Much better Ballistic Coefficient is why slugs beat pellets for downrange power every time!

Accuracy is sub MOA with the FX Hybrid Slugs.


 
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Haven’t found any factory produced slugs shot from factory produced barrels to be even close to comparable to pellets at 25 or 50y in the accuracy category….although they are more wind resistant. If you shoot a better score at 50y with them….it’s because you traded accuracy for wind resistance. As the distance increases….the slugs begin to shine brighter….not because they begin to be accurate, but because the wind resistance becomes more important very quickly.

Why don’t guys shoot consistently good groups at 100y with slugs? Because they aren’t that accurate compared to pellets.

Why don’t guys shoot consistently good groups at 100y with pellets? Because the aren’t that wind resistant compared to slugs.

When the major producers figure out how to make slugs accurate ….there will no longer be much to argue over in the slug vs pellet debate.

Mike
 
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thomasair said:
Haven’t found any factory produced slugs shot from factory produced barrels to be even close to comparable to pellets at 25 or 50y in the accuracy category….although they are more wind resistant. If you shoot a better score at 50y with them….it’s because you traded accuracy for wind resistance. As the distance increases….the slugs begin to shine brighter….not because they begin to be accurate, but because the wind resistance becomes more important very quickly.

Why don’t guys shoot consistently good groups at 100y with slugs? Because they aren’t that accurate compared to pellets.

Why don’t guys shoot consistently good groups at 100y with pellets? Because the aren’t that wind resistant compared to slugs.

When the major producers figure out how to make slugs accurate ….there will no longer be much to argue over in the slug vs pellet debate.

Mike
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Oh no, sir.
I am a big fan of Zan slugs because they outperform my JSB pellets at distances of 30 yards, 50 yards, 100 yards and 125 yards routinely. I have not shot the Zan slugs at any greater distance than 125 yards due to the lack of facilities.

I was once quite impressed with my FX Impacts whenever I was lucky enough to produce the occasional MOA group at 100 yards. No more! Shooting Zan slugs from my Impacts in .22 cal, .25 cal and .30 cal, I'm getting MOA and sub-MOA 5 shot groups more than half the time when the wind is not really strong.
Have you tried the Zan slugs?
 
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I’m speaking in terms of Benchrest scores at 50y. Shooting BR cards is not like shooting groups. I’ve tried everything that can be bought.

Shoot 3 N50 cards at 50y with the slugs if you can. Haven’t seen a competitive factory slug gun/slug combo yet. I hear they are out there….just don’t see them.

If you can get into the low to mid 740s for 3 cards in light to medium wind…that would be competitive with pellets. I think the top pellet score is 748 right now. I don’t think anyone has broke 730 with slugs in sportsman yet.
Mike
 
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Here is a printable 8 1/2 x 11 practice version of the N50 target if you want to try it. It’s fun…but a lot harder than most recognize at first.

If a slug with superior wind resistance was actually equally accurate at 50y they would consistently produce scores higher than pellets. Factory guns and slugs have yet to even come close to matching pellet scores.

Mike

View attachment SmallSample1.pdf
 
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Have to agree with @thomasair that no factory slug/barrel combo can outshoot pellets in terms of consistency as of right now, kinda close but not close depending on the measuring standard.. As great as FX slug barrels are they still have too much choke and compromise on shooting pellets and still too slow on twist rate than true bullet/slug barrels.

Mike obviously shot more slugs than 99.9% of us so he knows! Even in rimfire world to get to BR accuracy Mike is after is far from trivial! Then again no 22LR BR person I know shot out of box factory barrels with out some sort of modifications, maybe the guy spent 5k on a vudoo 360. So to be fair no factory barrel slug combo will ever satisfy accuracy standards of Thomas air…….in fact I doubt any factory barrel/pellet combo can satisfy Mike’s standard either. 🤣🤣🤣


Edit: To put things in perspective an absolute sh!t group that Mike would shake his head in disgust is something I would jump in joy for.😅
 
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thomasair said:
I’m speaking in terms of Benchrest scores at 50y. Shooting BR cards is not like shooting groups. I’ve tried everything that can be bought.

Shoot 3 N50 cards at 50y with the slugs if you can. Haven’t seen a competitive factory slug gun/slug combo yet. I hear they are out there….just don’t see them.

If you can get into the low to mid 740s for 3 cards in light to medium wind…that would be competitive with pellets. I think the top pellet score is 748 right now. I don’t think anyone has broke 730 with slugs in sportsman yet.
Mike
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From your initial post to this thread: "...Why don’t guys shoot consistently good groups at 100y with slugs? Because they aren’t that accurate compared to pellets.

Why don’t guys shoot consistently good groups at 100y with pellets? Because the aren’t that wind resistant compared to slugs..."
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😲?
I don't shoot in formal competition, I'm a mere retired healthcare worker. Undoubtedly, I lack the credentials and standing to debate an established airgun competitor and manufacturer.
Since my retirement in 2015, I've shot millions of rounds of lead from my collection of airguns. I've shot both pellets and slugs. I can tell you that prior to my introduction to Zan slugs -- this after testing the range of domestically produced slugs -- I, too, had just about resigned myself to the fact that pellets would outperform slugs at distances from 15 - 75+ yards.
This all changed once I tried the Zan slugs. Here, I will relate to you my personal experience at the rifle range: As I stated in prior post, at 25, 50, 75, 100 and 125 yards, shooting 5-shot groups, the Zan slugs in .22 cal, .25 cal, and .30 cal outperformed the JSB pellets (the most accurate pellets I've found). The gap between the slugs and the pellets only widened -- in favor of the slugs -- as the distance increased.
I cannot comprehend how the use of the n50 BR card at 100 yards can alter the outcome I've described above, but I will not attempt to debate it, since I have not tested it.
I will continue to visit the shooting range at least twice per week, when possible, enjoying my retirement with my airguns. And I will continue to use exclusively, the Zan slugs on pest critters that invade my domain -- because they excel.
 
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Credentials or things like that are meaningless for real comparison. Forget about N50…..go to this thread and shoot some of these 30y cards with your slug gun. If your slugs are as accurate as pellets, it will be plainly obvious.

30-Yard Challenge

Getting tired of shooting groups? Try this game out. You shoot all 24 bulls once at 30 yards. Next, eliminate your two lowest pairs. Then, add up your score, with a Max of 200. My best target using my Vet Long is below, as is the target I used. It would be a really great shooter who could get a...
www.airgunnation.com www.airgunnation.com

Mike
 
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bamavet55 said:
Is there a 125 yard challenge? That might be more of "challenge".
How did your pellet gun do in the 30 yard challenge? Just asking.😉
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The 30 yard challenge is a lot harder than it looks, try it! It's actually a lot of fun and will hone your skills for 100 yards and beyond. I'm on the list, and I think thomasair is on top. He's been doing this kind of stuff for a long while now so I almost expect him to be.

Allen
 
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Healthservices said:
The 30 yard challenge is a lot harder than it looks, try it! It's actually a lot of fun and will hone your skills for 100 yards and beyond. I'm on the list, and I think thomasair is on top. He's been doing this kind of stuff for a long while now so I almost expect him to be.

Allen
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I shoot strictly for fun. It relaxes me. I really have no desire to complicate my hobby by competing -- other than with myself -- in any fashion. In fact, I never once went to the 30 yard challenge thread until just now, when Thomasair linked to it.
FYI: I do not own any "slug gun". I do have a small collection of airguns; far too many, according to my better-half.
 
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Slugs appear to be as accurate as pellets at long distances…..but they really are not. They simply do not deteriorate in the wind like pellets do. You have traded accuracy for wind resistance. Shooting at 100y or longer is a combination of gun accuracy and wind drift. Despite pellets being more accurate….their superiority begins losing ground to wind resistance. If slugs are more accurate at 100 plus….they will be more accurate at 30y. They are not, though. This seems hard for many to grasp.

Mike
 
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bamavet55 said:
I shoot strictly for fun. It relaxes me. I really have no desire to complicate my hobby by competing -- other than with myself -- in any fashion. In fact, I never once went to the 30 yard challenge thread until just now, when Thomasair linked to it.
FYI: I do not own any "slug gun". I do have a small collection of airguns; far too many, according to my better-half.
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I don't compete either. It's for fun. It builds your skills. It's one thing to have your gun be able to shoot the bulls eye out, it's totally a different thing to be able to do it at least 20 out of 22 times. Realistically when you start doing it, if your gun is up to the task, it's all down to you against yourself.

Again try it, it will change up your routine and you may have fun as well. I just did a 6 hour drive one way to try something different. I went hunting for squirrels and rabbits at a paintball park. It was different, fun. I was not as good as I thought I was, that's for sure!

Allen
 
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bamavet55 said:
Oh no, sir.
I am a big fan of Zan slugs because they outperform my JSB pellets at distances of 30 yards, 50 yards, 100 yards and 125 yards routinely. I have not shot the Zan slugs at any greater distance than 125 yards due to the lack of facilities.

I was once quite impressed with my FX Impacts whenever I was lucky enough to produce the occasional MOA group at 100 yards. No more! Shooting Zan slugs from my Impacts in .22 cal, .25 cal and .30 cal, I'm getting MOA and sub-MOA 5 shot groups more than half the time when the wind is not really strong.
Have you tried the Zan slugs?
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Hey Bamavet55,
I've been shooting Zan 23 grain (.217) slugs in my RAW HM1000xLRT now for about a week. I initially tried them at 50 yards, comparing them to JSB 18.1 and NSA 23 slugs. JSB 18.1 grains were used as a reference because my gun shoots them best. My results showed the JSB's were a little more consistent vs. the Zan's however the NSA's weren't even close.

Recently, shooting at 100 yards, the Zan slugs perform better than JSB's, with at least 50% of my (5) shot groups at 1 MOA or better.
Zan is easily the best slug I've tried so far - I just ordered another 1,000 in 23 grain & 400 in 25.5 grain - all .217.

As far as comparing Pellets vs. Slugs, I don't know of anyone who is more informed (and done ALL the work) than Mike N. at Thomas Air.
 
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thomasair said:
Slugs appear to be as accurate as pellets at long distances…..but they really are not. They simply do not deteriorate in the wind like pellets do. You have traded accuracy for wind resistance. Shooting at 100y or longer is a combination of gun accuracy and wind drift. Despite pellets being more accurate….their superiority begins losing ground to wind resistance. If slugs are more accurate at 100 plus….they will be more accurate at 30y. They are not, though. This seems hard for many to grasp.

Mike
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Mike

You have to excuse us because many of us have a difficult time grasp the level of accuracy you are talking about. Might be help full post couple of pictures of your cards or even better a picture of your bad group. Your accuracy is measured in 1/8 of an inch or less while many of us are happy the pellet/slug holes are touching.


While I admire your skills but I’d rather be practicing kungfu than try to be anywhere near as accurate as you!
7AE5BF6D-1CED-48EE-BE5E-36DDFC913B08.gif
 
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