Other Zoraki/webley alecto

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Rayan51

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Aug 25, 2024
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Good afternoon! I have two questions about the Zoraki/webley pistol. For those who have the light version and also the ultra, what is the real difference between the two besides the longer barrel? as the Light can also go up to 4 pumps just by turning the valve. Because, superficially, they appear to be the same pistol.
And the other question, is there any other weapon with a zoraki-compatible barrel, preferably longer?
 
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I have the Ultra, The end part you can take off, Just makes it lot louder ,, If I remember right there is not much difference between the 3ed and 4th pump
Yea, there was something about taking the gun apart and turning something for full power, I didn't do it.
I did take my safety off, Stupidest safety I have ever seen on a pistol, With my fat fingers I pulled the trigger while taking the safety off,, I fixed that,,
Mike
 
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Haven't owned the ultra, but own a mk1 light version and have rebuilt/ used it in standard form and also with a 300mm HW barrel (in 4.5mm).

I believe they beefed up/ and or improved the casting on the valve block on later models as there were reports of them cracking on the mk1's.

In terms of the 3 pump/ 4 pump differences.....this is just a theory, but if they changed anything I'd suspect it was increasing the plenum volume by reducing the valve spring dimensions. In my mk1 light the spring almost entirely fills the plenum-

Screenshot_20240829_211337_Gallery.jpg


They didn't change the swept volume in the pump, and as my mk1 with longer barrels tops out close to 8.5fpe for 3 pumps (remember it's a 4.5mm too) it suggests the increase in the ultra over the light comes from the barrel length, rather than the extra pump.

Whilst doable, you'd have to be very 'mechanically unsympathetic' to try and put 4 pumps into the light version, and the only way I can see that you could achieve it sensibly, would be to reduce the pump volume, or increase the plenum volume ....

Screenshot_20240713_121920_Gallery.jpg


As above though.....just a theory 👍
 
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That's what I've read (just like you can from Google searching !).
The standard version, you should stop at three pumps. The Ultra, you "can" go to four pumps. So there must be something going on inside of the gun somewhere.
The only thing that I've done to mine is remove the "palm shelf", so I room for my hand !! I added a red dot sight. Not a bad shooting gun.

It's not much more than a toy, so I haven't paid any mind to the FPS, the shot to shot fps spread. Got the sight adjusted, and put some pellets through it.

Mike
 
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let get something clear here, there is no one is going to pump these pistols 4 time often or ever most of us use 2 pumps and enjoy ourselves
i know of no difference in the short barrel and Ultra and have never read anyone calling the short barrel pistol the light version till today
there is a company in France that sell ultra barrels and Chambers in the UK has them listed from time to time
i have 5 Alecto's and have had them for many years
 
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Have to agree with you Mkevv, with It's plastic construction and bulk, it does feel a bit toy like, but the design is really quite clever.

The step down to 10mm on the second stage pump has a big impact on reducing pumping effort, and the direct to bore valve makes it a very efficient pistol to boot. Alot of thought has gone in to the Alecto, just a shame the service support wasn't there from webley/ Zoraki for the U cup seals they used in it (replaced all but the 2nd stage pump cup in mine with O rings).
 
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marflow 777 said:
let get something clear here, there is no one is going to pump these pistols 4 time often or ever most of us use 2 pumps and enjoy ourselves
i know of no difference in the short barrel and Ultra and have never read anyone calling the short barrel pistol the light version till today
there is a company in France that sell ultra barrels and Chambers in the UK has them listed from time to time
i have 5 Alecto's and have had them for many years
Click to expand...

I believe there must be some difference in volume between the standard and ultra Mike, based on the data below posted by a fella on the GTA detailing the output differences going to a 14.5" LW barrel-

Screenshot_20240830_061741_Gallery.jpg


His max outut results mirror mine after I turned up a longer barrel, except for the fact his takes 4 pumps to make 8+ fpe and mine only requires 3. The only way I can see this being possible (keeping manufacturering changes sensible) is if zoraki shortened the second stage pump rod (increasing head space at final stage) or increased plenum volume to reduce final pressure.

If this isnt the case, I'd love for someone to explain how adding the volume/ pressure of the 4th pump (regardless of effort) doesn't increase output.....

EDIT.....his results were at 7000' which is some pretty thin air. This might go some way to explaining it as my results are closer to sea level 🤔
 
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what you see is the barrel change
if the power that is given or product is more than the length of the barrel can use then the extra is wasted
you see this in CO2 pistols all the time
the short barrel to the Ultra might be just a 1and some i would have to measure it but that is enough to increase the FPS but you go up to
A short barrel is 180mm+ or 7.125 inches
a ultra barrel is 256mm or 10.125 inches
now the LW barrel is twice as long as the short barrel and 4 inches longer than the ultra
now seeing that this was posted by someone at 7000' i would say the post was from Wyoman, Gary from Wyoming
so, you are looking at 13FPS per inch of added barrel length, CO2 could do that
now Gary know his stuff when it comes to Custom pistols
i think the bottom line is the Alecto make more air than a 7.125 barrel can use
the Alecto has a real crack to it when fired
it any case there were no light Alecto's ever mentioned it is something new i have new Alecto's that date back to 2014 i have been at this awhile
 
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I have a Zoraki HP01-02 with the improved trigger in .22 and just ordered a regular .177 (yes, they call it light). I'm trying to find someone who machine a HW barrel to give the .22 a bit more velocity but it's true that a short distance one pump is enough. I screwed the restrictor once all the way to get that extra power but one day the gun didn't shoot, i closed it all the way but the trigger wasn't releasing the shot. Tried opening, closing... nothing. And not a good idea, after a couple of times the gun "blew up" meaning the pump cracked in my hands. Now i think they seal the part and it's harder to modify but never tried again.
 
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marflow 777 said:
what you see is the barrel change
if the power that is given or product is more than the length of the barrel can use then the extra is wasted
you see this in CO2 pistols all the time
the short barrel to the Ultra might be just a 1and some i would have to measure it but that is enough to increase the FPS but you go up to
A short barrel is 180mm+ or 7.125 inches
a ultra barrel is 256mm or 10.125 inches
now the LW barrel is twice as long as the short barrel and 4 inches longer than the ultra
now seeing that this was posted by someone at 7000' i would say the post was from Wyoman, Gary from Wyoming
so, you are looking at 13FPS per inch of added barrel length, CO2 could do that
now Gary know his stuff when it comes to Custom pistols
i think the bottom line is the Alecto make more air than a 7.125 barrel can use
the Alecto has a real crack to it when fired
it any case there were no light Alecto's ever mentioned it is something new i have new Alecto's that date back to 2014 i have been at this awhile
Click to expand...

Yes, I understand increasing barrel length will increase fps Mike (providing any give action is producing enough energy, which is generally a given with total loss valves) that's why I turned up the longer barrel for mine....so I could make the UK limit on 2 pumps instead of 3. As it happens I had to back off the pressure relief valve so it activated around 3/4 in to the 2nd pump to keep things legal.

I think it may be more pertinent to compare Gary's 1 pump results against my own (rather than max output). My Alecto hits 3.2fpe with RS and 3.5fpe with 8.4's, with my barrel being 2.5" shorter than his. That's an additional 30% odd for 1 pump. Before adjusting the pressure relief valve, mine hit 6.4fpe for 2 pumps.

Atmospheric pressure is only around 1psi different from his location to mine (according to google), so either the pellets are shedding 30% of their velocity in his extra 2.5" of barrel, or my action has to be producing additional pressure per pump.
 
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